Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: TonyR on June 12, 2015, 01:24:24 PM
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Anyone have any information on what's coming?
Someone told me there is a new model for 2016 but I can't find any information about it.
Thanks
Tony
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:popcorn: That's what we've heard for the last four years or so.. However, it's never too early to speculate.
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Likely to be a well-kept secret if it is happening... let the rampant speculation begin!!!!
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I haven't heard anything. My guess... same dirt, different shirt.
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expect nothing more than "bold new graphics" for '16 (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/lol8.gif)
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Mix a couple of buckets of left over paint and Voila...2016!
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Mix a couple of buckets of left over paint and Voila...2016!
Oh great- it will be brown! (Seems like whenever you mix a bunch of colors, you end up with brown).
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Yellow... it's gonna be yellow...
I'm buying it.
Tony
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Yellow... it's gonna be yellow...
I'm buying it.
Tony
^^that would be nice!
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The way the paint hasn't held up on my '12, it doesn't really matter what color it is to me. I'm not sure if I am ever going to wash mine again. The paint just hasn't held up.
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According to this, there is a new model coming, but. . . who really knows. No specific details, yet. tp
http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/motorcycles/2016/Kawasaki.htm (http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/motorcycles/2016/Kawasaki.htm)
According to this page, no new KLR650, and there are many more waiting for that to happen, than a new C14. Kawi is a funny company when it comes to new models. tp
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Excellent! I knew it would be 2016! :rotflmao: We'll find out what Kwackers thinks is 'new'. I'm hoping it's a gen 3.
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I would think to keep up with the FJR they would add throttle by wire with cruise control and optional ESA. But I'm not holding my breath.
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I would think to keep up with the FJR they would add throttle by wire with cruise control and optional ESA. But I'm not holding my breath.
+1
I would think the FJR should get 6th gear too.... its so 1990ish ;D
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I would think to keep up with the FJR they would add throttle by wire with cruise control
I think that is going to be a given with any major redesign. All vehicles are going to throttle-by-wire, bikes included. And 98% of cruise control is essentially built-in when you have throttle-by-wire (you just need a handlebar control and an icon on the display).
and optional ESA. But I'm not holding my breath.
ESA can still be somewhat gimmicky (not a big value and yet expensive). So it would not surprise me at all of that were not an option. But, who knows.
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Funny my 1983 Honda Sabre V-45 had 6 gears. And then some.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_Sabre_V4
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I hear that there will be integrated cup holders.
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I hear that there will be integrated cup holders.
Yesterday walking from a parking lot into a restaurant I saw a parked, several-year-old, decked-out HD (with perhaps 2 or 3K miles on it). It had a CHROME cup holder mounted to the bars....
Yes, I rolled my eyes. ::)
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And there will be chrome...
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expect nothing more than "bold new graphics" for '16 (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/lol8.gif)
I hate that you've been saying the same for the last 5 years or more, and you've been right every time :banghead:
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I'll take "Conjecture and Wishful Thinking " for $500, Alex.
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Yesterday walking from a parking lot into a restaurant I saw a parked, several-year-old, decked-out HD (with perhaps 2 or 3K miles on it). It had a CHROME cup holder mounted to the bars....
Yes, I rolled my eyes. ::)
I have a nice 22 oz black cup on my touring bike. Sure is nice to not have to try and squeeze that hydration pack tube into my FF helmet while riding.
I guess that is why they call it luxury touring.
I suppose you roll your eyes at any car other than a Corvette. (closest car I can think to compare to the Concours).
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I've used my glove box for a cup holder...
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:thumbs:
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It had a CHROME cup holder mounted to the bars....
Those chrome cup holders are insulated and not cheap. Seen them on all types of bikes, at rallies, etc. I have a cheapie plastic one on my Dyna and RT. They hold drinks at arms reach, so no stopping to take a swig,,, of water or diet DP, that is. I NEVER consume any alcohol before or during a ride, ever. Now after a ride, anything is possible. Lost a friend to that nonsense, back in the late 70's. Taught me well, his passing did. tp
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No doubt, Tomp. Drinking and riding don't mix. Ever. ;)
That's why I don't get hardly wobbleson get togethers. There is always beer. I quit doing any poker runs because of this. I love getting my drink on, after the bike is parked for the day. ;D
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+1. I can barely keep it upright (easy boys) when sober.
