Debating an R1200RT to Concours C14

[EricM]

I have owned two BMW R1200RT motorcycles, and always have had the C14 on my mind as a bike that I'd like to own. I am considering adding a C14 to the garage, or replacing my R1200RT with a C14.

I've owned an R1200RT since 2005, and always take my motorcycles to the dealership for service. I tend to ride around 30,000 miles per year, so I do 4-5 services per year. My RT costs about $1,500 per year to service. I called a few of my local Kawasaki dealers, and got a quote for a 30k mile year, and I was quoted about $3,300/year. Apparently, I'd be due for two spark plug replacement and two valve check/adjust events per year, and each one, including the other services is around $700.

Prior to my research, it was my understanding that the C14 was significantly less costly to maintain than the RT. However, my quick math shows that it's a bit more than 2x the cost per year, based on my annual mileage. To those that say that the C14 costs less to maintain, how are your numbers figured?

Also, are there any rumors circulating about a 2013 C14 coming with cruise control? The availability of cruise control would be a deciding factor for me.

Best.

[wildnphx]

I have never owned a RT but did have one for a loaner a few days while my Concours was having warranty work completed and I can say I was extremely happy to get my Concours back.  The RT is lighter but the Concours Power plant is sooooo much better in my opinion. 

As far as service I put 35k on it in the first year and the maintenance cost is not very expensive.  I did have valves done at 17k and it was a waste of money...  I skipped the spark plug change and I'm at 40k and no other maintenance other then tires and brakes.  I will probably have valve check done again at 50k and then change spark plugs at that time as well...

But for the 160hp (full muzzy, PC, etc...) and comfortable riding position I wouldn't trade it for anything...  If you go by the book and have everything done at the dealer at the exact times specified then perhaps the cost would be more....  I just know that based on dealer feedback, feedback from the forums, and the bike running so good that all those services are not needed and just a waste of money.

[lt1]

Many of us (myself included) don't see any reason to change the Iridium plugs at 7500 mile intervals.  I would check the plugs at 15k - they should last 30k w/o issues.   I would recommend the valve clearance check at 15k, but would insist that the dealer give you a clearance and shim map (actually before and after maps).  There is some indication that some dealers may not actually do the work completely.  From the reports we get from forum members, there is very little movement in the clearances after the first adjustment.  Because of the amount of plastic, etc that has to be removed to get to the plugs and valves, adjusting those intervals would drop costs dramatically.

[stevewfl]

I have owned two BMW R1200RT motorcycles, and always have had the C14 on my mind as a bike that I'd like to own. I am considering adding a C14 to the garage, or replacing my R1200RT with a C14.

I've owned an R1200RT since 2005, and always take my motorcycles to the dealership for service. I tend to ride around 30,000 miles per year, so I do 4-5 services per year. My RT costs about $1,500 per year to service. I called a few of my local Kawasaki dealers, and got a quote for a 30k mile year, and I was quoted about $3,300/year. Apparently, I'd be due for two spark plug replacement and two valve check/adjust events per year, and each one, including the other services is around $700.

Prior to my research, it was my understanding that the C14 was significantly less costly to maintain than the RT. However, my quick math shows that it's a bit more than 2x the cost per year, based on my annual mileage. To those that say that the C14 costs less to maintain, how are your numbers figured?

Also, are there any rumors circulating about a 2013 C14 coming with cruise control? The availability of cruise control would be a deciding factor for me.

Best.

Just wow! I'm doing between 25K - 30K  year and my maintenance costs are a very small fraction of that

[EricM]

Just wow! I'm doing between 25K - 30K  year and my maintenance costs are a very small fraction of that

Just to confirm, you're taking it to the dealership for these services, and you're doing all services recommended by the manufacturer? I want to be sure that we are comparing apples to apples.

I realize that some say you don't have to do 'xyz' (plugs, valves, whatever), even though the manufactuer outlines it as part of scheduled maintenance. And you know, you're probably right, you don't HAVE to. Just like on the BMW boxer motor, the valves rarely are out of adjustment.. but still, they're checked every 6k. Fortunately, it's only a 15-20 minute job. For someone like myself that is considering this motorcycle based on the 3 year, UNLIMITED mileage warranty, performing service by the book is essential. A manufacturer cannot decline warranty coverage because you did work yourself, or at another shop, as long as the record of service is good, but they CAN decline warranty coverage based on simply not doing the maintenance. Why risk it?

So am I to understand that the reason the C14 is less expensive to run than the R1200RT is because owners are skipping out on some of the maintenance items?

[556ALPHA]

You pretty much nailed it.  If you go BY THE BOOK and take it to a dealer the cost will be IMMENSE.

[TJ]

WOWSA! Tell us more about your BMW. 30,000 a year for the last 6-7 years so you are close to 200k? How is the motor holding out?

