Author Topic: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion  (Read 293566 times)

Offline wally_games

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #200 on: April 04, 2012, 08:32:17 PM »
Thanks- I was going to mention that option, too and forgot.

Also, I know it was mentioned before, sorta, but, if the configuration is "too strong" and transmitted too much shock/energy, couldn't that cause SEVERE damage to the engine block where it is mounted?  I mean, yes we want to protect the fairings and mirrors, but think of what could happen in a higher energy impact with no fairings and other stuff to absorb the energy.

So much to consider.

That's why I mentioned it. Low speed or garage drop, just the horizontal bar "should" be enough. Higher speed you're going to tear up a lot of stuff anyway, so why be so worried about the lower fairing. At higher speed you're going to have the bags, mirrors, etc all dragging anyway.

I know, I know. I'm all over the place with this!
'14 BMW 1200 GSw (red, what little there is that's not grey)
'11 Concours ABS (black) w/ Leo Vince carbon, heated Corbin, Garmin; TechSpec pads (gone but not forgotten)
'05 Yamaha FZ6, only crashed once, gone in trade; '87 Honda Gold Wing Aspencade, sold; '85 Honda Magna (700), sold; '76 Kawasaki KZ400, sold

Offline 4cedars

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #201 on: April 04, 2012, 08:34:26 PM »
If you want to be picky about aesthetics, hard bags and top cases don't belong on a sporty type bike either. The Connie is not just a sporty bike, it's also a touring bike, hence the hard bags and top cases. After 400 miles it's nice to have an alternate place to put your feet. The main reason I wanted fold-aways like the ones on the beemer is because then you can maintain the aesthetics when you don't need them. To each his own...

I agree 100%

I find it extremely difficult to ride form fuel stop to fuel stop for 4 hours straight with your feet/legs in 1 position for 24 hours straight. Because that's what it takes to pull off a BBG or any of the other "extreme" rides of the IBA.

Some see this bike as a "sport bike" with bags and - a driveshaft - and an electric windshield - and heated grips - and a glove box - and taller handle bars - and.........................

I see this bike and have it set up as the ultimate long distance/touring bike. Complete with 3 gps units, spot satellite tracker, aux fuel tank, rostra cruise control, handle bar risers and wedges, taller windshield and you guessed it - HIGHWAY PEGS (blasphomy) to stretch out my legs on.

So much for that "sport bike" :o

John 
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Offline RyanMCEnterprises

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #202 on: April 04, 2012, 09:18:25 PM »
It seems I hit a nerve with the highway peg issue and I apologize if I pissed anyone off. That definitely was not my intention! When I say it's a "sporty" type of touring bike,  though, I mean the inherent riding position Kawasaki intended the rider to be in while riding the bike. Putting your feet up while your body is in this position would cramp your knees just as much as keeping your feet on the pegs, depending on where the pegs were located, unless the bars were way out wide. I don't really want to get into a massive debate about it because there can be no winner and I don't want to offend or **** anyone off. It's all preference here, really. I'm not bashing the idea of highway pegs for this bike and I sincerely hope you guys don't take it that way! I understand people like to stretch out their legs on long rides and I appreciate all ideas and design concepts. I just think built-in highway pegs would add too much cost to the bar while taking away from the aesthetics merely to appease a relatively small niche of riders. For those of you who like highway pegs, clamp-ons should do just fine. That way, you can even remove them if you don't happen to be going on some 8 hour adventure.

I've gone into quite a bit of detail on why we can't remove the rear horizontal bar but if you have some specific questions regarding it I'd be happy to answer them. It's a matter of where the bike hits the ground in a tip over (regardless of speed) as well as a strength issue. The fact of the matter is, without that rear horizontal bar, the farther-back, lower part of the fairing is going to get hit which would make any protection the vertical bar alone can offer obsolete. Maybe it'd help you guys picture what I'm saying if I can get some photos of the bike tilted over a bit? We can play with some ideas on how to alter the rear bar but unfortunately it has to stay.  :-\

Also, regarding the issue of the shock affecting the engine mounting points. This is another reason for a 3-point cage. The more points of contact with the bike, the more the shock is distributed. That's the main issue people have with single-point frame sliders. In harder spills they tend to bend the mounting point because all the shock is hitting one single point. However, we've never had an issue with this on our other bars so I don't expect it to be much of an issue with these either.
MC Enterprises has been manufacturing quality motorcycle products for nearly 45 years! Visit us online at www.MCEnterprises.com!

