Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: W14 on September 25, 2015, 06:46:12 PM
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I have owned my 2009 Connie since 2010 and it now has roughly 35,000 miles on it - rode the Tail of the Dragon (TN), Back of the Dragon (VA Rt 16) and Snake (TN) last year. It has been (is) a great bike and I have not had any issues it - not even the infamous heat the 2008s and 2009s are known for.
I other day I was thinking about upgrading and decided to test ride a BMW 1600 GT. Boy was I disappointed. First, the transmission was clunky, making a big clunking sound when the gears were engaged, which reminded me of the Suzuki M90 I owned before the Connie. Second, the wind protection and seat were no better than the Connie's, meaning I would need to buy an after-market seat and windshield. Third, I did not like the throttle response. The bike also felt too wide. Lastly, the 2013 I tested was priced at $20K.
Needless to say but the BWM 1600 is off my bucket list.
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Needless to say but the BWM 1600 is off my bucket list.
Looks like your upgrade is now to the 16 Concours 14!!
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The C14 has not changed enough over time for me to want a new one. And, there is no other bike out there that evokes enough passion in me to put it in the "got to have" position. So, I will likely keep the 09 for a very long time.
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The C14 has not changed enough over time for me to want a new one.
Maybe not for you, but for many there are enough changes to warrant an upgrade. Of course, doing nothing has a lot of advantages as far as monthly payments, insurance, and taxes :)
And, there is no other bike out there that evokes enough passion in me to put it in the "got to have" position. So, I will likely keep the 09 for a very long time.
Nothing wrong with that.
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I have owned my 2009 Connie since 2010 and it now has roughly 35,000 miles on it - rode the Tail of the Dragon (TN), Back of the Dragon (VA Rt 16) and Snake (TN) last year. It has been (is) a great bike and I have not had any issues it - not even the infamous heat the 2008s and 2009s are known for.
I other day I was thinking about upgrading and decided to test ride a BMW 1600 GT. Boy was I disappointed. First, the transmission was clunky, making a big clunking sound when the gears were engaged, which reminded me of the Suzuki M90 I owned before the Connie. Second, the wind protection and seat were no better than the Connie's, meaning I would need to buy an after-market seat and windshield. Third, I did not like the throttle response. The bike also felt too wide. Lastly, the 2013 I tested was priced at $20K.
Needless to say but the BWM 1600 is off my bucket list.
I have heard enough bad press about BMW driveline failures, cost of ownership and maintenance to make me permanently immune to that brand. Also, the 1600 looks like a whale on 2 wheels..
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Apt description..
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Triumph Trophy or the GW F6B are the only bikes that could lure me away from the Connie right now.
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But you are missing the most important reason to buy a BMW -- the abuse the sales person, parts counter help and maintenance/repair people will hand out. That is worth the $25K right there!
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Unfortunately there are good BMW dealers. We have a good one here in Fredericksburg, VA. Not all of them are like that. Kinda like Kwackers dealers. There's good ones and bad ones.
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But you are missing the most important reason to buy a BMW -- the abuse the sales person, parts counter help and maintenance/repair people will hand out. That is worth the $25K right there!
The reason I buy Kawasaki's is so I don't have to go to the dealers- after 5 years the only time the bike saw a dealer again was for the safety recall. Awesome reliability so far.
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The reason I buy Kawasaki's is so I don't have to go to the dealers- after 5 years the only time the bike saw a dealer again was for the safety recall. Awesome reliability so far.
+1
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Unfortunately there are good BMW dealers. We have a good one here in Fredericksburg, VA. Not all of them are like that. Kinda like Kwackers dealers. There's good ones and bad ones.
Cant be the same dealership I visited. :o They did not speak or great when I was in there a week ago for about 15 minutes...not a soul came up to speak to me. Poor customer service will never get my check.
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Never had that issue with them. They've always gone out of their way to be friendly to me but I haven't been there in awhile either.
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Cant be the same dealership I visited. :o They did not speak or great when I was in there a week ago for about 15 minutes...not a soul came up to speak to me. Poor customer service will never get my check.
Why, that sounds fantastic!
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I admit I secretly Covent a bwm 1600gt, I keep telling myself surely they must be better since they are over $10k more than what I paid for my connie.
However I think back to the Harley Ultra CVO that I dumped $38000 to purchase thinking it was better....it certainly was in a better wrapper but turned out to be a huge let down!
I spend a few hours a week on the bmw forums pretending to be one of them, in the end I have noticed they change seats and add thousands of dollars worth of farkels just to make it more ride able. What really turned me off was when I went to my local dealer whom sells both kawi and bmw amongst other brands, the sales person straight out told me to keep the connie.
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I admit I secretly Covent a bwm 1600gt, I keep telling myself surely they must be better since they are over $10k more than what I paid for my connie.
As you found, more expensive doesn't mean "better". And there isn't really any overall better or worse, just different points on a scale that varies wildly depending on a person's needs/wants/requirements/perceptions.
The 1600GT does have some additional nice features. But few people who want to be really honestly objective about it could ever justify the huge cost difference when the C14 outperforms it in most ways, and appears to be more reliable in just about every way. But how many people enter such situations being truly objective vs. how many just see "1600" and/or just see the BMW logo?
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it has to be my grasp of the English language, but I fail to see where the term "upgrade" fits in here, both when talking of "upgrading" a perfectly working '08 C14 to a '10+, or from the C14 to the K16 :-\
Going from a Fiat Panda to a Ferrari is not necessarily an upgrade, in my dictionary. Different tools for different tasks. If you live in Rome and have a C14, a 50cc Vespa is an upgrade.
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Martin...are you saying the bmw is that much faster than the c14? IM assuming nothing fiat makes is very fast and to compare it to a Ferrari...I would hope the slowest would still be faster than the fastest fiat....
I do realize the 1600gt has much more techy stuff, radio nav, cruise....not sure I need anything more than the cruise as I have a smart phone that supplies the rest of the stuff.
