Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: ninjawarrior1400 on October 05, 2011, 07:47:41 AM
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With speculation of a larger engine block on the new ZX-14R being released next Monday, it seems likely that Kawasaki will follow suit and make only one sized engine block to fit into both the C-14 and the new ZX-14R in the future. I think around 1441cc is the future engine size and about 584 pounds and about $14,699.00.
So......sometime in the future we may see an increase in power in the C-14 too, with a larger engine. From a manufacturing standpoint and wanting to sell more bikes, Kawasaki I think will want to have the largest engines in their two top flagship bikes, as they do now........the C-14 Concourse, and the ZX-14R.
This should help stimulate new sales, help the economy, and help keep Kawasaki turning out the technological improvements we all love to see as things get more dynamic in the motorcycle riding industry.
First there was the C-10, then the C-14 which was a very big jump in engine size, maybe a C-15 is in the near future?
Kawasaki marketing may be interested in making the BMW folks look over their shoulders!
What do you guys think?
How many of us would sell or trade our C-14's to get another 50 horsepower in the C-14?
If they really want to sell more bikes, get rid of linked braking, add cruise control, and self cancelling turn signal indicators as standard equipment........!!
Ninja
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I think that Kawasaki will make great use of this targeted sales ploy, as guys like me will happily trade in the 14 they own outright on a 15. Will be watching closely for news.
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If only to compete with the BMW 1600GT. Our engine with 1500 CC can more than match the big bimmer.
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I wonder/would be willing to bet they will increase stroke and maybe bore to get the increase. What I'm interested in is what will cross over to our current engine. I'm afraid ABS and traction controll will be forced on us. Make an option to disable ABS and make it unlinked/switchable and I'd be interested in about 150000 miles ;D Oh, dont forget cruise as a factory installed option........
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The teasers definitely point to a ZX14R. Still using the number 14. So I'm assuming the engine will still be under 1500. But the rumor mill has it with a super charger. I wouldn't mind seeing that translate over into a Connie.
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I wonder/would be willing to bet they will increase stroke and maybe bore to get the increase. What I'm interested in is what will cross over to our current engine. I'm afraid ABS and traction controll will be forced on us. Make an option to disable ABS and make it unlinked/switchable and I'd be interested in about 150000 miles ;D Oh, dont forget cruise as a factory installed option........
Interesting since I will not buy another bike without ABS and traction control. I don't care about linked but it doesn't bother me that it has it.
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Increasing the CC's and making the engine bigger is STUPID! They can extract more power and torque from the existing block if they feel the need to. How about instead:
1. Improve the fuel mapping and add a wide band O2 sensor.
2. Add a cruise control.
3. Redesign the fairings for easier access. Or at least make them so you can remove them without breaking them.
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My bet - years and years before they make any more changes since the upgrades on the '10. So far we're up to two (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
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Increasing the CC's and making the engine bigger is STUPID! They can extract more power and torque from the existing block if they feel the need to. How about instead:
1. Improve the fuel mapping and add a wide band O2 sensor.
2. Add a cruise control.
3. Redesign the fairings for easier access. Or at least make them so you can remove them without breaking them.
But that makes too much sense!!!!!!
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My bet - years and years before they make any more changes since the upgrades on the '10. So far we're up to two (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
I hope you're right. Leave it alone and give me a price cut.
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I just got mine, but I would entertain the thought in trading for "cruise" alone... If there were other things such as increased engine displacement or anything else it would just be icing on the cake for me.
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I'd just do a Guhl reflash of my ECU ($400), instead of loosing $$$$ in the trade. Hopefully a cruise control that would be backwards compatible with our C-14's is all that I need. A C-15 would equal more weight, however small that would be but still it is already heavy enough.
A C-14 with cruise, a redone ECU from the factory and adjustable bars such as the new Heli's would keep this bike top notch!
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I don't know one dealer that would be willing to give me what I think my C-14 is worth. Besides that every time a newer version is launched the resale value on existing C14's falls further.
