Author Topic: Uneven tire wear question  (Read 13909 times)

Offline stevewfl

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #20 on: December 20, 2013, 07:48:15 AM »
this guy is having the same question about his wear:

“The World is a book, and those who do not travel read only a page.” St. Augustine

Offline maxtog

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #21 on: December 20, 2013, 04:11:52 PM »
we ride/drive on the left side of the road [...] road crown isn't the issue, but i think roads and highways are built with a lot more left turns than right turns.  If a highway ramp is supposed to let road users travel to the right, the ramp will be built with a 270 degree left turn (over-head bridge or underpass) to bring the road users to the right direction.

The exact opposite here.  Almost all on and off ramps are right hand and produce much more wear on the right side of the tires.  Like there/your observations, it doesn't matter that the road crowns would  produce wear on the other side, it is the side with the onramps and offramps (slips as the Brits call them) that seem to impart more total wear.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline stevewfl

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #22 on: December 20, 2013, 04:33:04 PM »
my left side wears out 1st and my on-off ramps are right sided.  When I see the groove in my tire I run the other side of the lane (and on the opposite side of the visable crown) on the suberslab and let it chew that up =)
“The World is a book, and those who do not travel read only a page.” St. Augustine

Offline maxtog

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #23 on: December 20, 2013, 04:57:53 PM »
my left side wears out 1st and my on-off ramps are right sided.

Must be regional road differences or type of riding or something.  All three of my bikes have always shown more wear on the right side, regardless of tire type.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline stevewfl

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #24 on: December 20, 2013, 05:54:56 PM »
Must be regional road differences or type of riding or something.  All three of my bikes have always shown more wear on the right side, regardless of tire type.

yeah, I'll get some pics of mine - the tire I have on it now is cupping on the left already
“The World is a book, and those who do not travel read only a page.” St. Augustine

Offline Conniesaki

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #25 on: December 20, 2013, 10:39:45 PM »
My RC51's tires are cupping right down the middle, because here in Florida we go dead straight. That is all we do. That is all we can do.

Offline maxtog

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #26 on: December 21, 2013, 07:01:52 AM »
My RC51's tires are cupping right down the middle, because here in Florida we go dead straight. That is all we do. That is all we can do.

If you ever travel on freeways/interstates, I assume you have on and off ramps there...
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline stevewfl

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #27 on: December 21, 2013, 07:04:22 AM »
My RC51's tires are cupping right down the middle, because here in Florida we go dead straight. That is all we do. That is all we can do.

In FL I ride on the right side of the lane, but tend to ride the right side of the crown in the road.  I'll get a pic of the left side of my tire with a big wear gas.  I need to ride in the middle of the lane i guess, but thats where MOST oil and crap is, I never ride there.

There are some of the best curves in the world in FL if one take the effort to to ride Daytona, Homestead Miaimi, JenningsGP, etc.  But i ride all over the country and hang around FL mostly in winter.
“The World is a book, and those who do not travel read only a page.” St. Augustine

Offline spatten

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #28 on: December 21, 2013, 07:52:52 AM »
You take left turns faster and more aggressively because you have more visibility because you are on the outside of the turn. 

Right turns in the US are tighter and you can't see very far ahead because you are on the inside of the turn.

Offline Rhino

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #29 on: December 21, 2013, 09:48:57 AM »
 :popcorn: This is almost as much fun as an oil thread ;D

Son of Pappy

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #30 on: December 21, 2013, 09:57:58 AM »
You take left turns faster and more aggressively because you have more visibility because you are on the outside of the turn. 

Right turns in the US are tighter and you can't see very far ahead because you are on the inside of the turn.
Late Apex is a late Apex, regardless of direction.  Riding on the road I hold outside to the point I can see my exit point/line.

Still sticking with road crown ;D

Oil thread?  Sounds more like a tire thread to me ;)  I wonder how a car tire would compare to the OPs tire?  Maybe he should give one a try :P

Offline datsaxman@hotmail.com

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2013, 03:19:53 PM »
Well, Chet...

I though you didn't like my CAR TIRE...

I would never recommend he try a CT...even though I have (another) one on my own C10.


NOW this is a tire thread...


saxman
2008 ZG14X...ZX14 throttle bodies, full AreaP exhaust, heated grips, Corbin, and more...
161.5RWHP on the dyno
Formerly Silverdammit!

Son of Pappy

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #32 on: December 21, 2013, 03:54:25 PM »
Well, Chet...

I though you didn't like my CAR TIRE...

I would never recommend he try a CT...even though I have (another) one on my own C10.


NOW this is a tire thread...


saxman
;)

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #33 on: December 21, 2013, 04:59:28 PM »
Left hand turns cover more distance than right hand turns hence more wear to left side of tire.

wayyyyy back before the "crash" of the original site, I went thru and posted calculated distances the bike travels thru pretty much every scenario a tire travels, on 2, 4, and divided highway lanes, around various radii common on highway systems.
I found that even though there IS a difference in time spent on a left hand curve, the distance travelled DOES NOT corrolate to the marked wear percentages we see on our treads. When you see tires with almost no wear on the right side, and the tread worn out on the left, based on the calc's I posted then, (highest "differences" were actually in town,city traffic, on 2 lane streets, where the distance travelled was about 20% more for left turns) comparatively distances spent on the left side did not jive with the 50% more wear.

