Michelin Pilot Power anyone?

[martin_14]

Time for new shoes and, living residing in Germany there are only three alternative choices aproved besides the OEMs (which I won't use ever again):
- BT023 also from Bridgestone, which based on my experiences with the two sets of 021 I don't feel like trying, but I've been wrong before,
- Pirelli Angel: which have been my choice for the last 3 sets
- Michellin Pilot Power -> Any opinions on these? did somebody have the Angels and these and can compare them?
Thanks in advance,
Martín

PS: don't bother advising me on something else. It can cost me a fortune if the "grüne" (the "greens", or German policemen) stop me for a random control 

[Jeremy Mitchell]

I have met a C14 owner or two that use Pilot Powers on the front with a PR2 or Angel on the rear so that they can change the front and rear at the same mileage. 

I wouldn't want to run a Pilot Power on the rear since I would be afraid that I would be putting a new tire on in a week or two. 

IMO your best option is the Angels since PR2/PR3's are "illegal" by the standards of zee TUV.   

[So Cal Joe]

I had the 023's on my 09 and they are a good tire. I had the PR 3 on the rear when I sold it and it wasn't on there long before I sold it so I really comment on it but I liked it. I wouldn't hesitate to go with the Bridgestone 23 again.

[Mister Tee]

IMO your best option is the Angels since PR2/PR3's are "illegal" by the standards of zee TUV.   

How so?

[galaxieman]

I ran a BT-016 front and BT-023 rear on my Superhawk for a while so they'd wear out at the same time.  I'm running BT-023s on both ends of the Concours and just dropped my second set on.  The stock -021 front lasted about 8k miles, and the rear less than that.  The life was less than the -023's, and the grip was 'meh' as well.  I rotated in a 180/55 rear that I had pulled off the SH when it went track-only at some point (just before my Iron Butt ride, about 8k into the first -023 full-size rear) because I had some tread left but didn't think it would necessarily make it a full thousand miles.  That rear lasted another 6k, and the front went around 10k, so I'm COMPLETELY satisfied with tire life on these.

Currently running a stock sized BT-023GT front, and a 180/55 GT-spec on the rear.  Yes, I know guys on the board say the 190/55 is better than the 190/50, but I'd argue the 180/55 handles just as well, is lighter, and is available in the GT-spec tire.  I'm about to do another Tucson - San Diego - LA - San Diego - Tucson run this weekend, so I'll have more insight on how the GT-spec tires feel over distance and with a good chunk of 2-up riding as well.

One thing I'd note about the Bridgestones is that they're more sensitive to low pressure than other types of tires I've run, at least on a big bike like the Concours.  Once the pressure gets down to 40 or so I notice the handling starting to go off, and anything below 40 can start the tire cupping pretty quickly.  Get the pressures back up and it'll correct itself, but it's frustrating to lose tire life only because I didn't monitor pressures well enough... 'Stock' pressures are supposed to be 42/42 F/R, but I generally try and run 43/44 solo, and 43/45 for when I'm doing lots of 2-up.  Once the tires come up to temperature that usually means I'm reading 44/46 on the TPMS sensors while riding.

Edited to add...
As for the original poster's question about the Pilot Powers, I'd recommend going with a sport touring tire.  Not sure on what's up with the PR2/PR3 being 'illegal', but if they're not an option I'd go with the Angels or the -023's.  Don't get me wrong, the pilot power is an awesome tire... you're just going to wear it out really, really fast on a Concours.  I was getting 2500-3k on them when I had them on my Superhawk, and the Concours is 200lbs heavier and has more ponies.  They'd grip well, but wear out too quick IMHO.

[martin_14]

thanks for the responses. As some observed, the mileage in the Pilot Power will be low. They cost only 14% less but last the half, if at all, and I hate downtime. I'll go with the Angels, then. Thanks.

As to those asking about the ilegality of some tires, the German authorities deem driving in the Autobahn a more demanding situation than in other roads, and I agree to some extent. I can drive 120 miles in one hour if I want, in perfect legallity. I've done 110 miles in 40 minutes once on a lucky day without trafic or building sites. When I arrived the tires were hot. Trouly, madly, deeply hot. A run like that is equivalent to a couple of thousand miles touring around.

As Jeremy explained, the TÜV (Technischer Überwachungsverein, or Technical Inspection Agency, or MOT as they call it in England) as well as the police check that you only mount those tires that are approved for each vehicle. You can't just pop on any tire you fancy  or exhaust, or even a mirror... or you thought the German reputation for rules was a myth?

[Jeremy Mitchell]

I couldn't figure out how to add the umlaut above the "U" in TUV.   


