Veteran rider seeking advice on the reliability of the C14 from owners

[Conniesaki]

I took it that he meant it was a lower HP version of the 1352cc engine, since the ZX14 is such a well known model.  All you said was very true, and I agree that the engine performs exactly as intended.  The most exciting engine I've ever owned was in a ZZR 1200.  Loads of fun over 100MPH, not so much under that speed.

I think these are 1441cc? Either way, the C14 is de-tuned ... or the ZX14R is up-tuned? Or pro-tuned? I dunno. Either way, both are very fast.

[tomp]

I think these are 1441cc? Either way, the C14 is de-tuned ... or the ZX14R is up-tuned? Or pro-tuned? I dunno. Either way, both are very fast.

I didn't put an R on the XR14 I mentioned, as I was talking about the earlier Gen, with the same size engine.   Sorry, sold them, know the difference.   tomp

[Conniesaki]

I didn't put an R on the XR14 I mentioned, as I was talking about the earlier Gen, with the same size engine.   Sorry, sold them, know the difference.   tomp

Oh, right ... gotcha.

[maxtog]

I think these are 1441cc? Either way, the C14 is de-tuned ... or the ZX14R is up-tuned? Or pro-tuned? I dunno. Either way, both are very fast.

"Tuned" (tune) means to set something up for a certain goal.  The relevant dictionary meanings are:

"to adjust (a motor, mechanism, or the like) for proper functioning."
"to bring into proper operating order, as a motor"
"to change the setting of particular parts of an engine so that it works as well as possible"

The C14 is not "de-tuned" nor does it have a "de-tuned" ZX engine.  "de-tuned" in general implies it is not optimized for anything in particular, or is not in proper working order, and has a distinctly negative connotation.  It is most certainly tuned, but not for peak hp.   The ZX, on the other hand, is tuned primarily for peak hp/performance.  Everything in life is a tradeoff.  The C-14's primary goal is not primarily peak performance at the expense of everything else.... if it were, I (and probably many others) wouldn't have been nearly as interested in it (and Kawasaki would also not be able offer a 3+3+3 warranty either....  or at least not at this price).

Semantics, yes.... but the C14 isn't "inferior" to the ZX because different design goals using mostly the same engine.  And most of the time I see the "de-tuned" reference, it seems to imply just that- inferior.

I certainly agree that both are quite fast.... certainly fast enough for me

[tomp]

"Tuned" means to set something up for a certain goal.  The C14 is not de-tuned.  "de-tuned" in general implies it is not optimized for anything in particular, and has a distinctly negative connotation.  It is most certainly tuned, but not for peak hp.   The ZX, on the other hand, is tuned primarily for peak hp/performance.  Everything in life is a tradeoff.  The C-14's primary goal is not peak performance at the expense of everything else.... if it were, I (and probably many others) wouldn't have been nearly as interested in it (and Kawasaki would also not be able offer a 3+3+3 warranty either....  or at least not at this price).

I certainly agree that both are quite fast.... certainly fast enough for me

There ya go, getting it totally correct again.  160bhp ( the old description) is a b*tt load for a touring bike.  #1 is the RT, and it has finally made it to 125bhp.  Kawi, with the ZZR1200 and now the C14, is years ahead of the BMW boxer program.  Can't compare the K1300GT or K1600GT(L), at so many thousands of dollars more, for an equal, or a few HP.  Even if I could afford a new Beemer, I would keep the Gen l 14, because It just feels right to me... tp. 

[maxtog]

There ya go, getting it totally correct again.  160bhp ( the old description) is a b*tt load for a touring bike.  #1 is the RT, and it has finally made it to 125bhp.  Kawi, with the ZZR1200 and now the C14, is years ahead of the BMW boxer program.  Can't compare the K1300GT or K1600GT(L), at so many thousands of dollars more, for a an equal or few HP more.  Even if I could afford a new Beemer, I would keep the Gen l 14, because It just feels right to me... tp.