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Martin...are you saying the bmw is that much faster than the c14? IM assuming nothing fiat makes is very fast and to compare it to a Ferrari...I would hope the slowest would still be faster than the fastest fiat....
I will respond for Martin, he can correct me if I am wrong :)
He wasn't saying the 1600GT is faster than the C14 (and it isn't). Nor was he implying the C14 is like a Fiat and the Ferrari is like a BWM. He was just saying that it isn't necessarily an "upgrade" when going from a Fiat (less expensive) to a Ferrari (more expensive)- it just depends on what is important to you. (Which is kinda was I said in my previous posting).
Case in point- the Ferrari probably doesn't have much in the way of electronic convenience (nice stereo, GPS, auto everything). It probably has a horribly stiff and rough race-car suspension and restrictive, low, stiff seats. It probably has little in the way of storage or sound deadening. Probably is only a two-seater. The insurance and maintenance costs are astronomical. So if comfort, storage, convenience, quietness, luxury, passenger room, or upkeep costs are important to you, would having a Ferrari be an "upgrade" over, say, a loaded Fiat 500X Trekking plus or maybe a Fiat Freemont Crossroad?
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...the Ferrari probably doesn't have much in the way of electronic convenience (nice stereo, GPS, auto everything). It probably has a horribly stiff and rough race-car suspension and restrictive, low, stiff seats. It probably has little in the way of storage or sound deadening. Probably is only a two-seater. ...
My Kia Sedona van certainly carries baby seats better than a Ferrari. :rotflmao:
Jamie
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Well for me at this point I am holding out to see if Kawi adds cruise to the connie by 2017. if not I might trade in for a bmw just not sure if it will be a 1600gt or r1200rt, after owning Harleys I seem to be "down sizing"
Either way my next one will have cruise, I don't need a radio or nav..had that on previous bikes and it sucked so I stick to the phone.
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Well for me at this point I am holding out to see if Kawi adds cruise to the connie by 2017. if not I might trade in for a bmw just not sure if it will be a 1600gt or r1200rt
If they don't, it can still be added for many, many, thousands of dollars less than the difference in cost between them. So I wouldn't make that a deciding factor, myself.
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Also, the 1600 looks like a whale on 2 wheels..
Haven't ridden a 16, but the BMW RT 1200 looks big, fat and bulky to me. Then you ride it. It is surprising to my eye how much lighter it feels and is according to spec sheets.
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I rode a 1600, it wasn't any better performance wise, it did feel bigger though. The 1200 I rode was a GS, which I fell in love with, I have heard how light the RT feels, but they had some serious suspension and head issues over the last couple years.
I have been tossing the idea of doing the rostra cruise over the winter, at this point I plan to keep the connie for at least a couple more years....so far she has been good to me.
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The Rostra is a great addition to a great bike. They can be a little tricky to install, but they are worth the effort. There is plenty of advanced knowledge on this forum in the event that you would need troubleshooting advice with the installation.
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Just my opinion but I could buy any bike I really wanted if I felt like it. I just could never feel like buying a BMW, especially new. I ride too many miles (18,000) per year and the cost would not be worth it to me. Even if it held together and thats doubtful after 3 years of that kind of riding. I buy slightly used Japanese bikes cheap (paid $8K for my 2011 C14 with 6K miles), set it up for me, ride the wheels off it, sell it cheap with fairly high miles, then do it again. My Connie may be with me longer than my average bike just because of its motor and reliability but without a fortune invested it makes it easy to change my mind when I see a good deal on another bike after 40 or 50K miles. I don't want to have to stay married to a bike (BMW = Be My Wife) due to having too much money in it to dump it (BMW). It's just me I guess because most don't do this.
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So if comfort, storage, convenience, quietness, luxury, passenger room, or upkeep costs are important to you, would having a Ferrari be an "upgrade" over, say, a loaded Fiat 500X Trekking plus or maybe a Fiat Freemont Crossroad?
Can't compare a sports car to a mini SUV, regardless of price. But the main point a more expensive vehicle not being necessarily better than a cheaper one still applies. After BMW bought back my loaded 2014 RT, was going to use the $25K+ check to buy a K16GT. But didn't want a huge fairing again, no stereo, and no GPS. You can special-order a KGT without the stereo, but looks like crap, and you still get the same gigantic fairing. Problem is the GT is basically the full touring GTL but without the trunk, therefore hardly a 'GT'. In addition, it has a horribly snatchy throttle (by wire) response that BMW should have eliminated by now. Tranny is also very clunky and noisy. And even 2015 bikes still have lots of issues (some not so minor), so had to cross it off my list. Well, I didn't have a list left. No other bike interested me. And that's when I found out about the Connie, and turns out it's the bike I was looking for all along... and at a fraction of the price of a GT. Problem solved ;D.
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I will respond for Martin, he can correct me if I am wrong :)
He wasn't saying the 1600GT is faster than the C14 (and it isn't). Nor was he implying the C14 is like a Fiat and the Ferrari is like a BWM. He was just saying that it isn't necessarily an "upgrade" when going from a Fiat (less expensive) to a Ferrari (more expensive)- it just depends on what is important to you. (Which is kinda was I said in my previous posting).
Case in point- the Ferrari probably doesn't have much in the way of electronic convenience (nice stereo, GPS, auto everything). It probably has a horribly stiff and rough race-car suspension and restrictive, low, stiff seats. It probably has little in the way of storage or sound deadening. Probably is only a two-seater. The insurance and maintenance costs are astronomical. So if comfort, storage, convenience, quietness, luxury, passenger room, or upkeep costs are important to you, would having a Ferrari be an "upgrade" over, say, a loaded Fiat 500X Trekking plus or maybe a Fiat Freemont Crossroad?
pretty much spot on.
