Author Topic: He had one job to do  (Read 4248 times)

Offline Rhino

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Re: He had one job to do
« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2017, 02:20:33 PM »
Almost as awesome of getting a close up view when we tested Special Weapons back in the 1950's.  Nothing like getting a blast of radioactive plasma in the face.

You mean like these guys:


Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: He had one job to do
« Reply #21 on: December 07, 2017, 04:01:41 PM »
You mean like these guys:




well.. in reality, and the fact that photo "could be taken" (and not been a black exposed blob), tells you the initial blast, and the GAMMA.... which is the evil invisible assassin, has already passed thru all those guys, probably 5 minutes prior,,, (and likely every one of them are dead..probably lucky ones 10 to 15 years ago, and most, well over 20 years back,  by the timing of tertiary zone gamma studies, )  the resultant fallout is kinda like comparing a sunburn to a blowtorch, the fallout could be protected from, its dust... get in the tank, and get the 7734 outta there..) ...gamma... well kids, flash, too late.. that flash just covered a distance of 15 miles in about 2.8 seconds.  ZAPPPPP.. you just got the intro to the microwave oven.. meh, bad comparison..

hey Brian, just gotta ask....
I know you as a person of knowledge, and have always liked ya'z (easy boyz), but the wiki thing, and in depth posting on every subject, seems a bit trite, (i.e. are you retired now? I am, but not by my choice.. oh, and I'm banned from the other place, for being a dick..for 80 more days... :hitfan: :stirpot: :deadhorse: excuse me, but my name "is" Richard.. so .. go figure.. (justbustinballs)
I really found the wiki about the ship, even more funny...
well, the title...  ;D

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daigo_Fukury%C5%AB_Maru

hope the auto-sensor doesn't preen the address because it has the correct combination of "bad words" if it could understand 'em..

Just how old is this Tree gentleman? I gotta ask, as my natural parents are all dead, and my G.Parents are also (they raised me), and nobody died of radiation related disease.. strangely..
 

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: He had one job to do
« Reply #22 on: December 07, 2017, 04:49:19 PM »
I really doubt that it was anything but a true mistake. Not because I am smart enough to follow the work they did but because on this level, no one does anything 'alone'. All of these projects are done by many people, all fully understanding all facets of the entire project. So it is simply impossible for any individual, or even a couple of people, to 'slip one past' everyone else and 'play' with a project like this.

Not my field and it is on the edge of my understanding but basically it seems they just missed the series of element conversions that would happen in the 'pit' or the reaction zone itself. The problem is compounded because this was a triple stage weapon, fission, boosted fission and fusion, I think. The problem was that the fusion fuel material was supposed to be Lithium 6, which was to produce tritium, the fuel for the fusion reaction, during the reaction. But more of the Lithium was the isotope Lithium 7, which was thought to be basically inert during the reaction and would simply absorb slow neutrons but it turned out to be very sensitive to fast neutrons, in turn breaking down into a helium AND a tritium atom, and this additional, unexpected tritium became the main fusion fuel of this weapon. So in the end, a very unfortunate and I believe, unforeseen event. The US tried to keep the whole thing quiet, both the weapons aspect as a military secret, but also the increased radiation fallout as a huge international 'oppsie' by the US which would have proven quite embarrassing and politically damaging.

But this is where the story takes another interesting twist; simply by analyzing the fallout, a British physicist named Joseph Rotblat figured out the design, the staging, and the relative yield of each stage of the weapon. Really quite extraordinary actually.