Of course if they would consider doing away with linked brakes, I might take back everything I said and scramble.... :)
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Why would you want a bike without ABS? ABS is the best feature ever to hit the motorcycle . As long as i can disable traction control when i want im happy . as for linked brakes im fine either way.
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"Bold New Graphics" Only significant changes to come to the C14 for years.
Especially if they change the Zx14 engine, the C14 will get the left overs for years just like the naked litre bikes get the "old litre bike engines.
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Why would you want a bike without ABS? ABS is the best feature ever to hit the motorcycle . As long as i can disable traction control when i want im happy . as for linked brakes im fine either way.
That's the silliest statement to hit this forum in a while. As long as they charge extra for ABS I'll do without.
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That's the silliest statement to hit this forum in a while. As long as they charge extra for ABS I'll do without.
If it saves your ass just once it's worth every penny.
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That's the silliest statement to hit this forum in a while. As long as they charge extra for ABS I'll do without.
You do realize that everything is paid for in one way or another. Do you still slice your own bread too? Cuz I bet the price of slicing is figured into that loaf of yours.
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You do realize that everything is paid for in one way or another. Do you still slice your own bread too? Cuz I bet the price of slicing is figured into that loaf of yours.
So THAT's why the bread I buy is so cheap. If he'd said ABS is the best thing since sliced bread I woulda let it slide. ;)
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That's the silliest statement to hit this forum in a while. As long as they charge extra for ABS I'll do without.
I respectfully disagree. It really agree that it is one of the best features to hit motorcycles from a safety standpoint. Like others, I would NEVER buy a bike (or car) without it, now. A few hundred dollars is simply not worth my life or limb. On a high-end bike like the Concours, it would be silly to expect them to even offer non-ABS anymore.
(Of course, it is silly that we don't now have cruise control on a high-end, technological, sports-touring bike, but that is another matter)
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That's the silliest statement to hit this forum in a while. As long as they charge extra for ABS I'll do without.
I don't think they charge extra for it on the newer bikes. It comes standard.
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I don't think they charge extra for it on the newer bikes. It comes standard.
As I just read through this post, I wondered why none of the "experts" on this forum realized that there aren't two models anymore - just the one with traction control & ABS.
As to the C14 getting the upgraded engine, I'm not seeing that happening. I'm sick of the manufacturers dumbing down the engines for ST bikes. Give me at least the option of getting the full strength ZX engine in the Concours and I will pay the upcharge in a heartbeat and I'll order one the day they are announced. Add factory cruise control and I'll kiss my dealer on the lips.
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My pet peeve is "why not self canceling turn signals?" If Kawasaki has the expertise to have ABS,TPMS, Traction control, etc. why not self canceling turn signals?
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Dunno guys...I ride a bike to keep sharp. Brake modulation, throttle control, noticing that the gravel in the corner is indeed wet, and that I just finished turning that corner--all part of the devilish details that make bikes challenging. You have to ride a smaller, lighter bike to appreciate what you've lost when feature-creep turns a bike into pudgster (aka Hog, in some circles). When given the chance to ride a buddy's BMW 1200GT, it only took 5 minutes to realize why I will never sell my technologically-inferior C10.
Keep it Simple! 8)
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more motor? who would say no to that? I wouldn't mind it.
I love the ABS saved my butt from sure mexican death a time or two. as for traction control, have not tryed it cuz I don't have it. but would like to see it adjustable like the new zx10. has 10 settings for traction control! linked brakes would be a no go for me unless they are defeatable on the bike one way or the other. even if I had to pay someone to defeat the linked brake system, I would!
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I respectfully disagree. It really agree that it is one of the best features to hit motorcycles from a safety standpoint. Like others, I would NEVER buy a bike (or car) without it, now. A few hundred dollars is simply not worth my life or limb. On a high-end bike like the Concours, it would be silly to expect them to even offer non-ABS anymore.
(Of course, it is silly that we don't now have cruise control on a high-end, technological, sports-touring bike, but that is another matter)
I have no interest in debating ABS, we have already been there. And I won't even argue that it is ONE of the best SAFETY features but THE BEST EVER? Think about overhead cams, tubeless tires, single shocks, four valve heads, digital fuel injection, radial tires, KIPASS!