The kicker seems to be that, with the BMW's you get less power AND less reliability, all with a much higher price tag both up front and for maintenance.  (Disclaimer:  I have no direct experience with BMW bikes, only formulating generalities from years of reading posts and comments).  But they do have other things going for them- generally more features, high resale value, good handling, etc.  I wasn't even comparing to the 1600- since I don't even consider it in the same class (I mean it is like 50% more expensive or something like that; if price were no object, all kinds of possibilities open up).

[tomp]

Max, the K1600 has the same basic HP and TQ as our 14's.  Beemers have lots of bells and whistles on them for a higher price,  compared to ours.  The main positive for Beemers is that they handle better/more neutrally than our Kawi's,  at speed.   This I know, after owning four of them.  Extremely flickable in the twisties, and the weight factor disappears above 10mph.   

On straights, the R's are left behind a 14.  Both K's are pretty equal with acceleration.  In the  twisties, the R will leave us in their dust, and the K's will run neck n neck.  On along straight, we leave the R's way back in our rear view mirrors.  Done it many times. 

I love riding my R, for the above noted  and other qualities, but the 14, is such a muscle machine, it raises my testosterone level 50%, when riding.  At my age, that is a God send. . .tp

[maxtog]

the [C]14, is such a muscle machine, it raises my testosterone level 50%, when riding.  At my age, that is a God send. . .tp

Be careful with that testosterone raising
I tend to just get jolts of adrenaline... which probably zaps several days of life off my life expectancy each time. :/  Maybe I would fare better if I had the riding skills of you or Conniesaki.  I seem really slow to improve.  On a good note, that means I probably will never "outgrow" the C14 in any metric.

[mikeeitup]

Hey man it's totally doable. I bought my C14 with 18K on it for only 5 grand. It need a tiny bit of work so for a couple hundred more I have a super reliable monster of a machine. As far as an only vehicle, you're gonna wanna maybe invest in a custom seat with a heater for the chillier days. I would recommend also switching tires for ones that handle rain better for your situation. I have been riding a VTX1300 cruiser up until this bike and I can easily say I am never looking back. What's your commute lookin like?

[tomp]

Be careful with that testosterone raising
I tend to just get jolts of adrenaline... which probably zaps several days of life off my life expectancy each time. :/

At my age, 64, I am more into the testosterone than adding days to my life.  My dad, 98, has shown me that a testosterone  thrill is better than sitting in a chair 12 hours a day, just waiting to join my mother.  Not for me, no da*n way. . .  Remember the movie "Vanishing Point", with Barry Newman?  If not, find it and watch.  That's me...tp

[wcgreen]

Hey man it's totally doable. I bought my C14 with 18K on it for only 5 grand. It need a tiny bit of work so for a couple hundred more I have a super reliable monster of a machine. As far as an only vehicle, you're gonna wanna maybe invest in a custom seat with a heater for the chillier days. I would recommend also switching tires for ones that handle rain better for your situation. I have been riding a VTX1300 cruiser up until this bike and I can easily say I am never looking back. What's your commute lookin like?

Nice! What year is your C14?  What did you need to do to it?  Good price for that.  Hard to say for what my commute will be... Lots of housing near campus there in Tuscaloosa, so likely will be 10 minutes at the most.  Probably live fairly close to school, and then drive once a month to see my dad in a nursing home in Pensacola and meet my wife there as well if not come all the way to Jacksonville.  The more I read from you guys, the more I am wanting this bike!!

[wcgreen]

I have a 2010 with 55,000+ miles on it. Oil changes, tires and a couple sets of brake pads. It will be 4 years old in January. Still under warranty until January 2017. These bikes are very solid and trouble free. I have had 3 of them. I have had a couple sets of warped rotors replaced under warranty between the 3 bikes. Good luck! I am trading in a 2012 Yamaha FJR 1300 towards a 2012 Kawasaki Concours this week. That'll be C-14 #4.