This coupled with the tire wear observed when I wrote the comparo, and the pronounced road crown I travelled on in Va. at the time... I say it IS road crown.

multiple sets of my treads.




another set



and yet another set



more sets




i've only scraped a peg once on the C14 (in 6 years), and it was on a right hand turn.... and I don't have chicken strips.(now)
I have my last set of tires in the garage, they look the same, so out of 5 sets of discarded tires so far, with new ones on currently,

I say road crown.


I found the data I wrote back in 2010, before the "crash of the old site", it is mathmatical, and does support that the distance travelled around a turn does not support the wear we see...it's a direct response to that damned article written saying it can't be crown....
here:

.
.
.
."it's a good read, and has some merit, but I still don't buy his whole shpeil...it doesn't explain
a 75% difference in my tire wear unless you tell me I make a great amount more left turns than right,
and that don't wash in my commuting, seeing as EVERY freeway exit/entrance here is a RIGHT
hand turn....and I abuse them at great excelleration/decelleration vectors....
 
based on hypothetical 2 lane roads, with 10 foot lanes, and centerline radii of various dimensions,
the following will show distance traveled riding 4 ft off the centerline (to either side, left lane or right lane) compared to riding the exact edge
of the road both right, and left hand turns
rad@centerline-----4ft off C/Rt----4ft off C/Lft------- % diff---- R edge----L edge-------% diff
------60ft-------------87.9 ft----------106.5 ft-----14.3%--- 78.5 ft-----110 ft------40.12%
-----100ft------------150.8 ft---------163.4 ft-----8.4%---- 141.4ft-----172.8ft----22.2%
-----150ft------------229.3 ft----------241.9 ft----5.5%---- 219.9 ft----251.3ft----14.3%
-----200ft------------307.9 ft----------320.4 ft----4.1%---- 298.5 ft----329.9ft----10.5%
I try to ride in that "4 foot zone" when safe, in an attempt to keep tire wear down,
this still does not explain why I have 75% more wear on my tires left side.
Roads that are lower speed (35mph rated), with tight turns(50-60 ft rad.), in MY State,
 tend to be highly crowned and seldom banked as a deterrant to speeders. On larger radiused turns
with higher speed ratings, and less crowning they are basically flat, I still never get leaned over that far at posted speed limits
to warrent the tire wear I see.
I still blame it on highly crowned & tight radius turns.

ymmv"
« Last Edit: December 21, 2013, 05:58:53 PM by MAN OF BLUES »

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline spatten

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2013, 07:59:41 PM »
I do agree that road crown makes a difference, but just near the very center of the tire.  If you don't just focus on the touring type, where you only see a narrow strip of wear near the center of the tire, you can observe more about overall tire wear.  Look at aggressive sport riders' tires and you'll generally see far more wear higher up on the tread, where crown does not have so much effect, and it is still more often heavy left wear than right, from my observations. 

When cornering hard, road crown going left actually creates negative camber and less friction/heat/wear than right turns.

There are two things that I believe create more left side wear when sport riding:

1. It's harder to turn and accelerate aggressively when you have your weight on the throttle hand.  This would be along a continuum for different skills or aggressiveness.  It takes much more skill to work the throttle well when turning right.  The exception is racers with really strong stomach muscles and grip with their legs, and not too many of us fall in that camp.

2. 
Quote
Late Apex is a late Apex, regardless of direction.  Riding on the road I hold outside to the point I can see my exit point/line.

Still sticking with road crown ;D

If you take the same road curve in both directions the left turn is a bigger arc (radius) than the right turn, in the US.  You go faster in larger radius turn than a smaller radius turn and it's harder on tires.  You apex at a higher rate of speed if the curve radius is larger, all other factors being equal.

Son of Pappy

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #35 on: December 21, 2013, 08:42:27 PM »
 :popcorn: ;)

Offline stevewfl

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #36 on: December 21, 2013, 10:59:13 PM »
MAN OF BLUES, thankd for the pic and explanation.  Now i won;t have to take pics of my tire I had promised.  Extreme crown on roads I ride too
“The World is a book, and those who do not travel read only a page.” St. Augustine

Offline Scaffolder

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #37 on: December 22, 2013, 06:34:17 AM »
I travel New England states and have huge crowns. Any country road up here is extreme. They try hard to get water off these roads.
Joel from Maine.

Offline maxtog

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #38 on: December 22, 2013, 06:22:24 PM »
All three of my bikes have always shown more wear on the right side, regardless of tire type.

It is now time for a partial retraction.  I have not looked CAREFULLY at the front tire in a while on the Concours.  It now has THREE flat spots, one on each side and on the center.  Very odd looking.  I think the right side might be slightly more wear, but I can't tell for sure.  This is the stock OEM tire still [yeesh].

The rear tire doesn't seem to suffer from any side flat spots.  It is a wide arc of wear with the typical center flat spot.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline gPink

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Re: Uneven tire wear question
« Reply #39 on: December 22, 2013, 06:32:45 PM »
max, we've been telling you to dump the stones.