Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: sycamoredave on February 05, 2013, 04:29:16 AM
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Does anyone have any experience with this company? I lost my key FOB, and this would appear to be a reasonable alternative to both get rid of the FOB nightmare, and cost much less.
Thanks- 8)
Dave
http://www.cdidoctor.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=4105&zenid=pu0ui8aq8l3vhi67d9nukvm774 (http://www.cdidoctor.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=4105&zenid=pu0ui8aq8l3vhi67d9nukvm774)
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Do you have at least one fob left? If you don't, you're in for a shock.
I don't know how you're figuring that this company costs less? I just looked at the prices on that link and that's not less! :o
You can get a smaller fob for around $35 plus programming or a large fob for around $200 plus programming.
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KISS is not exactly KIPASS. Nothing on their website about KIPASS.
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KISS is not exactly KIPASS. Nothing on their website about KIPASS.
Yeahbut, it's close no? Just take the PA away, barely any difference. ;)
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I think our friend from Florida would tell us that KISS does not have the mad pow-ah of KIPASS ;D
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So now I know what the PA stands for. It's KISS with mad Pow-Ah ;D
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Does anyone have any experience with this company? I lost my key FOB, and this would appear to be a reasonable alternative to both get rid of the FOB nightmare, and cost much less.
Thanks- 8)
Dave
http://www.cdidoctor.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=4105&zenid=pu0ui8aq8l3vhi67d9nukvm774 (http://www.cdidoctor.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=4105&zenid=pu0ui8aq8l3vhi67d9nukvm774)
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/eek.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/eek.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/eek.gif)
Thats high~
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OMG, make a convoluted system even more complicated.
This system appears to put a standard key in place to work WITH KIPASS does it not?
Maybe it makes KIPASS work with a key instead of removing KIPASS altogether.
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http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=6976.0 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=6976.0)
May help.
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I'm thinking the key has a passive RFID chip and of course the locking mech itself. If I wanted a key operated (and underperforming) bike I'd have an FJ.
I find that on the GS I tend to leave the key in, remember 30 minutes later, retrieve the key, finish, suit up, approach bike, stop, dig keys from inner pants pocket, cuss KIPASS for spoiling me, and then start the bike. Lucky for me the YZ is truly keyless ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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I'm thinking the key has a passive RFID chip and of course the locking mech itself. If I wanted a key operated (and VERY underperforming) bike I'd have an FJ.
I find that on the GS I tend to leave the key in, remember 30 minutes later, retrieve the key, finish, suit up, approach bike, stop, dig keys from inner pants pocket, cuss KIPASS for spoiling me, and then start the bike. Lucky for me the YZ is truly keyless ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
+1
^^^^ and added a word (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
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http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=6976.0 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=6976.0)
May help.
No, that will not help. That is a bypass for the KIPASS activation switch. It will not allow you to start the bike without your active or passive FOB. It is a workaround for the rare condition where pressing your key down doesn't have any effect. This was supposedly fixed (or at least greatly improved) on the 2nd Gen C-14.
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It sounds like nobody has dealt with this company yet. I will reach out to them and see what I can find. I have never liked the FOB, and if this process would end up with a real key that I could carry on a key ring, it would be a big improvement. More to come ...
Ride safe ... 8)
Dave
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(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/eek.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/eek.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/eek.gif)
Thats high~
My dealer is quoting about $1000 just for parts, and then several hundred more for labor. This process is less than $500.
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Dealer sounds extremely high. What are you getting for $1000 in parts?
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Dealer sounds extremely high. What are you getting for $1000 in parts?
Dave never answered my question about having one fob left or not. Sounds to me like he lost his one and only fob. That $1,000 was the shock I was talking about.
Dave, from what I understand, you're barking up the wrong tree. You can't start the bike without at least one fob that the bike recognizes.
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No fob NO start.
New ecu--$650
New fob--$212
Labor at dealer--????
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Dave never answered my question about having one fob left or not. Sounds to me like he lost his one and only fob. That $1,000 was the shock I was talking about.
Dave, from what I understand, you're barking up the wrong tree. You can't start the bike without at least one fob that the bike recognizes.
You also cannot register a new FOB without at least one fob that the ECU recognizes. Not even the dealer can do it.
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First of all, don't be an idiot like me, and lose your FOBs.