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Just my opinion but I could buy any bike I really wanted if I felt like it. I just could never feel like buying a BMW, especially new. I ride too many miles (18,000) per year and the cost would not be worth it to me. Even if it held together and thats doubtful after 3 years of that kind of riding. I buy slightly used Japanese bikes cheap (paid $8K for my 2011 C14 with 6K miles), set it up for me, ride the wheels off it, sell it cheap with fairly high miles, then do it again. My Connie may be with me longer than my average bike just because of its motor and reliability but without a fortune invested it makes it easy to change my mind when I see a good deal on another bike after 40 or 50K miles. I don't want to have to stay married to a bike (BMW = Be My Wife) due to having too much money in it to dump it (BMW). It's just me I guess because most don't do this.
I do exactly this. I found a very cheap FJR last year that I really liked and planned to keep a while, but someone made and offer I couldn't refuse. I found this connie while I was looking for another FJR and with some reluctance decided to give it a try. It is starting to grow on me. I think I will keep it a while.
Beary
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I love my C14, and could not possibly conceive of any reason a person would pay double, or even more than double, for the 1600. No matter what.
On another note, cruise control seems to be very important to many. But for others, like me, not so much. Interstate highway travel would seem to be where CC would be of the most benefit. However, Due to the extremely high traffic volume in my part of the country, I try to avoid interstates if at all possible. And even when on interstates, traffic volume, stop-and-go, prohibits use of CC in many cases. Thus, even though I use CC on my car, I do not miss it on my bikes, and perhaps would rarely use it even if I did have it. Sorta like owning a convertible where it rains 350 days a year.
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I had the same bug several months ago. I really liked their 2015 k1600gt sakhir orange sport.
I was not blown away by it like I should be for a 24k bike. Wind protection and noise for me was terrible. I too was surprised at the clunky transmission.
I returned a few weeks later and took a test ride on the 2015 r1200rt. I liked it much better then the gt. Transmission was much smoother, but I wasnt blown away by power. Features galore though.
I was halfway considering it when they offered a pitiful trade in value on my 2009 concours.
As I drove away from the dealership I hit the concours throttle hard and smiled. I am in the search for a bike with more options, but the concours power. Some year there might be something that fits the bill. :)
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As I drove away from the dealership I hit the concours throttle hard and smiled. I am in the search for a bike with more options, but the concours power. Some year there might be something that fits the bill. :)
Which options cannot be added to the Concours? There are so many options, which is one of the best things about the Concours. It is a very reasonably priced platform with fantastic warranty and reliability, decent power, and lots of included useful stuff that can be expanded and changed with so many third-party products.
Want better lighting? No prob. More storage- easy. Better/different seat? Check. Cruise? At least two good options. More or less wind protection? Lots of choices. Different suspension? Yep. GPS? Slap any one of lots of models using several great mounts or use your phone and never pay for dealer updates or get stuck with something outdated. Need music or coms? Who cares about semi-proprietary built-in things on other bikes... just get a Sena (or several others) and bluetooth it up. Different shifters, pegs, throttle tubes, mufflers, exhaust systems, intakes, racks, defectors, screens, pads. Lower it, raise it, flash it for more power and response, add tip-over protection, adjust the bars how you like. Whatever!
Most people can make the Concours what they want. About the only thing I haven't seen is electronically adjustable suspension (something I personally don't care about all that much, anyway).
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You know....you are right. I guess I have not found the perfect combo. I returned from a 2000 mile ride to Pike's Peak and my butt and back were a little more sore then normal.
I have gone from stock seat (over 1000 miles in a day) to a Sargent which I could not go 100 miles to the now Corbin. Added a cruise control, which is now mandatory on any bike I buy. Added risers and a bigger shield. Hard wired in GPS. Stereo and coaxial Heat are stubbed out between tank and seat. Heat for the jacket liner and stereo for hfi5 earbuds.
Bars probably need to come back an inch to take some stress off of the aging back and the search for the perfect seat continues.
So yes, you are right and the extra 18k I would need to move to a BMW is a hell of a lot more then a seat and bar modifications. Guess I was looking for something "perfect" off of the showroom. However, we know how that goes! :)
Which options cannot be added to the Concours? There are so many options, which is one of the best things about the Concours. It is a very reasonably priced platform with fantastic warranty and reliability, decent power, and lots of included useful stuff that can be expanded and changed with so many third-party products.
Want better lighting? No prob. More storage- easy. Better/different seat? Check. Cruise? At least two good options. More or less wind protection? Lots of choices. Different suspension? Yep. GPS? Slap any one of lots of models using several great mounts or use your phone and never pay for dealer updates or get stuck with something outdated. Need music or coms? Who cares about semi-proprietary built-in things on other bikes... just get a Sena (or several others) and bluetooth it up. Different shifters, pegs, throttle tubes, mufflers, exhaust systems, intakes, racks, defectors, screens, pads. Lower it, raise it, flash it for more power and response, add tip-over protection, adjust the bars how you like. Whatever!
Most people can make the Concours what they want. About the only thing I haven't seen is electronically adjustable suspension (something I personally don't care about all that much, anyway).
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You know....you are right. I guess I have not found the perfect combo. I returned from a 2000 mile ride to Pike's Peak and my butt and back were a little more sore then normal.
I have gone from stock seat (over 1000 miles in a day) to a Sargent which I could not go 100 miles to the now Corbin. Added a cruise control, which is now mandatory on any bike I buy. Added risers and a bigger shield. Hard wired in GPS. Stereo and coaxial Heat are stubbed out between tank and seat. Heat for the jacket liner and stereo for hfi5 earbuds.
Bars probably need to come back an inch to take some stress off of the aging back and the search for the perfect seat continues.