ABS is overrated in my opinion. There are many many ways to get hurt bad or killed on a motorcycle, ABS addresses only one and in a very limited set of situations. My guess is that many of you have a dangerous false sense of security. Oops, I said I didn't want to debate ABS!
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Dunno guys...I ride a bike to keep sharp. Brake modulation, throttle control, noticing that the gravel in the corner is indeed wet, and that I just finished turning that corner--all part of the devilish details that make bikes challenging. You have to ride a smaller, lighter bike to appreciate what you've lost when feature-creep turns a bike into pudgster (aka Hog, in some circles). When given the chance to ride a buddy's BMW 1200GT, it only took 5 minutes to realize why I will never sell my technologically-inferior C10.
Keep it Simple! 8)
+1
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ABS decreases total braking distance and time.
Thats been proven over and over again from pro's racing to beginners no matter street or track, wet or dry.
One of the better performance mods to hit bikes in the past decade.
If you care about optimal performance of your ride, ABS is the way to go.
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I would be happy if they would only put all the power back in they robbed from the zx14. I find the c14 a bit wimpy.
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I would be happy if they would only put all the power back in they robbed from the zx14. I find the c14 a bit wimpy.
+1
My light as a feather 600RR with 109 HP ATE my heavy 130 HP C14 alive in a drag race or roll on.
BUT - My old ZX14 got a whopping 29 MPG and was useless as a sport-tourer.
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ABS decreases total braking distance and time.
Thats been proven over and over again from pro's racing to beginners no matter street or track, wet or dry.
One of the better performance mods to hit bikes in the past decade.
If you care about optimal performance of your ride, ABS is the way to go.
Sorry, but I beg to differ and Kawasaki must also disagree with you. On page 149 of my owners manual ('11 C14 ABS), it states:
"ABS is not designed to shorten the braking distance. On loose, uneven or downhill surface, the stopping distance of a motorcycle with ABS may be longer than that of equivalent motorcycle without ABS."
All said. I doubt I'll ever own another bike that doesn't have ABS.
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Dunno guys...I ride a bike to keep sharp. Brake modulation, throttle control, noticing that the gravel in the corner is indeed wet, and that I just finished turning that corner--all part of the devilish details that make bikes challenging. You have to ride a smaller, lighter bike to appreciate what you've lost when feature-creep turns a bike into pudgster (aka Hog, in some circles). When given the chance to ride a buddy's BMW 1200GT, it only took 5 minutes to realize why I will never sell my technologically-inferior C10.
Keep it Simple! 8)
You have to drive a true Hog to appreciate that the Connie is no pudgster. Sure, it's not going to be as nimble as the 600RR, but considering that no one bike can excel at every aspect of motorcycling, the Concours does a fine job at compromise.
There's validity to the argument that modern engineering features can allow certain skills to dry out, but that applies to new bikes manufactured thirty years ago as well. My old CB350 only had drum brakes, but I learned to make it stop in time to avoid hitting anything. No doubt I'd have to relearn that skill if I ever got the chance to get back on it, but I wouldn't trade my disc brakes because of it.
Would you insist on putting bias ply tires on your car because riding on them kept you sharp? They kept me from going as fast as I would have liked. And so on.
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Sorry, but I beg to differ and Kawasaki must also disagree with you. On page 149 of my owners manual ('11 C14 ABS), it states:
"ABS is not designed to shorten the braking distance. On loose, uneven or downhill surface, the stopping distance of a motorcycle with ABS may be longer than that of equivalent motorcycle without ABS."
All said. I doubt I'll ever own another bike that doesn't have ABS.
Of course they throw the liability disclaimers in. ABS has proven itself through manufacturer testing, the track, and the governments all over the world. Some organizations are pushing to make it mandatory but all the makers are slowly deploying it as standard equipment on new models anyway.