Prior posts are painting the picture I have found. At least one FOB is necessary to allow for programming of a new FOB. The bike will not start without a FOB. The dealer has said that if you have no FOB, you have to buy a new ECU that is programmed to a FOB. The cost of a new ECU plus 2 FOBs is >$1000. The labor is the cost of getting to the ECU, removal and replacement, and the programming. From what I understand from this company's website, you send them the ECU, they pull it apart, reprogram it to match the new key, and send back the ECU plus however many keys you request. The stated cost is less than $500, and you end up with KEYs not FOBs. I'm still not sure what they do with the big starter key (which is still locked in the switch), or how to get into the saddle bags. From my humble perspective, if we can figure a couple things out, this sounds like something close to a win. The process for getting additional keys also appears easier.
I'm going to try and call them today and see what more I can find out. I'll let you all know what I find out over the weekend.
Ride safe... 8)
Dave
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Good luck Dave!
If you would have done some reading on this forum you would have known that operating your bike with only one fob is asking for BIG trouble and it looks like you found it.
How did you manage to lose two fobs?
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Check salvage for ecu w/fobs
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=kawasaki+ecu+used&adpos=1o3&crlp=16317731322_2416792&MT_ID=69&_osacat=0&keyword=ecu+used&_from=R40&geo_id=10232&clk_rvr_id=448711766758&adgroup_id={ADGRP_ID}&crdt=0&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313&_nkw=kawasaki+concours+1400+ecu+used&_sacat=0 (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=kawasaki+ecu+used&adpos=1o3&crlp=16317731322_2416792&MT_ID=69&_osacat=0&keyword=ecu+used&_from=R40&geo_id=10232&clk_rvr_id=448711766758&adgroup_id={ADGRP_ID}&crdt=0&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313&_nkw=kawasaki+concours+1400+ecu+used&_sacat=0)
Just read on the 'other side' that the immobilizer feature of the ecu can be disabled. This maybe what this company is doing.
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Good luck Dave!
If you would have done some reading on this forum you would have known that operating your bike with only one fob is asking for BIG trouble and it looks like you found it.
How did you manage to lose two fobs?
Yeah, well, I did read here, but thought, I'll get it bought after the end of the season. It never happened. I think it got lost when we did a sweeping cleanup before the holidays. The prior fob may have suffered a similar fate. This is a pretty strange thing, because I am a fanatic about not losing keys. Apparently fobs are different. Duh.
I called Carmo and talked to a nice lady and her engineer. They assured me that the website was correct, and they can handle the project. Next step, figuring out how to remove the ECU... :P
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Check salvage for ecu w/fobs
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=kawasaki+ecu+used&adpos=1o3&crlp=16317731322_2416792&MT_ID=69&_osacat=0&keyword=ecu+used&_from=R40&geo_id=10232&clk_rvr_id=448711766758&adgroup_id={ADGRP_ID}&crdt=0&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313&_nkw=kawasaki+concours+1400+ecu+used&_sacat=0 (http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=kawasaki+ecu+used&adpos=1o3&crlp=16317731322_2416792&MT_ID=69&_osacat=0&keyword=ecu+used&_from=R40&geo_id=10232&clk_rvr_id=448711766758&adgroup_id={ADGRP_ID}&crdt=0&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313&_nkw=kawasaki+concours+1400+ecu+used&_sacat=0)
Just read on the 'other side' that the immobilizer feature of the ecu can be disabled. This maybe what this company is doing.
Been watching that as well. Lots of ECUs, but none with fobs. Gotta have the fob to make the ECU go. :P
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Yeah, well, I did read here, but thought, I'll get it bought after the end of the season. It never happened. I think it got lost when we did a sweeping cleanup before the holidays. The prior fob may have suffered a similar fate. This is a pretty strange thing, because I am a fanatic about not losing keys. Apparently fobs are different. Duh.
It is a shame the bike doesn't come with three fobs.
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It is a shame the bike doesn't come with three fobs.
One more to lose? ;)
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One more to lose? ;)
Hey! I resemble that! :o
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Hey! I resemble that! :o
Sorry man. I really wish you luck with this mess.
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[They should include three]
One more to lose? ;)
Well, it is not like the passive FOB costs much. In fact, for probably less than $1, they could just stick a passive RFID on a small piece of flimsy cardboard. Then attach that to the owner's manual. Most riders would not attempt to ride with THAT. It then provides that last-resort safety net, which is likely always safe at home on a shelf.