So yes, you are right and the extra 18k I would need to move to a BMW is a hell of a lot more then a seat and bar modifications. Guess I was looking for something "perfect" off of the showroom. However, we know how that goes! :)
Airhawk R is what you want to sit on. Its the reason I could do 900+ mile days on my KLR 1 cylinder with knobbie tires coast to coast and back ;D
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/KLR650/SWP_3757.jpg)
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So yes, you are right and the extra 18k I would need to move to a BMW is a hell of a lot more then a seat and bar modifications. Guess I was looking for something "perfect" off of the showroom. However, we know how that goes! :)
I knew going into the Concours that it was not right for me.... but it was the closest I could obtain. My legs and arms are far too short for such a bike. Before I ever even rode it a single time I got and installed the equipment to lower the bike, lower the seat, and raise/pull back the bars (and raise my boots). For me, NOTHING will be right off the showroom floor, ever. So I guess farkling comes naturally to me :)
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I knew going into the Concours that it was not right for me.... but it was the closest I could obtain. My legs and arms are far too short for such a bike. Before I ever even rode it a single time I got and installed the equipment to lower the bike, lower the seat, and raise/pull back the bars (and raise my boots). For me, NOTHING will be right off the showroom floor, ever. So I guess farkling comes naturally to me :)
:thumbs:
(http://f.tqn.com/y/motorcycles/1/S/q/p/0/-/honda-grom-action.jpg)
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:thumbs:
LOL, well, I can handle even the C14 fine with just a few mods.... no need to go quite that extreme...
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LOL, you just about made me blow coffee through my nose.
:thumbs:
(http://f.tqn.com/y/motorcycles/1/S/q/p/0/-/honda-grom-action.jpg)
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Add a Corbin trunk and you could take it anywhere.
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Add a Corbin trunk and you could take it anywhere.
..and have a place to sleep as well. ;D
(sorry max', I couldn't let Conniesaki out do me when it comes to picking on you.)
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..and have a place to sleep as well. ;D
And store the bike when not using it...
(sorry max', I couldn't let Conniesaki out do me when it comes to picking on you.)
Meh, I'm used to it..
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I guess ill get off my duff this winter and add the cruise control....I do about 70 miles a day of highway so yes I need it.
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I really thought I'd miss cruise control, coming from a Wing, but really I find that the Kaoko throttle lock I got really takes care of the vast majority of my needs. Is it a cruise? No, and it will pick up or drop speed up or down hills, but a little bump one way or the other and I'm good to go.
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Had cruise on my Harley Ultra and I miss it on the connie! I do have a throttlemeister and it works ok, but ok isn't good enough.
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My speed varies as the cops can view my progress.
Blast through the valleys, and slow over the crests. 8)
Let's roll. ;)
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Had cruise on my Harley Ultra and I miss it on the connie! I do have a throttlemeister and it works ok, but ok isn't good enough.
Put a Rostra on! I had one but it died on me so I have a Throttlemeister now. It works but the Rostra was much better!
Now regarding the 1600 and new bikes ... the K1600 is lame (sorry, just my opinion of a bike I have ridden several times on more than a "test ride"). I DO NOT like its looks and the bike is flat-out BORING! When I do ride my buddy's 1600 I quickly realize I need to park it and get back on my Connie!
I have ridden an RT, though it was a 2013, and there were some things I liked but don't know that its enough to pull me away from my Connie. Plus, you can buy a new Connie, max out everything you want to do to it (farkle like crazy) and still come in under the cost of a loaded RT!
I have ridden a 2014 Triumph Trophy and THAT is a nice machine! I really liked the Trophy and will definitely be looking hard at that bike when the time comes.
I have heard through the "grapevine" that Kawasaki is done making the current generation Concours after 2016 ... that the 2017 models will change. This came from a sales guy at a Kawasaki shop but we all know how rumors go. We will have to wait and see how true that is.
So, as of right now my plan is to move into a new bike end of 2016/beginning of 2017 (I will have well over 50,000 on my Connie by then). The bikes on my radar are the Trophy, the RT and the newest Concours. I am going to attend the IMS show in Long Beach next November (and will be there this November too) and at that point will have a good idea as to what the new models will be offering. Even though the RT is in the mix the Trophy and Concours are neck-in-neck for me and it will be a tough choice when that time comes. I will say that unless Kawasaki does something with the Concours for 2017 (like CC, electronic suspension control, etc ...) it will more-than-likely be a Trophy my butt is sitting on every day that I ride as I put my 20,000 - 25,000 miles per year on! Although, the "bulletproof-ness" of the Kawasaki will be difficult to walk away from so it's a tough decision and I have just over a year to figure it out.
By-the-way, if anyone in So. Cal. is planning on attending IMS let me know ... it'd be nice to meet some local Concours owners!
Mike
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One more thing, I am considering the ECU Flash from "Steve in Sunny Florida" and if that does what it claims to do then I may be keeping my bike longer and ride that thing hard and fast and get as many miles out of it that I can get! My bike has recently become comfortable, since adding the Baldwin GT seat and getting the new helmet which helped smooth/quiet things behind the windscreen for me. The Concours was fun but not very comfortable before these changes. It is now fun and comfortable so a new bike at the end of next year is still on my mind but the thought of keeping what I have for a while is gaining momentum too, especially if I flash it and gain more power ... that may change a lot of things!
Feel free to chime in on that flash from SISF and let me know if you're loving it. Looking for a little "nudge" here ;)
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Feel free to chime in on that flash from SISF and let me know if you're loving it. Looking for a little "nudge" here ;)
Not sure anyone has done that yet. But if it is even as good as the Guhl flash (which I am confident it would be at least as good if not better), then it is very much worth doing. My bike came alive after I flashed it and highly recommend it as a great upgrade.
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Not sure anyone has done that yet. But if it is even as good as the Guhl flash (which I am confident it would be at least as good if not better), then it is very much worth doing. My bike came alive after I flashed it and highly recommend it as a great upgrade.
Hmmm, have to really consider it now because a flash recommended by MAX who said the bike "wasn't right for him" is a pretty high recommendation :thumbs:!