Stuff happens. And when one 'makes the neutrons dance' as Fermi and so many others after him have done, the results can be truly spectacular; both spectacularly good (the Soviets have used atomic 'devices' for very successful large- scale construction projects- seriously) and spectacularly bad such as the Castle Bravo incident. An auto mechanic might be able to kill a few people by making a mistake on, say, a vehicle braking system and causing a nasty auto accident. But that same mechanic simply does not ever have the ability to kill, say, 1,000 people or injure a similar number as he / she just does not ever get the ability to work on anything that can cause such an evil result. A rocket design team can kill and injure more people than the mechanic can but still, there is a pretty small limit to the physical injury or impact, although the monetary cost of his / her mistakes can be enormous. But those few, brilliant people who get to tinker with 'The Old One's' basic natural structures, on a nuclear level, well, they can really do some damage. Perhaps limitless damage. There were those among the Manhattan District Engineers who theorized that their "gadget" might act as a sort of spark plug and actually get the nitrogen in our own atmosphere to fuse, effectively turning the Earth into a star. Now that right here is a LOT of damage.

Brian

I always wondered if that was really an accident. Blowin' stuff up is fun. And if it's not too difficult to make your explosion bigger, especially when somebody else is paying, hey why not.

Well, OK, the 'why not' was all the radiated people ... but, boys and their toys.
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: He had one job to do
« Reply #23 on: December 07, 2017, 05:27:18 PM »
Aw, I like you too, big guy. But in a normal, healthy way, not like.... well, nevermind.   :rotflmao:

Nope, not retired but I can waste a lot of time as I see fit as long as I deliver on what I have to do so this forum catches perhaps an undue amount of my ramblings. And by far, the great, no, huge number of topics I do not post about simply because I have no knowledge of them, or no interest in them (which causes the lack of knowledge). Just like everyone else, my knowledge is small and sorely lacking. But I do have a true fascination with the world we live in (the universe(s)), and I have been gifted with an excellent memory (not bragging here, I was born this way, just like my eyes are blue, not anything I did or had any choice in). Combine those two things and you get someone with a smattering of knowledge in a few different areas, all because I find them truly amazing read a bit about them and then remember it. A little bit of education thrown in really helped me put a lot of different facets of life together because they are interrelated and there you have it- just enough knowledge to confuse a few issues. :-)

But seriously, I do find the world around me utterly fascinating, as well as the path we all took (humanity) to get here. For example: I used to wonder how the ancients of the Bronze age figured out how to mix copper and tin to make bronze, a fairly sophisticated achievement when man could not yet make an animal- drawn cart. What is up with that. But with a little study in metallurgy, I learned that they did not know how to make 'bronze', only that the 'copper' they mined from some places was much, much stronger than the copper they mined from other areas. Cypress copper (I think that was where it came from) was highly valued as fantastic 'copper'. But that vein of copper had tin in it and totally by mistake, the ancient, simple societies stumbled on how to make a very strong metal, capable of heat treatment, three thousand years ago. Then came the 'black metal' (iron, sometimes turned into steel, again by mistake, 'magic' and happenstance) which was not all that well understood right through the mid- 1940's! The US made Libety ships by welding but did not yet know about hydrogen embrittlement, which they created in every weld, totally by mistake. When these ships were exposed to very low temperatures and contracted, the micro- cranking from the hydrogen embrittlement joined together and made one, long crack that traversed through the weld at over 3,000 feet per second. The first ships to suffer from this failure in the far northern waters of the Soviet Union (delivering Lend- Lease materials) were thought to be torpedoed because of the huge 'explosion' (the crack traveling) and the fact that they sunk in a matter of seconds. The 'fix' for this was a steel belt 3 feet tall, wrapped down both sides of the ships and riveted to them. But it would be quite a while longer before the true cause was found, studied and understood. And all I had to do to learn this was to read it out of a book after smart people studied it for years, decades and wrote it down.

I did my thesis on alternate valving methods for internal combustion engines. I did study in a structured environment for this but really it was my interest in I.C. engines since I was short that led to this; my work centered on and followed the work of Harry Ricardo of England, a real genius IMO. But there are good, sound reasons why some designs are better than others, and often very simple, direct reasons why some designs, such as a Wankle for example, is a lousy engine design that basically cannot be made 'good'. Again, all of this information is readily available, easy to find (mostly- Ricardo's book is quite rare but I did track down a copy!) and it teaches us lessons we should not have to learn over and over again. But some people are immune to good advice and ideas and so the Wankle, along with other lousy designs will not die because they are 'cool'. But my point is that anyone can learn almost anything one wants to and the world is gaining information now at an astounding rate, so more and more great info. is available every single day.