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With the owners manual locked in the bag, which is locked on the bike, which you can't unlocked because you lost the fobs and can't get the stovepipe key out of the ignition switch because it's in the left hand position you're still screwed. ::)
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Someone needs to invent an ignition that just uses a key.
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With the owners manual locked in the bag, which is locked on the bike, which you can't unlocked because you lost the fobs and can't get the stovepipe key out of the ignition switch because it's in the left hand position you're still screwed. ::)
It is not difficult to get into the luggage on a C14.
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Someone needs to invent an ignition that just uses a key.
+1 :P
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Seems that would be too easy...gotta be complex, not prudent to be simple except when my wife says that I am..which is most of the time.
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It is not difficult to get into the luggage on a C14.
^^^^^^^that
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Does anyone know how hard is it to get to the ECU? The folks at Carmo indicated it was mostly a chore getting to it, then pull off the retainer, and unplug the thing. Upon return it is supposedly plug and play. Thankfully I have not needed a repair manual to this point. I suppose that is the next step. :P
Dave
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under the seat #34
Let us know how this works out for you.
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Someone needs to invent an ignition that just uses a key.
Hey now...that's just crazy talk.
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Does anyone know how hard is it to get to the ECU? The folks at Carmo indicated it was mostly a chore getting to it, then pull off the retainer, and unplug the thing. Upon return it is supposedly plug and play. Thankfully I have not needed a repair manual to this point. I suppose that is the next step. :P
Dave
From memory:
1 Remove seat
2 Remove tool box
3 Release elastic strap
4 Unplug connectors and remove ECU
Its a 5 minute job. Not even time for a beer.
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From memory:
1 Remove seat
2 Remove tool box
3 Release elastic strap
4 Unplug connectors and remove ECU
Its a 5 minute job. Not even time for a beer.
There's ALWAYS time for a beer. You'll just have to do all the above with one hand since you'll have a beer in the other.
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If there is no time for beer then it's not worth doing... >:(
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If there is no time for beer then it's not worth doing... >:(
:goodpost: :chugbeer:
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If there is no time for beer then it's not worth doing... >:(
+2 :thumbs:
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If they are getting the ECU I think it's safe to assume they have cracked the KIPASS code? Maybe a certain someone will trade in a certain twin piped bike and grace us with his company?
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I like this company for my FOB needs ;D
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/Connie%2014/waffle2.jpg)
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^^^^^^^^^ if I had a Duc FOB I'd at be at Starbucks!!! :D
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If there is no time for beer then it's not worth doing... >:(
In my case a $500 beer, but a beer non the less... Thanks for the help. 8)
Dave
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Any resolution to this?
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(http://gifsforum.com/images/gif/OP%20will%20deliver/grand/surely-SpongeBob-bob-sponge-OP-will-deliver-eccbc87e4b5ce2fe28308fd9f2a7baf3-771.gif)
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The day I was picking up my bike I heard the FOB story ......
They were giving me a discount on everything I bought that day so I bought a EXTRA FOB ;).
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Any resolution to this?
Today is my first day with time to even fiddle with the bike. I got a service manual finally, and they say the same thing as a couple here - just take the seat off, unplug the unit and pull it out. Another dumb question - how do you get the seat off without a key? Is there something up in there to hook onto to pull the catch? :P
Dave
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Another dumb question - how do you get the seat off without a key? Is there something up in there to hook onto to pull the catch? :P
Officially, you don't. Or you pick the lock. But I am sure there are some secret tricks (of which I do not know).
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You haven't been in the club long enough, Max. Only the early adopters know those tricks.
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Today is my first day with time to even fiddle with the bike. I got a service manual finally, and they say the same thing as a couple here - just take the seat off, unplug the unit and pull it out. Another dumb question - how do you get the seat off without a key? Is there something up in there to hook onto to pull the catch? :P
Dave
You really are screwed aren't ya? :o
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Today is my first day with time to even fiddle with the bike. I got a service manual finally, and they say the same thing as a couple here - just take the seat off, unplug the unit and pull it out. Another dumb question - how do you get the seat off without a key? Is there something up in there to hook onto to pull the catch? :P
Dave
I'm thinking locksmith.