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Hmmm, have to really consider it now because a flash recommended by MAX who said the bike "wasn't right for him" is a pretty high recommendation :thumbs:!
I said *NO* bike was right for me stock, and that included the C14 based on size (too big/tall). And yeah, if I recommend something, you can bet it is probably worth it... I don't give out praise easily. (Believe it or not, I have been accused pretty regularly of being overly critical).
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Say it ain't so, Max. Say it ain't so!
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Say it ain't so, Max. Say it ain't so!
It's a tough job, but somebody has to do it
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I have owned a good number of BMWs primarily due to Ozzie at Ozzie’s BMW in Chico to include a K1200S. (Ozzie passed and it is still hard for me, I miss him) The C1400 is a brilliant bike. Adding a cruse control, bar risers, a seat, a windshield and a trunk is a minor expense compared to the MSRP of a K1600. The K is in the Goldwing class for Pete sake. The only place where the R1200RT is going to out shine the C14 is on an alpine tour with nothing but switchbacks as far as the eye can see. Not typical American tour riding. (Yes there are places) I was a bit skeptical of the C14s capability in the California countryside. This was quickly put to rest once the break in period was over. 3rd gear is simply perfect! Yes she is big but she is composed and can run! It is a fantastic balance of power, weight and comfort. For about $2000.00 more they could make a better version but is it the market share they are going after?
Dirtwiz Saying that BMW does not make a high mile bike is a bit of an odd statement to me. This is the company that started the sport tour class and was known for high mileage machines. (Despite the fact Yamaha claims they invented the Supersport Touring category) The 1977 R100RS and the 1979 R100RT both predate the 1984 FJ1100. The K100RS “Flying Brick” was introduced in 1982 and by 1988 had ABS. It wasn’t until the 1986 FJ1200 that the bike had a proper faring. Since 1986 The Concourse has been a mainstay in the sport tour class and had the same basic conclusions made when compared to the BMW the year it was introduced in the USA.
(The Concours was introduced into the USA the year after the slightly faster (137 mph) BMW K100LT at less than two-thirds the price of the BMW machine. Both bikes were tested by the magazine Motorcyclist, which came out in favor of the Kawasaki concluding that it was "the most practical, useful and competent motorcycle made" and "superior to the BMW in almost every aspect imaginable. )
(Yamaha…Please)
(On a side note) If you want a bike you can work on quite easily and will run way over 100,000 miles of hard riding get a 2004 BMW R1150RT. Fast? No but it is a proven platform. CHP ran them out to 120,000 miles due to the person that was supposed to deliver the C14 police models to them skipping the country after the first few unit delivery. (As I have been told)
The C14 is a brilliant machine and I am beyond happy with mine.
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I have owned a good number of BMWs primarily due to Ozzie at Ozzie’s BMW in Chico to include a K1200S. (Ozzie passed and it is still hard for me, I miss him) The C1400 is a brilliant bike. Adding a cruse control, bar risers, a seat, a windshield and a trunk is a minor expense compared to the MSRP of a K1600. The K is in the Goldwing class for Pete sake. The only place where the R1200RT is going to out shine the C14 is on an alpine tour with nothing but switchbacks as far as the eye can see. Not typical American tour riding. (Yes there are places) I was a bit skeptical of the C14s capability in the California countryside. This was quickly put to rest once the break in period was over. 3rd gear is simply perfect! Yes she is big but she is composed and can run! It is a fantastic balance of power, weight and comfort. For about $2000.00 more they could make a better version but is it the market share they are going after?
Dirtwiz Saying that BMW does not make a high mile bike is a bit of an odd statement to me. This is the company that started the sport tour class and was known for high mileage machines. (Despite the fact Yamaha claims they invented the Supersport Touring category) The 1977 R100RS and the 1979 R100RT both predate the 1984 FJ1100. The K100RS “Flying Brick” was introduced in 1982 and by 1988 had ABS. It wasn’t until the 1986 FJ1200 that the bike had a proper faring. Since 1986 The Concourse has been a mainstay in the sport tour class and had the same basic conclusions made when compared to the BMW the year it was introduced in the USA.
(The Concours was introduced into the USA the year after the slightly faster (137 mph) BMW K100LT at less than two-thirds the price of the BMW machine. Both bikes were tested by the magazine Motorcyclist, which came out in favor of the Kawasaki concluding that it was "the most practical, useful and competent motorcycle made" and "superior to the BMW in almost every aspect imaginable. )
(Yamaha…Please)
(On a side note) If you want a bike you can work on quite easily and will run way over 100,000 miles of hard riding get a 2004 BMW R1150RT. Fast? No but it is a proven platform. CHP ran them out to 120,000 miles due to the person that was supposed to deliver the C14 police models to them skipping the country after the first few unit delivery. (As I have been told)
The C14 is a brilliant machine and I am beyond happy with mine.
Nice post ruffuride, good for people like me that haven't owned any other ST bikes and wonder what the others are like. It's nice to hear the comparisons and to hear people, who have had BMW experience, talk about what a great bike our Concours is!
Now, if I can just figure out the WINDSCREEN issue :banghead: I'd be 100% satisfied! I struggle with finding the right windscreen, it drives me nuts!!
Maybe my expectations are too high?
Mike
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Nice post ruffuride, good for people like me that haven't owned any other ST bikes and wonder what the others are like. It's nice to hear the comparisons and to hear people, who have had BMW experience, talk about what a great bike our Concours is!
Now, if I can just figure out the WINDSCREEN issue :banghead: I'd be 100% satisfied! I struggle with finding the right windscreen, it drives me nuts!!
Maybe my expectations are too high?