As far as the radiation, the really bad form is what are called 'hard gamma' rays, which along with X-rays, are ionizing radiation and quite damaging to tissue and chromosomes. The good news is that nuclear weapons give off relatively small amounts of that kind of radiation so watching the detonations is not the big risk; being bathed in the fallout is the real problem. When they swept up the 'black dust' falling on the 'Lucky Dragon', one seaman kept some of it and put it in his pillowcase to save. Really, really bad idea that cost him a lot of suffering and his life. But it was not emitting much ionizing radiation and had he not been sleeping on a pile of the stuff, he may have been mostly OK. The real danger of nuclear fallout is Alpha radiation which is so weak and onion skin or a sheet of paper will stop it, and so normally it poses no danger to humans; in fact, both reactor piles and most weapons are assembled by humans BY HAND in complete safety. The catch is if it gets into the lungs; then lung tissue is bombarded with alpha radiation and is destroyed and / or made malignant. Some have claimed plutonium oxide, a material routinely handled by humans with nothing more than surgical rubber gloves on, is the most potent toxin known to man..... if inhaled.

As to the banning, well, ya' do come on a bit strong Rich. Now for whatever reason in the world you have never annoyed me in the least- I seem immune to you (??) but I can see where sometimes you state things so blatantly and frankly, a little harshly that it annoys people. Well, some people- others it outright pisses off. :-)  Now, I say this with love so take it for what it is worth. Maybe in the future, you could throw a little levity in your posts and maybe re- think the wording of some parts of your posts: remember, 'Jane, you ignorant slut' was only funny when Dan Akroyd said it, most of the time that is offensive to many. At any rate, your 'pee- pee slap' will expire and I assume all will settle down and everyone will live, so it is not that bad. As an aside, I absolutely LOVE Jerry Gowan- that guy says things that would make Archie Bunker shake his head. Anyway, I guess he is quite active on FaceTwit and was recently banned for a time.... and when he came back, he said a hearty hello to all and said that everyone should be careful what they say about Obama and Muslims or they too will get a 30 day ban. Too funny! My hero, not for his views but for the fact that he just spits out what he is thinking and frankly, it is kind of refreshing in our P.C. world. Often offensive, and always very non- P.C. but still, refreshing!  ;D

Brian (who never sweeps or cleans up in any way- I can learn the lessons taught to others and not make the same mistake)


well.. in reality, and the fact that photo "could be taken" (and not been a black exposed blob), tells you the initial blast, and the GAMMA.... which is the evil invisible assassin, has already passed thru all those guys, probably 5 minutes prior,,, (and likely every one of them are dead..probably lucky ones 10 to 15 years ago, and most, well over 20 years back,  by the timing of tertiary zone gamma studies, )  the resultant fallout is kinda like comparing a sunburn to a blowtorch, the fallout could be protected from, its dust... get in the tank, and get the 7734 outta there..) ...gamma... well kids, flash, too late.. that flash just covered a distance of 15 miles in about 2.8 seconds.  ZAPPPPP.. you just got the intro to the microwave oven.. meh, bad comparison..

hey Brian, just gotta ask....
I know you as a person of knowledge, and have always liked ya'z (easy boyz), but the wiki thing, and in depth posting on every subject, seems a bit trite, (i.e. are you retired now? I am, but not by my choice.. oh, and I'm banned from the other place, for being a dick..for 80 more days... :hitfan: :stirpot: :deadhorse: excuse me, but my name "is" Richard.. so .. go figure.. (justbustinballs)
I really found the wiki about the ship, even more funny...
well, the title...  ;D

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daigo_Fukury%C5%AB_Maru

hope the auto-sensor doesn't preen the address because it has the correct combination of "bad words" if it could understand 'em..

