Headlight Stays On After Turned Off

[kawamark]

’94 Concours with 94k. Head light and front marker lights intermittently stay on after the ignition switch is turned off. Seems to happen more in hot weather and / or after a longer ride.

Sometimes I can flip the ignition switch between off and on a few times and it will go off. Sometimes it will stay on despite flipping the ignition switch off and on a few times and after 5 – 10 minutes will go off by itself. Occasionally it will stay on and only after it has sat for about 10 minutes or so, I can flip the ignition switch between off and on and it turns off.

I've tried tapping on the J-Box when the light is stuck on with no effect. I'm thinking there is a relay somewhere else that is sticking. But which one? Where would it be located? 

[George R. Young]

J-box schematic:
http://web.ncf.ca/ag136/junct2bnewc.gif

Looks like the main relay is sticking on.

[kawamark]

That sounds logical. I'm OK with soldering in some new relays. Looks like there is 3 total.

This thread http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=228.msg2366#msg2366 mentions a couple of sources for relays.

One is http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/NTE/R46-5D3-12/?qs=7JCSYMYFKpadEP%252bDQB5OkQ%3d%3d wich shows a P/N R46-5D3-12




I'm wondering if this would work? If so, it is local for me and cheap. 

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/OMRON-Relay-2W937?Pid=search



Contact Form  SPDT
Pins  5
Contact Amp Rating (Resistive)  5
Contact Amp Rating (Inductive)  5
HP @ 120V  1/10
Coil Volts  12VDC

[T Cro ®]

No 5 amp too small they will be short lived and likely weld shut and you will still be stuck with a stuck headlight.

[kawamark]

OK. The specfied NTE R46−5D3−12e is also rated at Max. Contact Cur. @ 30VDC or 120VAC = 5A

Maybe it should be a NTE R46−5D12−12. It is rated at Max. Contact Cur. @ 30VDC or 120VAC = 12A. This is the highest rated 12 volt relay of this type.

( Based on the chart here: http://www.nteinc.com/relay_web/pdf/R46.pdf )

Also, the alternative is rated at 6 amps.

http://www.onlinecomponents.com/panasonic-ew-aromat_js1-12v-f.html?p=10557606&pref=Repl

Do I need  to keep looking for a higher amperage rating? Suggestions?

[T Cro ®]

The 12 amp would be most desirable..... A 60 watt high beam can draw right at 5 amps and a 55 watt draws 4.6 so while the 6 amp is suitable it is not much better than the stocker which can be seen to be short lived.

[kawamark]

The 12 amp would be most desirable..... A 60 watt high beam can draw right at 5 amps and a 55 watt draws 4.6 so while the 6 amp is suitable it is not much better than the stocker which can be seen to be short lived.

Good information. Thanks! 

[RedWyvern]

Mark, did you ever get this fixed?  It happened to me in the mid -90s, bike was 3-5 yrs old, and I was stationed in the hell of Edwards AFB, located in the Mojave Desert.  I'm not a dry, sand, flat, brown kind of guy...(so no SW, and heck, most of the plains W-ward! kind of guy).

What stunk was the sun was always shining (making it unbearbly hot, so hot I would start getting burnt 5" form my dark brown Subaru's car handle!).  I don't know how long it had been happening before I saw it, and even then I though "it has to be the sun reflecting, it can't be my headlight".

Was.  I forget which relay.. ah, my service notes say "top right relay"... ah nope, occurred again 200 miles later - middle relay.  I was able to get 15A ones and used those.

Mark

[MAN OF BLUES]

The 12 amp would be most desirable..... A 60 watt high beam can draw right at 5 amps and a 55 watt draws 4.6 so while the 6 amp is suitable it is not much better than the stocker which can be seen to be short lived.

IIRC, the stockers are rated higher, i think 20a.
When my last box went ballsup, Guy had some relays and re-spun mine for me, and installed 30a relays. I believe that is what Larry buck is currently using, as guy sent him a butt-load he had. definatly need more than 12a tho, as inrush current is different than steady state.

[T Cro ®]

IIRC, the stockers are rated higher, i think 20a.
When my last box went ballsup, Guy had some relays and re-spun mine for me, and installed 30a relays. I believe that is what Larry buck is currently using, as guy sent him a butt-load he had. definatly need more than 12a tho, as inrush current is different than steady state.

You may be right but I really did not think that the stock J-Box Relays were anywhere near that large my research shows them to be a 5 amp.....

[MAN OF BLUES]

You may be right but I really did not think that the stock J-Box Relays were anywhere near that large my research shows them to be a 5 amp.....

I'd have to ask Guy what he installed, I do know I was running a NAPA 80/100, which would basically be pulling 7 to 8a on inrush, and on COGZilla, I'm running DUAL 80/100's, forcing me to run a 15a fuse on that circuit alone (16a @ 12v, 14a @ 14v) I have had no problems, so I know he used at least a 20a relay....

lemme text him and ask, I'll report back shortly...

[Rick Hall]

Slightly off topic... One thing to keep in mind a relay rating is how much it'll switch, not how much it'll carry once the contacts are closed. As well as how many times (~50k - 100k times ) it will do so w/o failure... on average. Of course this will vary according to the specific relay.

Figure we start our C-10's once every 100 miles. In 80k miles, we've only started the bike 800 times.

Or, remember that hokey round rocker switch on the antique Mr. Coffee machine? It switches around 15 amps, and lasts a couple of years. Compare with an industrial switch that carries the same current.... 3-4 times the size, 3-4 times the longevity.

Rick

[Daytona_Mike]

I have  the  3 original relays in my hand and they show MR301-N13  9g3 .
I looked those up and cannot find  the exact rating but I am sure they are all 5 amp. I was surprised at how low of a rating the stockers  are.
The ones I replaced them with are all  12amp.  I did 3 of these J-boxes with 12amp relays and have seen no issues and it that was more than a few years ago.

[MAN OF BLUES]

Slightly off topic... One thing to keep in mind a relay rating is how much it'll switch, not how much it'll carry once the contacts are closed. .....Rick

that was my point as for inrush vs steady state capacity....

Guy got back to me, he used a 15a relay, made by Song Chuan,  which he sent all of his stock to Larry Buck. I assume he sent his source info also, so unless Larry to a different route, that's what he was using.

soory for the misinformation on rating, I did recall he said he installed one almost twice the rating that was factory....  my bad


http://html.alldatasheet.com/html-pdf/209823/NEC/MR301/52/1/MR301.html

[RedWyvern]

Thanks for checking.   My mind said 5 amp stock, but it's been a long time since I checked.  Box hasn't given me a problem since back in 96.  Bike had 30K then.  Has 145k now.

Mark

[kawamark]

Mark, did you ever get this fixed?  It happened to me in the mid -90s, bike was 3-5 yrs old, and I was stationed in the hell of Edwards AFB, located in the Mojave Desert.  I'm not a dry, sand, flat, brown kind of guy...(so no SW, and heck, most of the plains W-ward! kind of guy).

Not yet. The slightly cooler weather seems to help. But I need to get it fixed once and for all.