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Without going back through the thread, is the stovepipe key still in the ignition,and if so what position?
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Without going back through the thread, is the stovepipe key still in the ignition,and if so what position?
My guess is yes and not in the FSS position. Hence the need for another way to remove the seat.
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3133/2592887732_41ff1bc0c3.jpg)
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Wrong thread eh Brent? ;)
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Wrong thread eh Brent? ;)
Oh shuddup. ;)
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Oh shuddup. ;)
:rotflmao:
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Hey! You guys need to rip me, not Mr. Pepsi! Unfortunately it is not in the FSS. I can turn the handle bars, but not remove the stovepipe.
:o
Dave
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Can you remove and disassemble the ignition to get the key?
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My first question is, where are you located? I can help you with a key for your seat. I am a 30 year journeyman locksmith.
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Someone needs to invent an ignition that just uses a key.
Git 'im Steve!!
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Well, thanks to the nature of the Sargent seat, I was able to get the seat off and the ECU out without a key. The CPU is boxed and ready to ship to Carmo. They promise 10 day turn around. I'll have three keys with chips that will work with my unit. I should be able to get them cut to match the stove pipe. Just think, a normal key that goes on a key ring! No FOB! No battery issues! All it takes is $.
By the way, we better be careful with those Sargent seats... ???
Sargent Motorcycle Seat on Kawasaki Concours 14 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLAV8dHCyko#)
Ride safe... :P
Dave
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I'll have three keys with chips that will work with my unit. I should be able to get them cut to match the stove pipe. Just think, a normal key that goes on a key ring! No FOB! No battery issues!
I have had a "normal" key for years, I had a locksmith cut one for me.
But if what you are getting only contains a passive RFID (no battery), you will not be able to start the engine until you hold one of them in contact with the magic spot on the front of the ignition lock neck for up to 10 seconds, every time you want to start the bike. When the [passive] key is in the ignition, it will be too far away to activate the ignition RFID reader. Maybe you already know all this, though.
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Well, here is the rest of the story on this company. The "engineer" called me yesterday and admitted that despite their website listing the C14, he had never worked on a KIPASS system. They haven't a clue how to make it work. While I would very much like to rip them, they were very nice to work with, admitted they were wrong, and refunded every penny of my money. Unfortunately, I am back to square one. :P
Dave
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Sorry about that chief.
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I'd keep scanning ebay for a used kipass ecu with transponder....gotta be worth a shot.
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maybe try contacting this guy on ebay al_sgarage001. He is in Quebec Canada (I think) he has a 2010 Concours he is dismantling. It is worth a try to see if he has the ECU with transponder.
Good Luck.
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HAPPY DAY! ;D
My wife was mowing out by the barn, and saw something reflected in the sunlight. It was my missing FOB! Despite having spent from last December to now sitting in the weeds by the driveway, I stuck a new battery in it, hit the stovepipe, the screen lit up, I hit the starter, and the Concours started right up! Pure bliss. Back in business. The dumb thing must have fallen out of my pocket while I was doing some chores, and I never knew it.
Life is good, and I love my wife. 8)
Dave
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That's great news Dave!
Now it's time to order a second fob right?
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Already done! Live and learn! ;)
Dave
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HAPPY DAY! ;D
My wife was mowing out by the barn, and saw something reflected in the sunlight. It was my missing FOB! Despite having spent from last December to now sitting in the weeds by the driveway, I stuck a new battery in it, hit the stovepipe, the screen lit up, I hit the starter, and the Concours started right up! Pure bliss. Back in business. The dumb thing must have fallen out of my pocket while I was doing some chores, and I never knew it.
Life is good, and I love my wife. 8)
Dave
Awesome! :chugbeer:
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The dumb thing must have fallen out of my pocket while I was doing some chores, and I never knew it.
Does having the fob in yer pocket help with doing chores? ???
I'll have to try that next time, if I put it in my wife's pocket will she be more efficient with her chores? :-\
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Does having the fob in yer pocket help with doing chores? ???
I'll have to try that next time, if I put it in my wife's pocket will she be more efficient with her chores? :-\
J, I KNOW that you aren't implying that your wife's efficiency isn't what it should be, right? :o ;)
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J, I KNOW that you aren't implying that your wife's efficiency isn't what it should be, right? :o ;)
:-X ;D
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Hello all. Been lurking your site for about a year and finally made the leap and purchased a 2012 with only 220 miles on it a couple weeks ago. Installed my Canyon Cages last week and am REALLY happy made the upgrade.