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I would like to see the C15 in Silver Neutron, yes we would. That's all we wants. Just a bit more power, nothing else. You guys kill me. ;)
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But wouldn't a C15 in silver be more like a C13 Jim... ;)
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my 2 cents
they will make it a 1425 or so
then call it a C 15
just to f--- w/bmw
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my 2 cents
they will make it a 1425 or so
then call it a C 15
just to f--- w/bmw
:rotflmao:
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1429 cc's is what I think we will see on the ZX, now if we can get that installed in the C-14 next year....we are making progress...along with:
Cruise Control
Self-Cancelling turn signals
Eliminate Linked Brakes
We will have to have 1451 cc before they can call it a C-15, so if they incorporate the upgraded motor coming out this week in 2013 C-14's maybe we will see some availability or they may wait for an even year like 2014 to make us sweat it out.....
This is a good way to sell more bikes to stimulate their sales too.
Ninja
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1429 cc's is what I think we will see on the ZX, now if we can get that installed in the C-14 next year....we are making progress...along with:
Cruise Control
Self-Cancelling turn signals
Eliminate Linked Brakes
We will have to have 1451 cc before they can call it a C-15, so if they incorporate the upgraded motor coming out this week in 2013 C-14's maybe we will see some availability or they may wait for an even year like 2014 to make us sweat it out.....
This is a good way to sell more bikes to stimulate their sales too.
Ninja
I've owned five bikes with linked brakes. Other than the Concours, I'd bet money that if I put you on them and you didn't know they had linked brakes, you would not know it by riding them either. I never felt anything that would have given it away.
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I hate the linked brakes and would cancel them in a second, given a chance. Way too grabby when stuck in traffic. My 2008 never had any of the feelings the linked brakes bring.
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I hate the linked brakes and would cancel them in a second, given a chance. Way too grabby when stuck in traffic. My 2008 never had any of the feelings the linked brakes bring.
I hate them on the Concours as well, but my point is that Kawasaki is the only mfr that managed to f**k them up. I read a lot of posts by folks who don't like them in principle - makes no sense.
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I hate them on the Concours as well, but my point is that Kawasaki is the only mfr that managed to f**k them up. I read a lot of posts by folks who don't like them in principle - makes no sense.
I disagree JJ, I didn't like them on my 06 Honda VFR.
Maybe it's just preference... (http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/smiley_dunno.gif)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/vfr3.jpg)
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@ lather
I have no interest in debating ABS, we have already been there. And I won't even argue that it is ONE of the best SAFETY features but THE BEST EVER? Think about overhead cams, tubeless tires, single shocks, four valve heads, digital fuel injection, radial tires, KIPASS!
ABS is overrated in my opinion. There are many many ways to get hurt bad or killed on a motorcycle, ABS addresses only one and in a very limited set of situations. My guess is that many of you have a dangerous false sense of security. Oops, I said I didn't want to debate ABS!
are overhead cams a safety feature? how about 4 valve heads, i never heard any one say " thank god for those 4 valve heads and the fuel injection they really saved my ass" Try reading what you type before you hit reply. ABS is the best safety feature ever put on a bike.
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Calm it down.
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Im calm. I got told my post was the silliest thing to hit the forums. so i read on and discover her last post of nonsense so i had to comment . ::)
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Calmly: Rtarp1, re-read your own post, "safety feature" were MY words. YOU said:"ABS is the best feature ever to hit the motorcycle ", no mention of safety in your post and this thread was originally not about safety at all. I can certainly understand why you are so fond of ABS. :)
@ lather
I have no interest in debating ABS, we have already been there. And I won't even argue that it is ONE of the best SAFETY features but THE BEST EVER? Think about overhead cams, tubeless tires, single shocks, four valve heads, digital fuel injection, radial tires, KIPASS!
ABS is overrated in my opinion. There are many many ways to get hurt bad or killed on a motorcycle, ABS addresses only one and in a very limited set of situations. My guess is that many of you have a dangerous false sense of security. Oops, I said I didn't want to debate ABS!
are overhead cams a safety feature? how about 4 valve heads, i never heard any one say " thank god for those 4 valve heads and the fuel injection they really saved my ass" Try reading what you type before you hit reply. ABS is the best safety feature ever put on a bike.