Mike
Mike,
ruffride stated a lot of good facts. I too started my Sport Touring
on BMW's. I had several posts on the original forum (before they erased it all) regarding my BMW experiences. I had just over 300,000miles on BMW's before the C14 was announced. Way back in 1990 I test rode a C10 and eventually passed it up for a 1984 R100RT BMW 60th Anniversary Edition. I put about 50K miles on that one and ordered a 1993 K1100LT when they were first announced here in the USA. I still
have that LT with around 150,000 miles on it. You'll see it when I get out there in November. In 1996, the R1100RT was announced and after one test ride, I had to have one. The Telelever front suspension was amazing
and the 90 HP was pretty good for a Boxer. I put 85K on that bike and it
still lives in my garage here. In 1999 or so I found a 1984 Last Edition R100RS in Pearl White with 19K miles on it. Still have it and it gets out a few times a year. All my BMW's have been reliable but the C14 was the bike I was waiting for, handling, power and reliability in one package. I ordered my C14 in Oct 2009 and took delivery Dec 5th. I rode it home and tore it apart to install all goodies I had purchased for it's arrival. Full Muzzy exhaust, Starcom Intercom, Garmin GPS, Fuzeblock, Powerlets, Cee Bailey tinted Ultra windscreen, Phil's rack, risers and wedges. Later I installed a Rocky Mayer Leather dual heated seat.
Windscreens: My last long ride was to Canmore, Alberta and we had winds all the way up and back. I had such bad buffeting on that trip that I started hunting when I got home to fix it. I ordered an MRA Xcreen tinted and the touring Xcreen adjustable wing. The Xcreen was OK but too small. I added the two pressure relief holes to my original C14 windscreen and added the adjustable touring spoiler from Xcreen. That is a very good compromise and it's still on my bike a year later.
Mick
PS (Douglas is coming out to give us an estimate Sat)
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Mike,
ruffride stated a lot of good facts. I too started my Sport Touring
on BMW's. I had several posts on the original forum (before they erased it all) regarding my BMW experiences. I had just over 300,000miles on BMW's before the C14 was announced. Way back in 1990 I test rode a C10 and eventually passed it up for a 1984 R100RT BMW 60th Anniversary Edition. I put about 50K miles on that one and ordered a 1993 K1100LT when they were first announced here in the USA. I still
have that LT with around 150,000 miles on it. You'll see it when I get out there in November. In 1996, the R1100RT was announced and after one test ride, I had to have one. The Telelever front suspension was amazing
and the 90 HP was pretty good for a Boxer. I put 85K on that bike and it
still lives in my garage here. In 1999 or so I found a 1984 Last Edition R100RS in Pearl White with 19K miles on it. Still have it and it gets out a few times a year. All my BMW's have been reliable but the C14 was the bike I was waiting for, handling, power and reliability in one package. I ordered my C14 in Oct 2009 and took delivery Dec 5th. I rode it home and tore it apart to install all goodies I had purchased for it's arrival. Full Muzzy exhaust, Starcom Intercom, Garmin GPS, Fuzeblock, Powerlets, Cee Bailey tinted Ultra windscreen, Phil's rack, risers and wedges. Later I installed a Rocky Mayer Leather dual heated seat.
Windscreens: My last long ride was to Canmore, Alberta and we had winds all the way up and back. I had such bad buffeting on that trip that I started hunting when I got home to fix it. I ordered an MRA Xcreen tinted and the touring Xcreen adjustable wing. The Xcreen was OK but too small. I added the two pressure relief holes to my original C14 windscreen and added the adjustable touring spoiler from Xcreen. That is a very good compromise and it's still on my bike a year later.
Mick
PS (Douglas is coming out to give us an estimate Sat)
Hi Mick and thanks for the info. Hopefully Fairweather works out for you.
I like when I hear BMW riders talk good stuff about our Connie! I've wanted the Connie since I saw it in '08 and had never thought about another bike. I went 20 years between bikes so this is my first since my ZX6 way back when! I love my Connie but when it's the only "big bike" you've owned it makes you wonder.
Windscreens ... Arrrggghhh! I had the MRA on Madstad brackets and, like an idiot, sold it! I sold it before I went to the new and smoother Ibuki modular helmet and now I'm regretting it! It wasn't that the MRA blocked more wind but it did make the air "smoother" and not so loud and choppy. I am probably going to end up ordering another MRA X-creen and putting that on for good! I've tried all the others and none do the job very well in my opinion.
When are you going to be out here? I look forward to seeing you and riding with you. We need to go up and over Hwy 33 and grab a burger in Maricopa or something in that area! We can go wherever we decide to go, so many good options out here!
Mike
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Mike,
Thank you for the kind words. I have a 7jrock shield on my bike. I had them do a slight alteration at the top to reduce overall surface area at that spot. I am very happy with my shield and the service. They are worth a look.
Did they get Hwy 33 cleared of the mudslide and open? Do you know if they took measures to keep that section from being wrecked by future storms?
The only bike in the BMW line that compares directly to the C14 is the K12 and K1300 Gt. This bike had a few small issues so not a huge risk to buy, but for the most part is as close of a comparison power size and layout as you are going to get. Yes the K12/13 has electronic cruise but beyond that not much more than a heated seat separate the two. The K 12 and 13 GT are now bikes of the past and BMW does not really make a GT any more even though they have the 1600 marked that way. C14 is a fantastic machine worth riding many, many miles.
My list of BMWs ridden and owned*
R75/5* F650cs
R75/7
R100rt* K100R
R850r K100rt*
R1100r* K1100rs
R1100rs* K1200rs*
R1100s K1200gt gen 1*
R1150r* K1200gt gen 2
R1150rs* K1200s*
R1150gs
R1150rt*
R1200c
R1200st
R1200rt
For the record I have also owned a C10
Best,
Jon
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Mike,
Thank you for the kind words. I have a 7jrock shield on my bike. I had them do a slight alteration at the top to reduce overall surface area at that spot. I am very happy with my shield and the service. They are worth a look.
Did they get Hwy 33 cleared of the mudslide and open? Do you know if they took measures to keep that section from being wrecked by future storms?