I do have a noob question about the FOB. I'm guessing they come with two FOBs when new? Dealer said didn't have the other one, now have said they found the "backup" FOB. Says it's much smaller than the "main" FOB. Is that right? The FOBs are not the same size; i.e. main=big, backup=small?
Thanks
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Hello all. Been lurking your site for about a year and finally made the leap and purchased a 2012 with only 220 miles on it a couple weeks ago. Installed my Canyon Cages last week and am REALLY happy made the upgrade.
I do have a noob question about the FOB. I'm guessing they come with two FOBs when new? Dealer said didn't have the other one, now have said they found the "backup" FOB. Says it's much smaller than the "main" FOB. Is that right? The FOBs are not the same size; i.e. main=big, backup=small?
Thanks
That's correct. 2nd gen C14s come with two different sized fobs. See your owner's manual for more info on the difference between the two.
Welcome aboard!
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Thank you very much, Conrad. They didn't have the owner's manual either. Should have a new one in a couple of days.
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Thank you very much, Conrad. They didn't have the owner's manual either. Should have a new one in a couple of days.
Till you get the manual, here's some light reading for ya. It's a bit tedious but you'll get the info.
http://www.kawasaki-techinfo.net/showOM.php?view_lang=EN&spec=US&book_no=99987-1707&lang_code=EN (http://www.kawasaki-techinfo.net/showOM.php?view_lang=EN&spec=US&book_no=99987-1707&lang_code=EN)
Click on General Information on the left panel and start reading on page 72.
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My wife was mowing out by the barn, and saw something reflected in the sunlight. It was my missing FOB!
Congrats!
Now- put the FOB in your riding jacket inside zippered pocket and never take it out! It will not fall out, it will not be misplaced, it will not get lost.
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Max, you're assuming he always wears a jacket.
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Now- put the FOB in your riding jacket inside zippered pocket and never take it out! It will not fall out, it will not be misplaced, it will not get lost.
What if he loses his jacket or it gets stolen... :-\
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I just carry mine in a pants pocket. Never lost my pants or had them stolen.... at least not yet. Never had a fob fall out of a pants pocket either.
Maybe a better idea would be to put the fob in a baggie so it is waterproof and then staple it to the rider's body somewhere? And not with those wussy desk staplers either, I am talking about the hardwood pallet making staples that have the ends folded over. Maybe the fleshy part of the abdomen about 4 or 5 inches above the hip bone? Oh, and staple it on so the baggie opening is facing down, assuming that you stand up when showering. Turn the baggie the other way if you shower the other way....
Brian
What if he loses his jacket or it gets stolen... :-\
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Considering the replacement price, may have it surgically implanted. (And no, not thru the back door,so to speak). :o
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Timing! Post response same time as B.D.F. hehe
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I just carry mine in a pants pocket.
Same here.
Never lost my pants or had them stolen.... at least not yet.
Well, there were some times back in the day for me that, well... lets just say I couldn't find my pants fast enough the next morning... :-[ :-X
Maybe a better idea would be to put the fob in a baggie so it is waterproof and then staple it to the rider's body somewhere? And not with those wussy desk staplers either, I am talking about the hardwood pallet making staples that have the ends folded over. Maybe the fleshy part of the abdomen about 4 or 5 inches above the hip bone? Oh, and staple it on so the baggie opening is facing down, assuming that you stand up when showering. Turn the baggie the other way if you shower the other way....
I think yer on to something Brian, if the damn batteries lasted longer maybe just eating it would be an excellent idea... :o :-\
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I think yer on to something Brian, if the damn batteries lasted longer maybe just eating it would be an excellent idea... :o :-\
A three day solution at best.
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Congrats!
Now- put the FOB in your riding jacket inside zippered pocket and never take it out! It will not fall out, it will not be misplaced, it will not get lost.
I had been carrying it in my "watch pocket", and I guess it just slipped out. I have ridden thousands of miles with it in that pocket, and never had a problem before. I'm just glad the nightmare is over, and I don't have to spend big $$$.
Y'all ride safe and keep track of those FOBs! ;)
Dave
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Does having the fob in yer pocket help with doing chores? ???
His lawnmower won't start without it.