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Im calm. I got told my post was the silliest thing to hit the forums. so i read on and discover her last post of nonsense so i had to comment . ::)
I said silliest in a while. I changed it after re-reading what I typed before hiting reply. I have been here nearly 5 years and there has been tons of silliness.
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did i have to say safety? I'll try to be more clear in the future. Silliest in awhile is sooo much better, thanks.
Anyway i love ABS and wont be buying a bike without it ever again, shouldnt be a problem since most high end bikes come with it standard anyway.
Your sentence " And I won't even argue that it is ONE of the best SAFETY features but THE BEST EVER? Think about overhead cams, tubeless tires, single shocks, four valve heads, digital fuel injection, radial tires, KIPASS!
you said it wasnt the best safety feature ever and you then used the examples of better ones which arent safety fetures. Now try and give me an example of a better "safety" feature than ABS, i cant think of any except a headlight :)
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I have to admit my wording was not real clear either. To clarify, the point I intended to and still dispute is that "ABS is the best feature to hit motorcycling".
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agreed.
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Im calm. I got told my post was the silliest thing to hit the forums. so i read on and discover her last post of nonsense so i had to comment . ::)
Her?
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I said silliest in a while. I changed it after re-reading what I typed before hiting reply. I have been here nearly 5 years and there has been tons of silliness.
True enough.
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Add factory cruise control and I'll kiss my dealer on the lips.
Name of the dealer, please, just in case.
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Name of the dealer, please, just in case.
Well, now that your bring that up, the dealer nearest me has a somewhat attractive lady who I spoke with once. And while its not the dealer I bought my bike from, it's probably the one I'd go with for the kiss :-*
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I remember when 500cc was a monster engine. If you had that you were a king. Now it seems we have just gone plain crazy with the bigger is better thing.
I have found over the years that the 50- 90 hp range is more than enough to keep even the most spirited riders happy. 130hp is just overkill to me.
But, I'm getting old, my next bike will be a Suzuki Bergman ::)
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I remember when 500cc was a monster engine. If you had that you were a king. Now it seems we have just gone plain crazy with the bigger is better thing.
I have found over the years that the 50- 90 hp range is more than enough to keep even the most spirited riders happy. 130hp is just overkill to me.
But, I'm getting old, my next bike will be a Suzuki Bergman
2009 C-14 in the faster color black ::)
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Her?
I think he was referring to Gabrielle, my granddaughter, who types my posts for me.
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I think he was referring to Gabrielle, my granddaughter, who types my posts for me.
:rotflmao:
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I remember when 500cc was a monster engine. If you had that you were a king. Now it seems we have just gone plain crazy with the bigger is better thing.
I have found over the years that the 50- 90 hp range is more than enough to keep even the most spirited riders happy. 130hp is just overkill to me.
But, I'm getting old, my next bike will be a Suzuki Bergman ::)
It depends on how you use your machine. If you are a weekend warrior hp is king. On 3000+ mile road trips I find myself envying my Honda & BMW buds 50+ mpg. Not to mention their larger tanks!
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Full details of the 2012 ZX here...
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=27&TID=63965&set_time=1318252910#2012-kawasaki-ninja-zx14r (http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=27&TID=63965&set_time=1318252910#2012-kawasaki-ninja-zx14r)
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Would love to see the 2013 C14 based on this engine with 3 or more fuel maps. Eco, normal and sport.
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I find myself envying my Honda & BMW buds 50+ mpg. Not to mention their larger tanks!
I averaged 50-51mpg on the interstates with my 07 FJR. Don't have any interstate time on my C14 to see what it will be for me.
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I averaged 50-51mpg on the interstates with my 07 FJR. Don't have any interstate time on my C14 to see what it will be for me.
If I keep it at the speed limit and there is little or no wind I can get in the upper 40's.
