Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: speed545 on July 13, 2011, 07:07:16 PM
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hey guys,
about to put back the rear wheel after a tire change. manual says to apply high temp grease to seal lips but doesnt show where. Also to apply molybdenum grease on the splines.
I have high temp Lucas bearing grease. will it do the job on both application and where exactly do you apply grease on the seal lips? I m a bit confuse.
Thx
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The consensus is to use Honda Molypaste 60 on the splines because it works best for the low speed/high presure situation. Any non or low moly grease will quickly get squeezed ot and leave no lubrication. The moly past will leave behind a film. As for the seal lips I just slather on the high temp where the rubber seal contacts the axle then wipe off any excess after the axle is torqued.
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Yep, zacktly what Lather said. The only thing I do differently is to put a dab of moly paste on the seal as well as the splines- it is not needed but it works in the same way synthetic oil does, it makes the owner (me in this case) feel better about a job well (better) done.
Brian
The consensus is to use Honda Molypaste 60 on the splines because it works best for the low speed/high presure situation. Any non or low moly grease will quickly get squeezed ot and leave no lubrication. The moly past will leave behind a film. As for the seal lips I just slather on the high temp where the rubber seal contacts the axle then wipe off any excess after the axle is torqued.
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great
thx guys
i ll get a tube tomorrow while at the bike shop
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Grease is no longer called grease when the percentage of add ins exceeds some number. (guess 50?)
Honda Moly 60 is a paste so anything labeled as grease likely is not okay.
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ok,
looks easy but when out there the get one, it s not.
I have to order and, with the biggest luck, i ll have it next wednesday. I want to reinstall that wheel
any alternative???
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ok,
looks easy but when out there the get one, it s not.
I have to order and, with the biggest luck, i ll have it next wednesday. I want to reinstall that wheel
any alternative???
I just use Valvoline wheel grease with moly in it. So far no issues in 44k miles. Just don't use a lot of it.
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Yes but nothing readily available. It is just not a common material that retailers stock. You can use any moly paste with at least 50% moly content; I believe both Loctite and Permatex (sp?) offer this material but you would have to order both most likely. McCaster Carr is a great source but as you are in Canada, I do not know how long it will take the package to get to you (almost always one day to me). ??
You should be able to order Honda Moly paste 60 from any Honda dealer.
My suggestion is to use that material (or any moly paste with 50% or more moly content) in place of conventional grease. Chassis grease that is "moly" based is usually between 3% and 5% moly and does not compete with true moly paste for a high pressure, small movement lubricant. If you are in a spot to get your bike back together, I would suggest using some other type of grease, probably wheel bearing grease, for the time being and order the Honda paste. Use the Honda paste the next time you take the wheel off the for tire service, or just pull the wheel when the paste comes in as it is pretty easy to R & R the wheel anyway.
Brian
ok,
looks easy but when out there the get one, it s not.
I have to order and, with the biggest luck, i ll have it next wednesday. I want to reinstall that wheel
any alternative???
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ok,
looks easy but when out there the get one, it s not.
I have to order and, with the biggest luck, i ll have it next wednesday. I want to reinstall that wheel
any alternative???
I called the local Honda dealer and asked if they had any Moly 60 in stock, they did, do I took a ride out there. They had a bunch of it hanging behind the counter. Seems it's been there for a while cuz it was covered in dust. They were more than happy to sell me some and wanted to know how many tubes I wanted.
(http://i.ebayimg.com/03/!BZjqvQgBmk~$(KGrHgoH-CMEjlLl)s+(BKnUOkwBuw~~_35.jpg)
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HONDA molly paste FTW (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/Connie%2014/hondamoly.jpg)
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Often times you can tell how good the Moly Paste is by how much it costs. Dow Corning makes a paste, DC77M, and the last time I bought it was back in 2005. It was over 100.00 per pint. Todays prices are scarier. http://www.ellsworth.com/display/productdetail.html?productid=410&Tab (http://www.ellsworth.com/display/productdetail.html?productid=410&Tab)
Too expensive for motorcycle or automotive use, we used it inside our spring piston air rifles. The Honda stuff is really, really good an d a lot less money.
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I was working on my rear wheel yesterday and opened a new tube of Honda Moly 60 Paste from a sealed package. The darned thing was only half full >:(. This is my first time using this product, but is this typical? There were no signs of leakage from the tube / package. I'm sure it will last me forever, but I sorta felt like I'd been had.