My local Kaw dealer sells both Kaw and BMW. I thought the 1200 was a really nice bike but couldnt see why it should cost about $6-7K more than the Concours.

As far as service I would have the valves checked at around 20,000, plugs changed at the same time just to be safe and because it might be easier to do at the same time. Then again at 50,000 and again at 100,000. Anything else is just gravy for your local shop.

[stevewfl]

Just to confirm, you're taking it to the dealership for these services, and you're doing all services recommended by the manufacturer? I want to be sure that we are comparing apples to apples.

I realize that some say you don't have to do 'xyz' (plugs, valves, whatever), even though the manufactuer outlines it as part of scheduled maintenance. And you know, you're probably right, you don't HAVE to. Just like on the BMW boxer motor, the valves rarely are out of adjustment.. but still, they're checked every 6k. Fortunately, it's only a 15-20 minute job. For someone like myself that is considering this motorcycle based on the 3 year, UNLIMITED mileage warranty, performing service by the book is essential. A manufacturer cannot decline warranty coverage because you did work yourself, or at another shop, as long as the record of service is good, but they CAN decline warranty coverage based on simply not doing the maintenance. Why risk it?

So am I to understand that the reason the C14 is less expensive to run than the R1200RT is because owners are skipping out on some of the maintenance items?

Valve lash checks yes the dealer performed because I lack the time and less downtime for parts (since they have every shim imaginable).  The other maintenance I've been doing.  FRACTION of the cost cited by the BMW owner.  I've been on the fence about purchasing a beemer for myself. And every time I talk to an owner or read internet posts it sets me back again. But I'll have one soon enough anyway =)

[EricM]

WOWSA! Tell us more about your BMW. 30,000 a year for the last 6-7 years so you are close to 200k? How is the motor holding out?

My local Kaw dealer sells both Kaw and BMW. I thought the 1200 was a really nice bike but couldnt see why it should cost about $6-7K more than the Concours.

As far as service I would have the valves checked at around 20,000, plugs changed at the same time just to be safe and because it might be easier to do at the same time. Then again at 50,000 and again at 100,000. Anything else is just gravy for your local shop.

I got rid of my 2005 R1200RT at 153k miles. The motor was doing great. The only non-scheduled maintenance that I performed on it was a fuel strip, as my fuel gauge went bad. I bought my 2010 R1200RT because I wanted to experience the new motor (it is a big improvement over the original R1200 motor).

I am anxious to test ride a C14. In my area, that's a bit problematic. So far, the best that I've found is "we'll let you take it around the parking lot after we have a deal in place. If you don't like what you find, we'll tear up the contract." As someone who rides multiple 500-1000 mile days per month, parking lot riding tells me almost nothing about the motorcycle, as I will ride it.

As far as the price difference is concerned, I am finding a C14 is around $16k, an an R1200RT is around $21k. But if maintenance is $1,500/year more on the C14, then after year three, the RT becomes less expensive.

Your maintenance intervals make sense. I'd hate to have a warranty claim at say 80k miles, and have Kawasaki come back and say that they won't cover it (or won't cover 100%) due to me not adhering to the maintenance schedule.

Before I get too deep into this, I really need to test ride a C14 for at least 30-45 minutes. Any suggestions amongst my peers on here how I may be able to get a dealer to allow me to do this?

[Awaz]

People who like to ride spiritedly in twisties will definitely prefer the C14. It is more of a performance oriented bike than the R1200RT. On the other hand, when I swung my leg over R1200RT, I found it more comfortable than the C14. But I already owned a C14 - so it was moot to go R1200RT. Maybe a K1600GTL - if I win that lotto!

As for maintenance cost, I do not have any idea. I did the 600 mile glorified oil change and checking bolts myself. I am coming due on my 7500 mile service and debating to do it myself. As you can see, I do not get a chance to ride that much yet. But that $3300/year cost is absolutely crazy !!

EDIT: Not able to test a bike is also a big deal for me. Fortunately, my dealer had only one C14 and he was very eager to get rid of it. So, when I showed real interest, he let me test drive. I took it out to the highway and rode it for at least 30 min before bringing it back. But I found out later, this is unusual for a dealer to do. BMW gets kudos for this aspect. As for test ride, I have a 2008 and if you live anywhere near central Illinois, you are welcome to come and try out mine Maybe we can swap ride.

[stevewfl]

+1,

If you're near Tampa you can ride my C14 any time

[W14]

Regarding a test ride, find a dealer with a used one.