Son of Pappy

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #203 on: April 04, 2012, 09:36:12 PM »
Ryan, feeling like ya opened Pandoras box yet?  At the estimated price I see you selling many sets and that you have taken the time to explore our many ideas and requests will set well with this crowd, with or without an option of pegs, although chrome may be pushing things a bit much ;D  Simple and sturdy without looking like a bathroom fixture is my vote and of course, a set for the gen 1 C14s :)

Offline maxtog

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #204 on: April 04, 2012, 09:45:56 PM »
I've gone into quite a bit of detail on why we can't remove the rear horizontal bar but if you have some specific questions regarding it I'd be happy to answer them.

Fair enough...

Quote
Also, regarding the issue of the shock affecting the engine mounting points. This is another reason for a 3-point cage. The more points of contact with the bike, the more the shock is distributed.

Would that be the reason for not having just a horizontal bar?  Top Block felt that a single horizontal would work... not saying they are the design goal or that they have some holy-grail insight.  Really, just discussing. 

You need to address my other pretty pictures, too :)
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline ZG

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #205 on: April 04, 2012, 09:46:02 PM »
although chrome may be pushing things a bit much ;D   

+1....  :doublepuke:
 
 
Sorry Max...  ;)

Offline ZG

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #206 on: April 04, 2012, 09:47:37 PM »
Top Block felt that a single horizontal would work... not saying they are the design goal or that they have some holy-grail insight.

 :-X

Offline wally_games

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #207 on: April 04, 2012, 09:54:22 PM »
I see this bike and have it set up as the ultimate long distance/touring bike. Complete with 3 gps units, spot satellite tracker, aux fuel tank, rostra cruise control, handle bar risers and wedges, taller windshield and you guessed it - HIGHWAY PEGS (blasphomy) to stretch out my legs on.

I own a 2011 C14 and love it a lot, but to me an "ultimate long distance/touring bike" this isn't. That's a Goldwing (and I have owned one in the past) or BMW equivalent. The C14's hand-numbing grips take the "ultimate" part out of the equation for me.

I have done a good number of multi-hundred mile days on my C14 in spite of the hand issues.

Hey, Ryan. Thanks for all you've done to include actual C14 riders in your design process. Great job.
'14 BMW 1200 GSw (red, what little there is that's not grey)
'11 Concours ABS (black) w/ Leo Vince carbon, heated Corbin, Garmin; TechSpec pads (gone but not forgotten)
'05 Yamaha FZ6, only crashed once, gone in trade; '87 Honda Gold Wing Aspencade, sold; '85 Honda Magna (700), sold; '76 Kawasaki KZ400, sold

Offline ZG

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #208 on: April 04, 2012, 09:57:27 PM »
Hey, Ryan. Thanks for all you've done to include actual C14 riders in your design process. Great job.

+1...  :thumbs: :goodpost:

Offline maxtog

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #209 on: April 04, 2012, 10:04:41 PM »

+1....  :doublepuke:
 
 
Sorry Max...  ;)

Hey- you know those chrome rear McE's look pretty damn good on my silver bike.  Admit it....
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline ZG

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #210 on: April 04, 2012, 10:13:38 PM »
Hey- you know those chrome rear McE's look pretty damn good on my silver bike.  Admit it....

 :-X
 
You can't make me Max...  ;D

Son of Pappy

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #211 on: April 04, 2012, 10:20:16 PM »
Hey- you know those chrome rear McE's look pretty damn good on my silver bike.  Admit it....
Maybe on a slower silver bike, but never on a Silverdammit bike 8)

Offline RyanMCEnterprises

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #212 on: April 04, 2012, 10:30:06 PM »
Ryan, feeling like ya opened Pandoras box yet?  At the estimated price I see you selling many sets and that you have taken the time to explore our many ideas and requests will set well with this crowd, with or without an option of pegs, although chrome may be pushing things a bit much ;D  Simple and sturdy without looking like a bathroom fixture is my vote and of course, a set for the gen 1 C14s :)

hahahaha, just a bit! I wasn't really expecting that type of response regarding the highway pegs but now I'm aware it's a bit of a touchy subject! Thank you, though! I sure hope we sell a bunch too!

Fair enough...

Would that be the reason for not having just a horizontal bar?  Top Block felt that a single horizontal would work... not saying they are the design goal or that they have some holy-grail insight.  Really, just discussing. 