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As my 2009 is still new (March 2011) and only 6500 miles on her, the only thing that might entice me is factory cruise control.
there is plenty of power for me and if not i can do the reflash and get more from her. And yes, i am still smitten by her!
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I averaged 50-51mpg on the interstates with my 07 FJR. Don't have any interstate time on my C14 to see what it will be for me.
Staying nearer the interstate speed limit and running in ECO mode (I know, you may not have this feature), I got 50-51 mpg on my C14 recently.
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Has anyone else noted the oil jet spraying the underside of the piston? They do this on supercharged engines, and it so happens Kawasaki has applied for 3 patents for a motorcycle version of a supercharger this year....... Oh My!
The ZX-1000 has supposedly over 200 HP at the crank (at ram-air speeds). Now that the ZX-14 has gone from 1352CC to 1441CC what HP numbers are we looking at? And a possible supercharged version in the next few years? Can this even be street legal in the US?
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Full details of the 2012 ZX here...
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=27&TID=63965&set_time=1318252910#2012-kawasaki-ninja-zx14r (http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=27&TID=63965&set_time=1318252910#2012-kawasaki-ninja-zx14r)
Just looked at this link and have a question: Are we in the "Hideous Muffler Millennium" and I just didnt get the memo? I smell bribes from the aftermarket community to Kawasaki. "Here's half a million to take the sexy cans off and put the vintage 60's vacuum cleaner cans on..."
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resedp,
Welcome to the "Dawn of the Pentangle Potato Launcher". :'(
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Maybe they have the Super-charger for this version, but are going to nail you for the add-on $2,000-$4,000 plus a void of warranty. Just a thought.
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Maybe they have the Super-charger for this version, but are going to nail you for the add-on $2,000-$4,000 plus a void of warranty. Just a thought.
The new engine has a 12.3:1 compression ratio which is pretty high and probably not safe for too much boost on pump gas.
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I think Kawasaki coudl give us more hp and torque by bolting on a few of the left-over zx14 parts. Throttle bodies, for a start. As far as extra fuel maps, thats cool, but please base them on a good baseline. Based on The PCV I added and the reports back from remapping the stock ecu, Kawasaki is not doing so well on that. While I'm wishing,, how about fully adjustable suspension? Thats cheap to add at a factory level, but expensive for us.
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Guys, let's keep this on topic (speculation) regarding a possible C15. I really don't want it veering off (too much) to discussions on other bikes per se even though they be Kwaks.
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I speculate that the price of oil will continue to rise, and .....
Seriously though, as much as I love to read and talk about what might happen, I'm pretty darn happy with what I have. If Mama Kawa does release a C-15 or any other major improvements...the end result will be sadness on my end. Primarily because I won't be able to get the new bike.
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Imagine a separate C-15 Forum. etc. :stirpot:
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If such a thing (C15) were to happen, I don't think it would be difficult at all to create a C15 board.
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Like this C
1415
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Like this C1415
Actually it's a bit more than that, but not much.
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"Miles in the saddle" is my candidate for best safety feature, and until the recent gas price increases it was exceedingly cheap and weightless. ABS, linked brakes, etc are substitutes, and will become more common in anticipation of bone-headed lawsuits. When I notice that my bike and brain aren't in good sync, I just turn around and go home and read a couple of Keith Code chapters.
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I'm all for more power & torque IF it comes with 50+ mpg at 80+mph...otherwise, PFFFFT....
Good God men, why do you want more power?? That's why Kawasaki offers the "fire breather", I want better fuel economy and durability for the long haul.
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C15R
If the Zx14 can get a fake Kawi cracker jack box "R" aimed at squids and teens, so can the connie (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
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C15R
If the Zx14 can get a fake Kawi cracker jack box "R" aimed at squids and teens, so can the connie (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
and turn this into a gixxer forum? no thanks.
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Usually adding and 'R' will raise insurance rates ... i am rather pleased with my current rate.
the C14 is cheaper than a V-Strom 650 for me.
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and turn this into a gixxer forum? no thanks.
Hey now, I mod in that forum!