Are those warranties transferrable?  So, if  purchase an 2010 in the spring or fall of 2015... which is what I am hoping to get, the warranty will transfer over to me?  If so, it's just gravy on top of my biscuit!

[Deziner]

Kowalski?! Kowalski, is that you?

[jwh20]

I wouldn't say it is "de-tuned".  It is tuned exactly for what it is meant to do- be smooth, quiet, efficient, shifting torque lower, and to be very reliable.  And it has variable valve timing that the ZX doesn't have at all.

That isn't "de", it is just "different" tuning for a different type of bike for a different set of criteria.

Ok, since we're hair-splitting here, how about RE-TUNED?  It is basically the same engine and I've not been able to detect any significant difference added by the C14's VVT.  From my perspective the ZX-14 makes power every bit as smoothly as the C14 just loads more of it.

[Conniesaki]

"Tuned" (tune) means to set something up for a certain goal.  The relevant dictionary meanings are:

"to adjust (a motor, mechanism, or the like) for proper functioning."
"to bring into proper operating order, as a motor"
"to change the setting of particular parts of an engine so that it works as well as possible"

The C14 is not "de-tuned" nor does it have a "de-tuned" ZX engine.  "de-tuned" in general implies it is not optimized for anything in particular, or is not in proper working order, and has a distinctly negative connotation.  It is most certainly tuned, but not for peak hp.   The ZX, on the other hand, is tuned primarily for peak hp/performance.  Everything in life is a tradeoff.  The C-14's primary goal is not primarily peak performance at the expense of everything else.... if it were, I (and probably many others) wouldn't have been nearly as interested in it (and Kawasaki would also not be able offer a 3+3+3 warranty either....  or at least not at this price).

Semantics, yes.... but the C14 isn't "inferior" to the ZX because different design goals using mostly the same engine.  And most of the time I see the "de-tuned" reference, it seems to imply just that- inferior.

I certainly agree that both are quite fast.... certainly fast enough for me

Isn't the C14 inferior to the ZX in terms of overall HP? And wasn't it designed / tuned that way?

[twowheeladdict]

Isn't the C14 inferior to the ZX in terms of overall HP? And wasn't it designed / tuned that way?

And does the zx even have the variable valve timing?

[tomp]

In the 50's and 60's, Chevrolet built the 283 CI V8, used in many of their models.  HP ranged from 185 to 315, using the same basic block design, but the HP and TQ numbers were changed to fit the vehicle's intended use, Bel Air or Corvette.

Same with the 1352 CC Kawi engine.  The engine characteristics were changed for it's intended use, Hyper/Super Sport or Sport Touring.   Ducati does the same thing. The same 1199cc engine may produce anywhere from 150 to now over 200 HP, depending on the model in which  it is slated to be used.  That doesn't make the 150 HP model inferior to the 200, just set up for the need of a particular motorcycle.    Same with KTM's LC4 and RC8 engines.   

[Rhino]

In the 50's and 60's, Chevrolet built the 283 CI V8, used in many of their models.  HP ranged from 185 to 315, using the same basic block design, but the HP and TQ numbers were changed to fit the vehicle's intended use, Bel Air or Corvette.

Same with the 1352 CC Kawi engine.  The engine characteristics were changed for it's intended use, Hyper/Super Sport or Sport Touring.   Ducati does the same thing. The same 1199cc engine may produce anywhere from 150 to now over 200 HP, depending on the model in which  it is slated to be used.  That doesn't make the 150 HP model inferior to the 200, just set up for the need of a particular motorcycle.    Same with KTM's LC4 and RC8 engines.   

Exactly! 

[jimmymac]

And does the zx even have the variable valve timing?

Nope. And still has more power everywhere.

[maxtog]

Isn't the C14 inferior to the ZX in terms of overall HP? And wasn't it designed / tuned that way?

Isn't the ZX inferior to the C14 in terms of overall comfort, features, capacity, and reliability?   (I prefer to answer the question with a question)

So which is "inferior" to the other?  Answer- it depends on the metric being considered.... and that is not always peak power.