Ducati may have gotten Kipass right...

[Mad River Marc]

Well,  given how the current activation switch works (Fires a ground when engaged IIRC),  couldn't we develop something like that?  Perhaps use the headlight as a reference?'

For example,  you activate the system and then start the engine,  once the headlight comes on it latches a relay, then if you shut the key off and the headlight goes off,  but the kipass switch stays grounded it doesn't let the relay open and engages a buzzer???

Just thinking

[Shadowofshoe]

I'm not concerned with what Ducati did, but KAWASAKI got KiPass RIGHT on 99.9999% of the C14s.

Even though the new BMW K1600GT FOB controls the luggage and all, still it has not the MAD POW-AH of the mighty KiPass we own

OK, corrected for my friend Bob

 My 05 KLT fob controlled luggage as well,nice feature as well as when not locked ,it's not locked.
    Mike

[B.D.F.]

I already did that- it was improved and documented by Fred here: http://cog-online.org/clubportal/clubstatic.cfm?clubID=1328&pubmenuoptID=29563  My original scheme worked the same way but was wired into the fuel tank harness; Fred's method is easier to install. I will be discussing this at the C-14 electrical 'thingy' at the COG National in VT.

The system sounds a buzzer whenever the headlights are on but the fuel pump is off; that situation can only occur when the bike has been shut down in some manner other than using the key. It is the identical system I would use in the logic state of the ECU but requires no ECU connection or interaction.

 I have left the ignition on myself several times by killing the bike with the side stand when parking on an incline and forgetting to turn the key off. I believe KiPass tends to 'train' us to ignore the key when we walk away from the bike and so exacerbates this problem.

This is the second re-work I came up with for KiPass, the first was a bypass for the activation switch itself.

Given these two improvements, KiPass becomes more than unstoppable and will eventually contribute to ending world hunger. We just have to work hard to avoid any bias. (that was humor for those who are laughter impaired). 

Brian

Well,  given how the current activation switch works (Fires a ground when engaged IIRC),  couldn't we develop something like that?  Perhaps use the headlight as a reference?'

For example,  you activate the system and then start the engine,  once the headlight comes on it latches a relay, then if you shut the key off and the headlight goes off,  but the kipass switch stays grounded it doesn't let the relay open and engages a buzzer???

Just thinking

[Mad River Marc]

Well, you could expand on that to not only warn you if the key is left on, but also could warn you if the key is off and the activation switch is left in a "depressed" state, perhaps include a push button somewhere (Easier then a fuse) that someone can use on the side of the road to start the bike and not be stranded. 

[CrashGordon]

Unfortunately Ducati does not sell enough bikes to give us much data on the number of failures but it will be interesting to watch.

Oh don't worry. As a former Ducati owner I can tell you that if it has to do with electronics, no one can fail like Ducati!

Now, maybe we should put the Kipass disagreement business behind us and bask in the happy knowledge that it likely never come up again.

[B.D.F.]

Now that right there is funny. 

Brian

<snip>

Now, maybe we should put the Kipass disagreement business behind us and bask in the happy knowledge that it likely never come up again.

[B.D.F.]

I am not quite following you but these are two different systems and cannot be integrated. One is an active device wired between two separate systems on the bike (ign. buzzer) while the other is a totally passive thing wired in series with one system on the bike (the bypass).

Just a thought but it would probably be better to start a dedicated thread about either subject above as we are starting to stray from both Ducatis and KiPass (although I stand by my belief that a KiPass thread cannot be ruined).

Brian

Well, you could expand on that to not only warn you if the key is left on, but also could warn you if the key is off and the activation switch is left in a "depressed" state, perhaps include a push button somewhere (Easier then a fuse) that someone can use on the side of the road to start the bike and not be stranded.

[Kirby]

Wow, you humans are excitable! I try never to get that worked up unless something threatens my nuts....

Kirby

[Awaz]

I do remember your KiPass issues from the old forum. And I can understand your frustration that it is so random, stranded you multiple times. I have a issue with my F150 that would make this horrible high pitch noise when is freezing outside. Took it to dealer multiple times, yet they cannot recreate it. Finally I decided to live with it. But I still like F150 and will buy another if I can afford. Although, I understand in your case you cannot. And getting stranded like that will make most people swore off their bike. But one thing I sure do not understand...when finally the dealer was able to recreate it and was willing to give the switch a good cleaning, why did not you let them at least try it? Forgive me if I am remembering this wrong. That would be their first step to fixing it. I would not expect them to change the whole system out in the first try. After all, they are in business to make money. Changing the system from the get go will be bad business for them. Just trying to understand.

[VirginiaJim]

Sorry, guys, had to edit a few things out...