[jayke]

Maybe you want to check out the factory Kawasaki demo rides if its close to you.  The Concours ABS is at the bottom of the list

Link: http://goodtimesstreetdemodays.kawasaki.com/home/

[Sparkie]

Eric, something else to consider is the increased weight and horsepower of the C14 means you'll be changing tires much more often on the Kawasaki. Some people can go through a rear tire pretty darn quick. Now I know that varies between different riders and how aggresive they ride. Mark

[Mister Tee]

I had a 2008 1200RT, which I put roughly 50,000 miles on.  My observations:

1.  Low speed handling - The RT is much easier, it's a lighter bike with a tighter turning radius.

2.  High speed handling - C14 wins hands down.  BMW's paralever front suspension is an asset in that it eliminates the need for a heavy front headstock in the frame (actually it eliminates the need for a full frame) and it allows for a tighter turning lock.  It does, however, have a lot of unsprung weight and it is not as solid at high speed and in high leans as the inverted fork C14 suspension.

3.  Maintenance costs - I do my own routine maintenance.  The level of difficulty is roughly the same between the two on everything except plugs, valve adjusts and final drive fluid changes.  Plugs and valve adjusts are a royal beeotch but you aren't doing those very often (I'm not.)  Final drive oil changes are a non event on the C14.  A clutch replacement on a C14 is a breeze.  A clutch replacement on an RT involves tearing apart the entire bike and splitting it in two.  FAR more expensive than a C14 valve adjust, which probaby may only need to be done once in the bike's life.  I've spent a whole lot more on RT maintenance than C14 maintenance.

4.  Mileage - on the flat slab, mileage is roughly the same.  Open the throttle, and the C14's mileage is significantly lower.

5.  Handling hot days - I've never overheated on 100+ degree days at stops on the C14.  But, I've never done so on the RT either.

6.  Reliability - My RT used to cut out randomly and it ran like crap on cold days until it warmed up.  Sometimes cold starts were a problem.  Sometimes hot starts were a problem.  No issues with the C14.  Other things, like fuel gauges, displays, etc... have performed flawlessly so far on the C14.  Not so much on the RT.  Especially the notorious fuel strip.

7.  Cruise control - I really, really liked the cruise control on the RT.  The lack of it was nearly a deal killer for me when I got the C14 but at the same time I'm not ordinarily spending as much time on the freeway as I used to on the RT.

[jjsC6]

Buy the one you like the best.  As others have said, Kawasaki Maintenance is way over rated.  I had my valves checked at 29,000 miles and none of them needed it.  Spark plugs today need to be changed about every 100,000 miles, except that it's a no-brainer to do them when you do a valve check.  Everything else on the bike is simple.

[maxtog]

You pretty much nailed it.  If you go BY THE BOOK and take it to a dealer the cost will be IMMENSE.

Exactly.  The big difference here is that Kawasaki has put in some unreasonably high requirements that just about everyone on this list confirms.  BWM is probably more realistic about when things need to be done.

Perfect example are plugs and valves-  In the rest of the world, the FACTORY RECOMMENDED interval for the Concours 14 is much, much higher.  There is no logic in it having to be done any sooner.

[maxtog]

Before I get too deep into this, I really need to test ride a C14 for at least 30-45 minutes. Any suggestions amongst my peers on here how I may be able to get a dealer to allow me to do this?

That is, indeed, a problem.  The Concours is a big, powerful, expensive bike.  And they don't sell that many of them compared to the droves of 600's and chrome jobs.  Many dealerships don't even have one on the floor at all- and if they do, it is typically just one.  Looking at the overhead and liability, it can be REALLY difficult for a dealership to take that kind of risk.   If it is damaged- who will pay?  And it can't be sold as "new".... and a little too much mileage on it, also not new.

The dealer I bought my ZRX-1100 from DID let me test drive it for 20 minutes, which REALLY shocked me.  9 years later, they were not willing to let me test drive the Concours.  And all they had on the floor was a black one, so I wouldn't buy that one anyway.  The best I could do was sit on it, play with all the controls, and then take a huge leap of faith and order a silver one that they had to get from another dealer far away.

[maxtog]

Your maintenance intervals make sense. I'd hate to have a warranty claim at say 80k miles, and have Kawasaki come back and say that they won't cover it (or won't cover 100%) due to me not adhering to the maintenance schedule.

Eric, this is a valid concern, but has also been discussed on this board numerous times.  Kawasaki cannot deny a warranty claim unless they have reasonable proof that the lack of the *recommended* scheduled service work directly caused or contributed to the failure.  This is a high burden of proof on their part.  And I have *never* seen a posting on this forum that indicated warranty was denied based on the two most expensive/pain-in-the-butt things on the C14:  valve adjustments or spark plugs.  Plugs are almost a non-issue from risk of damage.  Valve lash is more of a concern, but as I said in other postings, at a minimum, you can go by the non-USA schedule; and many, many people are willing to go much further.

[stevewfl]

I don't care what I do to my bike, it won't be $3300 a year maintenance.

I'm surprised if any truly suggest a jap inline 4 bike costs as much to maintain as a beemer or duc.

Again I'll have a new euro bike, but accepting it'll cost more to run.