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Mine was about 2/3 full.
Some settling may occur due to shipment ... :)
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I was working on my rear wheel yesterday and opened a new tube of Honda Moly 60 Paste from a sealed package. The darned thing was only half full >:(. This is my first time using this product, but is this typical? There were no signs of leakage from the tube / package. I'm sure it will last me forever, but I sorta felt like I'd been had.
Yea, its like a potatoe chips. Settles over time. The amount listed on the tube is what you should've got.
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Often times you can tell how good the Moly Paste is by how much it costs. Dow Corning makes a paste, DC77M, and the last time I bought it was back in 2005. It was over 100.00 per pint. Todays prices are scarier. http://www.ellsworth.com/display/productdetail.html?productid=410&Tab (http://www.ellsworth.com/display/productdetail.html?productid=410&Tab)
Too expensive for motorcycle or automotive use, we used it inside our spring piston air rifles. The Honda stuff is really, really good an d a lot less money.
Nice another air gunner! What kind of gun did you tune? I have started down the road of PCP, however picked up a benji trail XL and LOVE it! The only tuning tear down was on a Big Cat
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I just use Valvoline wheel grease with moly in it. So far no issues in 44k miles. Just don't use a lot of it.
Jim: Regular moly grease has 5 to10% molydisulfide by volume - NOT enough. Honda Moly60 has 60% moly by volume -- BIG difference !! The carrier grease slings off or evaporates quickly and the moly is left behind as the lubricant, so the higher the concentration the better.
Honda created the Moly60 for Goldwing driveshaft applications because the regular grease didn't protect the splines and they were wearing out prematurely. Shops that still use regular grease on the driveshaft splines should be sued because they know better.
Belray also makes an assembly lube that is greater than 50% moly by volume and it should be OK for the C-14 application too.
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I have always wondered what the Momma Kaw shops do when you take it in. Does is there a 60% moly Kaw lube?
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Jim: Regular moly grease has 5 to10% molydisulfide by volume - NOT enough. Honda Moly60 has 60% moly by volume -- BIG difference !! The carrier grease slings off or evaporates quickly and the moly is left behind as the lubricant, so the higher the concentration the better.
Honda created the Moly60 for Goldwing driveshaft applications because the regular grease didn't protect the splines and they were wearing out prematurely. Shops that still use regular grease on the driveshaft splines should be sued because they know better.
Belray also makes an assembly lube that is greater than 50% moly by volume and it should be OK for the C-14 application too.
Yeah, I hear you, but I haven't had any issues in 45k miles and I used it on the C10 as well (75k miles no problems) and the Voyager (75k miles).... Now I did do it once a year on all the bikes as part of my maintenance program. So I'm sticking with it for now. Show me a documented failure because it wasn't used and I'll change my tune.
Jim (head in the sand)
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I have always wondered what the Momma Kaw shops do when you take it in. Does is there a 60% moly Kaw lube?
I was told by a mechanic here they use Yamalube because it costs half as much as the Honda lube. I didn't get into the "amount of moly" debate between them, but thats what the stealership uses here. They carry several brand bikes, not just Kawi.
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Yeah, I hear you, but I haven't had any issues in 45k miles and I used it on the C10 as well (75k miles no problems) and the Voyager (75k miles).... Now I did do it once a year on all the bikes as part of my maintenance program. So I'm sticking with it for now. Show me a documented failure because it wasn't used and I'll change my tune.
Jim (head in the sand)
Jim: They're your bikes and you can maintain them as you choose -- my comments were more for the others reading this thread too. For the little difference in cost, I can't justify using the regular grease which btw, I also use for auto suspension lube. I paid $8 for a tube of the Moly60 and I haven't used half of it in 5 yrs so it really is inexpensive.
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Absolutely true- a tube of that stuff is a lifetime supply for several people. And let's not forget that whenever you touch the stuff it gets on everything for a 1/2 mile radius so the small tube really does go a long, long way.
What would be a real plus would be to have moly paste in a can with a brush- in- cap. That way we might have a chance of getting it mostly on the object we intend to lube with it in the first place. Moly paste and anti- seize.... each one will tint the whole world just a little bit every time either container is opened. I think I got some on my shirt once just by walking by the tube that was at least four feet away. ;)
Brian
<snip>
I paid $8 for a tube of the Moly60 and I haven't used half of it in 5 yrs so it really is inexpensive.