The only bike in the BMW line that compares directly to the C14 is the K12 and K1300 Gt. This bike had a few small issues so not a huge risk to buy, but for the most part is as close of a comparison power size and layout as you are going to get. Yes the K12/13 has electronic cruise but beyond that not much more than a heated seat separate the two. The K 12 and 13 GT are now bikes of the past and BMW does not really make a GT any more even though they have the 1600 marked that way. C14 is a fantastic machine worth riding many, many miles.
My list of BMWs ridden and owned*
R75/5* F650cs
R75/7
R100rt* K100R
R850r K100rt*
R1100r* K1100rs
R1100rs* K1200rs*
R1100s K1200gt gen 1*
R1150r* K1200gt gen 2
R1150rs* K1200s*
R1150gs
R1150rt*
R1200c
R1200st
R1200rt
For the record I have also owned a C10
Best,
Jon
Hi Jon and you're welcome. I do appreciate the comparisons from people that have that experience.
WOW, you've ridden a few Beemers! The nice thing about our bike is that you can add a heated seat (I have a Baldwin with heat ... Baldwin is best IMO) and the cruise can be added with a weekend's worth of work and $300! I had one but it died. I may be replacing it soon.
Now, are you in So. Cal.? Not many would ask about Hwy 33 unless they're here or have been here. I didn't here about a mudslide on the 33 but they had a HUGE slide on the 5 going up the Grapevine, which you can get to if you take the fun part of the 33, the part with all the twisties :thumbs:! Just to share, the 33 is a block from my house and the road up the canyon is 3 miles away ... basically my backyard! Also, another fun ride, Hwy 150 around Lake Casitas is 2 miles from my house so I spend some time on both. I love the Hwy 150 ride up to Carpenteria and then riding the 101 up to Santa Barbara and then taking the 154 up to Solvang for breakfast or lunch. Then, take the 154 North to Zaca Station Rd. and ride the twisties through the Wineries and back to the 166, to the 33 and home ... great ride for the day!
Mike
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I've ridden a lot of BMW's from the factory demo trucks. The BMW I liked the most was an R1200R with the old Tele-lever front end. If I was in the marked for a naked standard and had a lot of disposable money, that would be the BMW I'd be most interested in. A lot of "if's".
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I've ridden a lot of BMW's from the factory demo trucks. The BMW I liked the most was an R1200R with the old Tele-lever front end. If I was in the marked for a naked standard and had a lot of disposable money, that would be the BMW I'd be most interested in. A lot of "if's".
Since we're on the subject, do you think the Connie is one of the best you've owned or ridden? Talking all-around-best here?
Mike
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Since we're on the subject, do you think the Connie is one of the best you've owned or ridden? Talking all-around-best here?
Mike
Yes! Definitely the best I've owned and ridden.
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Yes! Definitely the best I've owned and ridden.
Good to hear. Thanks!
I know I'm going to sound like a broken record here but I was thinking, almost certain I was going to trade it in end-of-next-year for a Triumph Trophy but I'm having 2nd thoughts now. When I was convinced I was going to make that move it was before I found the right seat and before Steve's ECU flash which made the bike so much more fun to ride! I may still trade it in but am thinking about staying with Concours now and getting a new one when the 2017 model comes out. Shoot, I can buy the bike and farkle it and have Steve flash it for less than a new BMW or Triumph! I still enjoy the "sportier" riding position of the Concours (no bar risers for me) and don't know if I'm ready to go completely upright yet! Supposedly Kawi is changing the Concours in 2017, info I received from a Kawi salesperson.
Mike
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The reason I buy Kawasaki's is so I don't have to go to the dealers- after 5 years the only time the bike saw a dealer again was for the safety recall. Awesome reliability so far.
+1
Mine has went over 109,000 miles. KiPass is so powerful I never dreamed of pinning bags or radiator protection or such. Just Rotella oil and 89 gas and go!!! (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
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... but I fail to see where the term "upgrade" fits in here, both when talking of "upgrading" a perfectly working '08 C14 to a '10+, or from the C14 ...
My '08 C14 with 91,000 miles has been a superlative bike. No major issues, just reliable...and FAST (flies out, PCIII, AreaP CF slipon).
I had been looking at getting a second bike...maybe a Tuono or S2R1000 or...well, then I saw zxjack's '10 C14 for $5900 with a Rostra CC and Cox radiator guard. I jumped on it.
The '10 has some things that I like...traction control, better stock windscreen, nicer looking fairing, better fit/finish, ability to scroll thru display and linked brakes (gasp!).
I'm not a big fan of the linked brake calibration but I do believe in the concept. Everything else is way better than my '08. My '08 has a CB Euro Tour windscreen..it's HUGE. The '10 stock windscreen is much better than the '08 stock screen and a nice contrast to the CB screen.
For the mild Savannah "winters", the '10 screen is plenty. Last year, I rode to Newfoundland and the CB screen was welcome...even in June.
My '08 suspension is close to clapped out...it's had a hard life...lots of dirt, gravel and rutted roads. I have done hundreds of full throttle runs thru the first three gears (stock clutch) and it still runs and shifts great (but not as "snick, snick" as the lower mileage '10).
The heat management of the C14v2 is also much better than my '08.
I realize that the '10 is more neutered than the '08/'09 but I'm not interested in going faster than 135 anyway. I will probably reflash the '10 ECU next year...or, maybe not.
It's too bad so many of the mags subtract points because of the lack of a Kawasaki cruise control.
IMO, there are significant upgrades in the C14v2 ('10 and later) that are worth extra $$.
Unfortunately, I have resigned myself to not even attempting to sell my "high mileage" '08. Best bet is that I will be able to trade it. At least I can now take the '08 to the track without reservation...now that I have another bike to ride.
YMMV.