As an American living in Germany I found out that they are very serious about vehicle inspections in Deutschland.  Germans are fanatical about tires and vehicle condition, compared to the majority of the people in the US who only realize they need air in their tires when the car tells them or they end up on the side of the road with a flat.

[Bourne2Ride]

I still can't see how PR2/PR3 are illegal on a Connie. They're touring tires designed for the weight and power of our bikes.

[jjsC6]

thanks for the responses. As some observed, the mileage in the Pilot Power will be low. They cost only 14% less but last the half, if at all, and I hate downtime. I'll go with the Angels, then. Thanks.

As to those asking about the ilegality of some tires, the German authorities deem driving in the Autobahn a more demanding situation than in other roads, and I agree to some extent. I can drive 120 miles in one hour if I want, in perfect legallity. I've done 110 miles in 40 minutes once on a lucky day without trafic or building sites. When I arrived the tires were hot. Trouly, madly, deeply hot. A run like that is equivalent to a couple of thousand miles touring around.

As Jeremy explained, the TÜV (Technischer Überwachungsverein, or Technical Inspection Agency, or MOT as they call it in England) as well as the police check that you only mount those tires that are approved for each vehicle. You can't just pop on any tire you fancy  or exhaust, or even a mirror... or you thought the German reputation for rules was a myth?

Martin, thank you for that explanation.  I learned something new!  BTW, I just bought my first German car a few months ago (BMW 550 M-Sport).  Great car, but damn those Germans have some strange ways of doing things.  I'd love to run it on the Autobahn.  90mph is so effortless and serene that it truly amazing.

[The Pope]

I still can't see how PR2/PR3 are illegal on a Connie. They're touring tires designed for the weight and power of our bikes.

It's not a weight/power issue of the bike. It's a "speed raiting" of the tire or tyre. The PR2/PR3s are "V", where as you can get the Angles in "Z".

For more info: http://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcycle-tires/tire-data.htm

[Bourne2Ride]

OK The Pope; but that doesn't make them illegal. "V" rating is good for 149 MPH sustained. Our bikes, unmodified, can barley hit 155 MPH.  A "Z" rating is overkill and unnecessary. For the type of riding the Connie was intended to do - a "V" rating is good enough.

[The Pope]

Yes, but there are some people that will run it WFO when they are on a roadway that it is legal to do so. With the legal powers that be knowing this, the best way that they can have eveyone as safe as possible is to require a tire that can handle more that the bike can achieve.

Any tire that doesn't meet the inforced requirements is illegal under their laws.

[Marco1018]

a Z rated tire is just a tire that is rated for 149+ mph depending on service description, v is for 149mph.  If you look after the tire size on the sidewall you will see something like a 78v in this case.  The stock bt021 are a z rated tire with a service description of w which is 168mph (if memory is correct).

[PH14]

I loved the Pilot Powers. I ran them on my RC51. They were my favorite tire, although I tried a Pilot Road right before I got ride of the RC since I was going to do some long distance touring. It worked very well once it was scuffed in, although the Pilot Power was better in terms of grip. The Pilot Road did very well though a and handled well.

I would be hesitant to run the Pilot Power on the Coucours though. I personally would stick withe the Angel. I have run the Angels and they work very well on the Concours. I believe they would wear much too quickly at high speed considering the weight of the Concourse. I think though that someone has posted about running the Pilot Power in the past so you may wish to look for that. That post may have been lost though.

[martin_14]

Martin, thank you for that explanation.  I learned something new!  BTW, I just bought my first German car a few months ago (BMW 550 M-Sport).  Great car, but damn those Germans have some strange ways of doing things.  I'd love to run it on the Autobahn.  90mph is so effortless and serene that it truly amazing.

Jim, I know what you mean. That's some serious kit you've got there.
I had a friend from Brazil visiting last March and he begged me to get some serious wheels and do an Autobahn run. I got a 7-Series (740d)  for the weekend and we put it at 150 mph for a few miles, you could still whisper a conversation.
My girlfriend even said (and I quote) "you can buy one if you want". She's soooo supporting... 

[Boomer]

The PR2/3 are rated W for speed which means 168Mph.
They are load rated 73 for the rear (up to 365Kg on that tyre) and 58 on the front (up to 235Kg on that tyre).
Load ratings are static measurements.

They are not TüV approved yet for the C14 so I guess you are stuck with inferior tyres. ;-)
Serves you right for living in Germany. <LOL>

It takes from 1 to 4 years for a tyre to get TüV approval for a particular bike.
They are trying to implement some such stupidity in all of the EU.
MAG EU and MAG UK are fighting it vehemently.

If I were in Germany I would take the Angels or the 023s.
The Pilot Powers will last maybe 2k miles on the rear if you behave yourself.

[martin_14]

Serves you right for living in Germany. <LOL>

 
believe me, I'm the first one interested in changing that...