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Absolutely true- a tube of that stuff is a lifetime supply for several people. And let's not forget that whenever you touch the stuff it gets on everything for a 1/2 mile radius so the small tube really does go a long, long way.
What would be a real plus would be to have moly paste in a can with a brush- in- cap. That way we might have a chance of getting it mostly on the object we intend to lube with it in the first place. Moly paste and anti- seize.... each one will tint the whole world just a little bit every time either container is opened. I think I got some on my shirt once just by walking by the tube that was at least four feet away. ;)
Brian
I've got some NAPA anti-seize that I bought 30 years ago with a brush in the cap. I've used about a quarter inch of it so far. I'm thinking of willing it to my grandson...
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What would be a real plus would be to have moly paste in a can with a brush- in- cap. That way we might have a chance of getting it mostly on the object we intend to lube with it in the first place. Moly paste and anti- seize.... each one will tint the whole world just a little bit every time either container is opened. I think I got some on my shirt once just by walking by the tube that was at least four feet away. ;)
Brian
The Belray assembly lube is exactly that -- plastic bottle with a brush.
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Thanks for the info. Unfortunately the Belray lube isn't moly paste as it only contains between 10% and 30% moly, at least according to the MSDS.
Brian
The Belray assembly lube is exactly that -- plastic bottle with a brush.
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The suspension linkage bearings take a beating on my yz 250. If I use good moly lube, they last a lot longer. Percentage wise, I'll be conservative and say 20%. Moly does not wash away like so many other greases. Even marine grease. I dislike marine grease especially since it is waterproof. Get it wet and the water tends to stick around a long time. Especially bad in steering head bearings.
You can get some good, all purpose gear lube that is super thick by getting "open gear lube" from the local farm stores. This often has enough moly to be useful. Heres a good spray.
http://www.dymon.com/dymon-product.php?product=1194 (http://www.dymon.com/dymon-product.php?product=1194)
Incredibly good on chains running on steel sprockets...worthless on aluminum sprockets, though.
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Tonight I changed my rear tire and when I pulled the wheel off all the Honda Moly 60 was right where I put it 6,500 miles ago. I couldn't say the same thing about regular grease. I still wiped the splines as clean as I could get them and reapplied the moly. $8 well spent IMO.
I used a medium bristle paint brush (shhhh, I stole it from my daughter's art kit) and I will just keep the brush in a ziploc right by the moly paste for next time.
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Finally got some of the Honda Moly 60 Paste...Whew- SO hard to find locally here in Tucson- Even got so desperate as to call the Honda shop- they were OUT, the Kawi dealers didn't have it, auto parts stores- NOTHIN! I ordered a tube on-line from Ron Ayers.com. I had to put the rear wheel back on before I received the paste. Now Im going to take it apart and do it right!
Question, BESIDES the splines, where should I use the Moly? I ask becaues I noticed some lube on the outer rim of the wheel hub. This may be because there is a lip there and it's only where some of the grease collects as it 'spins out' from centrifugal force. Thx Tom
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Nowhere else, just the splines, and not too much there either. Using too much paste won't hurt anything but you will wind up having to wipe it off the rear wheel. You only need about 1/2 of a thimble- full to take care of the drive splines really.
Brian
Finally got some of the Honda Moly 60 Paste...Whew- SO hard to find locally here in Tucson- Even got so desperate as to call the Honda shop- they were OUT, the Kawi dealers didn't have it, auto parts stores- NOTHIN! I ordered a tube on-line from Ron Ayers.com. I had to put the rear wheel back on before I received the paste. Now Im going to take it apart and do it right!
Question, BESIDES the splines, where should I use the Moly? I ask becaues I noticed some lube on the outer rim of the wheel hub. This may be because there is a lip there and it's only where some of the grease collects as it 'spins out' from centrifugal force. Thx Tom
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... opened a new tube of Honda Moly 60 Paste from a sealed package. The darned thing was only half full ....
Even if you had really only received 1/2 a tube, chances are you'd be leaving some of it to your heirs when you die. A little goes a long way. (That is, if you are only using for yourself, on one or two bikes. Professional mechanics can disregard my response.)
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What's the torque spec for the rear axle nut?
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What's the torque spec for the rear axle nut?
rear axle nut: 94 FT-LB
caliper bracket bolt: 47 FT-LB