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+1
Mine has went over 109,000 miles. KiPass is so powerful I never dreamed of pinning bags or radiator protection or such. Just Rotella oil and 89 gas and go!!! (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
;D
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Mike,
I work in Newhall live in the North SF bay area and was trying to get home on that Friday. Grapevine and Tehachapi were closed. I gambled and lost. I tried to slip out of So Cal on 33 and it was closed do to a slide. I got to the tunnel and was turned around and took the 150 to the north end of Santa Barbara along the hills.
I then suffered my way up 101 then cut over south of King City to Coalinga I think it was 190 or 192.
I want to keep up on the conditions of alternate routes as we are headed into another El Nino and the Grapevine might be a train wreck. Oddly enough I was on my C10 on the Grapevine as the 1998 El Nino was dropping Malibu houses into the ocean. When I finally made Hollywood the rain was so thick I was down to 20 feet of visibility. All I could do was laugh at myself for thinking this was a good idea.
There are not too many places in California I have not been so…
Best,
Jon
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+1
Mine has went over 109,000 miles. KiPass is so powerful I never dreamed of pinning bags or radiator protection or such. Just Rotella oil and 89 gas and go!!! (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif) (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
You use 89 octane without issues? Is yours flashed with Steve's latest flash?
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Mike,
I work in Newhall live in the North SF bay area and was trying to get home on that Friday. Grapevine and Tehachapi were closed. I gambled and lost. I tried to slip out of So Cal on 33 and it was closed do to a slide. I got to the tunnel and was turned around and took the 150 to the north end of Santa Barbara along the hills.
I then suffered my way up 101 then cut over south of King City to Coalinga I think it was 190 or 192.
I want to keep up on the conditions of alternate routes as we are headed into another El Nino and the Grapevine might be a train wreck. Oddly enough I was on my C10 on the Grapevine as the 1998 El Nino was dropping Malibu houses into the ocean. When I finally made Hollywood the rain was so thick I was down to 20 feet of visibility. All I could do was laugh at myself for thinking this was a good idea.
There are not too many places in California I have not been so…
Best,
Jon
Jon, that's quite a commute, Frisco to Newhall!
I know the Grapevine well. I used to spend every summer in Kingsburg hanging out with my cousins ... great memories! I was only a kid and was dreaming of making that trip on a bike back then! I've always wanted to ride ... I was born with that bug!
El Nino's going to really mess with our riding. It was the last El Nino that washed out the main road going home. It was taking me 4-5 hours to get home from work ... a drive that, without traffic, would only take 30 minutes!
Take care,
Mike
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The higher the rpms, the higher compression. It's the way the engine works. Sort of an on demand kind of thing. I'm going to run what the bike manufacturer specified or above, but that's me. 89 is close to the recommended value of 90. Steve rides the he** out of his bike and it looks like it's mad Powah has not been compromised. We don't have 90 in this country. At least I've never seen it. I think that the engine is 'noisier' when running 89 but that's subjective..
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The only place where the R1200RT is going to out shine the C14 is on an alpine tour with nothing but switchbacks as far as the eye can see. Not typical American tour riding. (Yes there are places)
Before I landed back on my chair (from the jump that provoked the shock of your statement) I had all sorts of things to say to refute it, but maybe I am prejudging you, so before I say anything stupid and basically underestimate you: what's your source for that? have you been here in the Alps with a C14 and an RT to back you up?
Just for reference: I did. Many, many thousands of km/miles. And I have no idea why somebody would say something like that, except for personal preference. And here are my conclusions: the RT is wobbly (yeap, even with the ESA dialled in to the stiffest setting), unstable, noisy, with a front end that tells you less than the NSA, and all at a fantastic (in the sense of ridiculous) MSRP. It is, in my opinion, a fantastic mile muncher, even better than the K16 in terms of bang for the buck, and more comfortable, lighter and manoeuvrable.
On a side note: you guys who think, as BMW want you to, that the GTL version is more comfy than the GT, pay attention to your knees. You will, specially after a days riding (>500 miles).
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All I can do is :) at this point....
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Good to hear. Thanks!
I know I'm going to sound like a broken record here but I was thinking, almost certain I was going to trade it in end-of-next-year for a Triumph Trophy but I'm having 2nd thoughts now. When I was convinced I was going to make that move it was before I found the right seat and before Steve's ECU flash which made the bike so much more fun to ride! I may still trade it in but am thinking about staying with Concours now and getting a new one when the 2017 model comes out. Shoot, I can buy the bike and farkle it and have Steve flash it for less than a new BMW or Triumph! I still enjoy the "sportier" riding position of the Concours (no bar risers for me) and don't know if I'm ready to go completely upright yet! Supposedly Kawi is changing the Concours in 2017, info I received from a Kawi salesperson.
Mike
The only Triumph I've ridden is the Rocket III. If your looking for something to pull stumps, that is the beast to have. I have never felt anything with more low end torque.
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I had the bug for a K1600 GT for a while as well. The main thing about it that sounded attractive to me is the reputed lower center of gravity. But I've concluded that it just isn't different enough than the C14 to warrant a switch, especially at the price.
Now, I came off a 1200RT. I really liked that bike. It handled well, it felt light and maneuvered well at low speed, and had excellent range and good wind protection. Both the throttle and the clutch pulls were light. The cruise control was great. There were a few annoying things about it though. It shook. It was easy to stall. It was a bit underpowered. But I kind of wish I still had it.
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When are you going to be out here? I look forward to seeing you and riding with you. We need to go up and over Hwy 33 and grab a burger in Maricopa or something in that area! We can go wherever we decide to go, so many good options out here!
Mike
[/quote]
Should be there next week. I have some repairs to do at the house, then we ride. Burger place is in new cuyama.
Mick
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When are you going to be out here? I look forward to seeing you and riding with you. We need to go up and over Hwy 33 and grab a burger in Maricopa or something in that area! We can go wherever we decide to go, so many good options out here!
Mike
Should be there next week. I have some repairs to do at the house, then we ride. Burger place is in new cuyama.
Mick
Nice ... looking forward to it!