[Bob]

I do remember your KiPass issues from the old forum. And I can understand your frustration that it is so random, stranded you multiple times. I have a issue with my F150 that would make this horrible high pitch noise when is freezing outside. Took it to dealer multiple times, yet they cannot recreate it. Finally I decided to live with it. But I still like F150 and will buy another if I can afford. Although, I understand in your case you cannot. And getting stranded like that will make most people swore off their bike. But one thing I sure do not understand...when finally the dealer was able to recreate it and was willing to give the switch a good cleaning, why did not you let them at least try it? Forgive me if I am remembering this wrong. That would be their first step to fixing it. I would not expect them to change the whole system out in the first try. After all, they are in business to make money. Changing the system from the get go will be bad business for them. Just trying to understand.

I did. I had complained for three years about the switch. Kawasaki will not make any repairs unless the dealer verifies the complaint. But the switch would work every time I brought the bike in (be it on a trailer or ridden in). You get tired hearing the same old BS of we have to verify the failure before we can get the OK from Kawasaki, to work on the KIPASS! When the finally were able to verify the problem when it wouldn't work at all. Kawasaki told them to just clean the original parts that were failing at three months old. The bike was now three years old. At this point had many incidents with the switch, mostly kept in check with lots of silicone lube. It took three years for Kawasaki to be able to verify a probelm and repair this.  Only cleaning the parts that failed when new was unacceptable to me! Had they told me that they even just replaced the spring, it might have been different. No, just clean the old parts that failed when new and (sometimes frequently, sometimes not so often) ever since. If you have no trust in your motorcycle, it's time for it to go.
 Do I hate Kawasaki or the Concours14? Not at all. Although I'm not happy with Kawasaki's handling of this. I still recommend the bike to people. I still own my other two Kawasaki's at this point. Although, I will think long and hard before I buy another Kawasaki (mainly the C14) at this point. But I would never say that I would never buy another! Never say never!

[RBX QB]

Oh don't worry. As a former Ducati owner I can tell you that if it has to do with electronics, no one can fail like Ducati!

Now, maybe we should put the Kipass disagreement business behind us and bask in the happy knowledge that it likely never come up again.

We goin' after Ducs now?!  My Duc is my "simple" bike (comparatively speaking), pretty much just seat, wheels and motor... and a few lights.

Like others have said, some of Ducati's improvements to keyless ignition seem like good ideas. I look forward to learning how those things weather in time.

I did find that I cannot remove my stove pipe key when my hands are wet. Not really a KiPass thing, but it did make me think of these "discussions" when I was grabbing the thing for the 4th time unsuccessfully. I found drying my hand first helped with that little issue, tho I should prolly find some of that lock lube stuff (insert joke here).


My attempt at a politically neutral rant:

Keyless ignition, regardless of manufacturer, is technology. Technology, over as wide enough sample of users, tends to "fail" from time to time. It's a pure statistics thing (and I suck at math). The term "vocal minority" comes to mind. If I were on the receiving end of a failure, I'd be mad, and vocal. But I'd also be in the minority. The experience would likely sour me to the product, and it's manufacturer. But, I'd still be in the minority. If I had taken all of your accounts as gospel before I bought my C14, I probably wouldn't have bought it at all. There are a lot of "scary" failures on the pages of this forum. But, I DIDN'T take everything as law, tho it all helped inform my decision. So far, no regrets. If something happens, I'll deal with it in the best manner possible (but I'm sure anger will be in there somewhere). So, I look forward to the continuing reports of issues, so I can add that to the list of things I should be aware of as bi C14 and I continue our trips together.

[JhVenezuela]

Last week i had a dream !!!!!

My lovely connie had a simple key, the kipass had been disappear.

Was wonderful, marvellous 

[stevewfl]

Last week i had a dream !!!!!

My lovely connie had a simple key, the kipass had been disappear.

Was wonderful, marvellous 

For me thats an utter  nightmare. Only reason mine made it to 41,000 miles in a little over a year is KiPass

[B.D.F.]

 

Sometimes I think you are the only person who really understands what a 'larger than life' thing KiPass has become Steve.

Brian

For me thats an utter  nightmare. Only reason mine made it to 41,000 miles in a little over a year is KiPass

[Bourne2Ride]

Off topic, The Diavel is sexy sweet! Do I need a bike like the Ducati Diavel, Nope; but I want a bike like the Ducati Diavel.
On Topic, KiPass appeals to the geek in me. I love it.

[rcannon409]

Kipass is fine so far, but so are keys.  Now, I look forward to the day when my fingerprints, retinas, penis prints, whatever.......will suffice. But until then, give me a key, please.

[RBX QB]

... penis prints, whatever...

Ummm... Makes me think of that scene in Blazing Saddles... "Excuse me, while I whip this out."

[B.D.F.]

That brings up the question of what you think the verification device will look like? And where do you think it will be mounted (figuratively speaking)?

If I send you a key will you promise to keep all those things you mentioned away from me?

This thread has taken an ominous turn for the worse. It was a bit nasty but this is downright scary.... 

Brian

Kipass is fine so far, but so are keys.  Now, I look forward to the day when my fingerprints, retinas, penis prints, whatever.......will suffice. But until then, give me a key, please.

[CADMAN97]

Kipass is fine so far, but so are keys.  Now, I look forward to the day when my fingerprints, retinas, penis prints, whatever.......will suffice. But until then, give me a key, please.