You need to address my other pretty pictures, too :)

Oh, wow, I'm really sorry Max! At first read I thought you meant remove the horizontal bar and leave only the vertical, which is what I've gone into detail about. I didn't realize you were talking about the opposite of that! I think I need sleep! Hahahaha.

I don't think we've discussed using only the horizontal bar now that we've determined it's necessary, though. Now that I reread your post again I get what you're saying and removing the vertical bar while leaving the horizontal bar may actually work well. Also, I don't think there will be any issues with the shock in a tip-over as long as it's at least a two-point bar which is probably why Top Block decided on that design. I'll have to look into this more once I get back into the office tomorrow morning, have the bike in front of me, and then we can continue to discuss it! Also, I'll address your other photos tomorrow morning when I'm back at work and have time to formulate a response and photoshop a few photos of my own for you!

Hey, Ryan. Thanks for all you've done to include actual C14 riders in your design process. Great job.

You're welcome, bud! I'm hoping the collaboration of all of you along with us here at MCE yield a truly superior product!

MC Enterprises has been manufacturing quality motorcycle products for nearly 45 years! Visit us online at www.MCEnterprises.com!

Offline ZG

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #213 on: April 04, 2012, 10:32:23 PM »
Maybe on a slower silver bike, but never on a Silverdammit bike 8)

Sweet! 08 silver vs 11 silver...
 
 
 :popcorn:
 
 
Sorry Ryan, don't mean to threadjack bro but this is a good battle, slow vs slower...  ;)

Offline RyanMCEnterprises

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #214 on: April 04, 2012, 10:39:12 PM »

Sweet! 08 silver vs 11 silver...
 
 
 :popcorn:
 
 
Sorry Ryan, don't mean to threadjack bro but this is a good battle, slow vs slower...  ;)

Hahahaha it's okay!
MC Enterprises has been manufacturing quality motorcycle products for nearly 45 years! Visit us online at www.MCEnterprises.com!

Son of Pappy

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #215 on: April 04, 2012, 10:52:47 PM »

Sweet! 08 silver vs 11 silver...
 
 
 :popcorn:
 
 
Sorry Ryan, don't mean to threadjack bro but this is a good battle, slow vs slower...  ;)
We'll fix that issue Saturday ;D  And it's Silverdammit, not plain old silver, so boring, just slightly quicker than black, about on pace with blue.  Red is still waiting on a color change so they can proceed through the light :P

Back on topic, when ya think these may be ready to gain you some profit for all your hard work?

Offline maxtog

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #216 on: April 04, 2012, 11:02:33 PM »
Sweet! 08 silver vs 11 silver...

You mean 08 Light Baby Bluish Grey vs 11 REAL Silver ;)
 

Quote
Sorry Ryan, don't mean to threadjack bro but this is a good battle, slow vs slower...  ;)

Now I think you mean fast vs. faster.... and you are not sorry in the least!
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline maxtog

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #217 on: April 04, 2012, 11:14:28 PM »
Oh, wow, I'm really sorry Max! At first read I thought you meant remove the horizontal bar and leave only the vertical, which is what I've gone into detail about. I didn't realize you were talking about the opposite of that! I think I need sleep! Hahahaha.

No prob, it is really late and we ALL should get sleep (hey, it is past 1:15am here!).

We will have to leave the engineering design and analysis to you professionals, of course.  It is already obvious your team has the skill, desire, experience, and ability to produce something great.  I am sure each configuration has pluses and minuses.  As for feedback from us laypeople, we mostly have to go on aesthetics vs. practicality vs. convenience vs. protection level vs cost.  The permutations are mind blowing!

At some point, I would suggest a poll, listing (showing) all the possible configurations that are workable and reasonable, along with a simple estimate of level of protection offered, then let people vote on which they like the most (or least).  I am not saying it is a democracy- it is your project and your investment money and time on the line, but the potential customers could offer some insight as to what might sell best.  Might even be OK as a "silent" poll, where people just Email or private message you their ranked choices.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline ZG

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #218 on: April 04, 2012, 11:22:21 PM »
and you are not sorry in the least!

 ;D ;D ;D       :stirpot:
 
Nope, not at all...  ;)

MGvalerio

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Re: MC Enterprises Concours Canyon Cage Discussion
« Reply #219 on: April 05, 2012, 12:51:09 AM »
Estetica...
Con 2 perni nella griglia,facile manutenzione, maggiore protezione punto alto.
 

 
 
MGvalerio. 8)
 
 
PS. scusate ..disegno infantile. :-[