Just how old is this Tree gentleman? I gotta ask, as my natural parents are all dead, and my G.Parents are also (they raised me), and nobody died of radiation related disease.. strangely..
 
Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

KiPass keeping you up at night? Fuel gauge warning burning your retinas? Get unlimited peace and harmony here: www.incontrolne.com

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: He had one job to do
« Reply #24 on: December 07, 2017, 05:30:56 PM »
Oh yeah, and I forgot to mention, I type fairly fast so my wordy posts do not take me all that long.

I learned to type using a Mavis Beacon typing tutor on an Atari 800 (that's right folks, a genuine, kerosene powered Atari!) but because I stole the software and had no instructions, I had no idea about 'home keys' and to this day, hold my hands very differently than most over a keyboard. And I had no idea what was 'good' or 'fast' so I kept at it until I could routinely type 100+ WPM and hit 120/ 130 on a good day. Not that fast anymore but still fairly quick.

Brian


<snip>

hey Brian, just gotta ask....
I know you as a person of knowledge, and have always liked ya'z (easy boyz), but the wiki thing, and in depth posting on every subject, seems a bit trite, (i.e. are you retired now? I am, but not by my choice..

<snip>
 
Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

KiPass keeping you up at night? Fuel gauge warning burning your retinas? Get unlimited peace and harmony here: www.incontrolne.com

Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: He had one job to do
« Reply #25 on: December 07, 2017, 07:47:38 PM »

hey Brian, just gotta ask....
I know you as a person of knowledge, and have always liked ya'z (easy boyz), but the wiki thing, and in depth posting on every subject, seems a bit trite, (i.e. are you retired now? I am, but not by my choice.. oh, and I'm banned from the other place, for being a dick..for 80 more days... :hitfan: :stirpot: :deadhorse: excuse me, but my name "is" Richard.. so .. go figure.. (justbustinballs)


They banned you for being you?  :rotflmao:   Don't take that the wrong way, my friend.  :rotflmao:     ;)
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Offline Rick Hall

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Re: He had one job to do
« Reply #26 on: December 07, 2017, 09:44:47 PM »
.... oh, and I'm banned from the other place, for being a dick..for 80 more days... :hitfan: :stirpot: :deadhorse:
 

You have no idea how funny I see this action :) It didn't have anything to do with a trash bag, hydrogen, and a lit cigarette did it ;)

If you can't remember, it was at T.W.O. a 'few' years back. After one or more adult beverages @ the campfire ;)

Rick
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: He had one job to do
« Reply #27 on: December 12, 2017, 10:40:45 AM »
You have no idea how funny I see this action :) It didn't have anything to do with a trash bag, hydrogen, and a lit cigarette did it ;)

If you can't remember, it was at T.W.O. a 'few' years back. After one or more adult beverages @ the campfire ;)

Rick

 :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :goodpost: :stirpot:

no, it didn't involve explosive gasses.., but by odd coincidence it was because of something I said on that forum with regard to posting rules, and crap that followed up with people piling up and being dolts..., the other coincidence is, ( having nothing to do with my punishment), and I believe you witnessed it (at TWO, during the campfire thang..) my first moment of "confrontation", and what could be expected when someone spouts something to me/us without thinking.. remember the fellow that was bad mouthing COG (we, you and I, were both members then, and I got a plaque for being the "newest member").. and after the fellow went on and on, and said "why should I pay COG, I can just show up at a ride, and get all the same treatment and benefits...?"... which was followed by me standing up, walking over to him, and telling him I was gonna toss his azz into the creek behind me if he didn't shut his trap... :yikes: :popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn: :1DeadBanana

strangely, he decided to "part company at the bonfire...."

I kind of miss those days, we were all very good friends, and truly had innocent, and great fun


46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..