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Back to the 16. Still nothing pops on google for USA, UK, Europe, or Australia. After owning a ZZR1200, with its arm wrenching feel, I would love a Concours seating position/ergos, with that same feel. Guess it will require the ZX14R's engine to deliver that. Oh well, WTF, I can't afford a new bike without digging into my retirement $'s. Guess the current 14 will have to do. A Multistrada, Diavel, Tuono, S1000R, etc would also provide that feel, but at a cost higher than a Kawi, or perhaps find a used ZX14R, and have a twofer, in the garage. tp
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Back to the 16. Still nothing pops on google for USA, UK, Europe, or Australia. After owning a ZZR1200, with its arm wrenching feel, I would love a Concours seating position/ergos, with that same feel. Guess it will require the ZX14R's engine to deliver that. Oh well, WTF, I can't afford a new bike without digging into my retirement $'s. Guess the current 14 will have to do. A Multistrada, Diavel, Tuono, S1000R, etc would also provide that feel, but at a cost higher than a Kawi, or perhaps find a used ZX14R, and have a twofer, in the garage. tp
The ZX-14's are amazing bikes. They're much larger and heavier than 600cc sport bikes but because of that they are much more comfortable. But as powerful as the C14 is, the ZX is in another class altogether. You'd be amazed as how little you can pickup a nice used one for...
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I though that this might be interesting on the past speculation for different years..
2015 - http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=17833.0 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=17833.0)
2014 - http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=13058.0 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=13058.0)
2013 - http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=9656.0 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=9656.0)
2012 - http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=3364.0 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=3364.0)
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deja vu all over again
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It does seem that way..
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I have never replaced a bike with the same. Came close with the Versys because the '14s were heavily discounted when the new design was announced. Love the green and the ABS was a plus, but when it came down to it I just couldn't justify replacing a perfectly fine motorcycle with the same.
I really want to give the Triumph Trophy a test ride. I think it could replace the Concours and the Voyager. My wife is rarely riding these days so my yearly average on the Voyager has dropped to 10,000 miles a year.
Looking around, the only bike besides the cruisers that offers a passenger floorboard is the Goldwing.
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I wouldn't buy the first year model of anything anymore, so do not regret buying a 2015 'old' Connie. Should be close to bulletproof by now 8). I'm used to a bit more power, but it has plenty. And the Throttlemeister is fine for the few times I need to free my right hand from the throttle. And I wouldn't mind adjustable shocks, as long as the entire suspension system was tuned on the sporty side... which is rarely the case. So rather have it fixed on the sporty side, like the Connie. The only improvement I'd like is a smoother engine, but no bike manufacturer has engine tolerances close enough to avoid that, so it's the nature of the beast. But a perfectly balanced engine (including crankshaft) would be awesome. Here BMW has the advantage with its 6-cyl K1600 bikes, since an inline 6 is naturally balanced in both primary and secondary order vibrations. But with so many inherent problem and mammoth size, I just couldn't justify one at the end. The Connie turned out a lot better than my ex K1300S, and although I still had numbing, it was manageable due to its long gearing on the highway. Even at its old age, the Connie is still the best sport-touring bike IMO, and certainly the best value as well. Happy with my purchase.
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I wouldn't buy the first year model of anything anymore..
That's what I said back in 2007 before I bought my 2008 in August of that year... Haven't regretted a single day.
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Bought the first year Honda Prelude car in 79-80, and what a mistake that was. So slow we called it The Quaalude, because that's how it made you feel, like everything was moving in slow motion. Ask all the first year Beta testers that own BMW's. I believe that's how they road test their bikes, using their customers as guinea pigs. tp
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I bought he '10 C14 after they made a ton of changes. 105,000 miles later, couldn't be happier.
I've owned a gazillion race, enduro, dual sport, drag bike, and a plethora of all out crotch rockets and this by far has been my favorite bike. Although i'm STILL not a Kawasaki fan as most know ;D
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Thank goodness for that. For a second I thought you were becoming a Kwackers fanatic. ;)
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Thank goodness for that. For a second I thought you were becoming a Kwackers fanatic. ;)
Rode 42 years before my first Kawi, a ZZR1200, have had five others since then. All have been decent bikes, at decent prices. If I had the extra bucks, I would probably get a Duc, Multistrada, or the new R1200R, S1000R or XR. Oh well, don't have that level of extra, so the C14 it will be, for hopefully a long time. tp
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I bought he '10 C14 after they made a ton of changes. 105,000 miles later, couldn't be happier.
I've owned a gazillion race, enduro, dual sport, drag bike, and a plethora of all out crotch rockets and this by far has been my favorite bike. Although i'm STILL not a Kawasaki fan as most know ;D
yeah, you say that now, but recent government officials forwarded this to me.. talk yer way outta this one....
(http://z4.ifrm.com/12415/11/0/p1044009/Larrys_Kawasaki_tattoo.jpg)
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yeah, you say that now, but recent government officials forwarded this to me.. talk yer way outta this one....
(http://z4.ifrm.com/12415/11/0/p1044009/Larrys_Kawasaki_tattoo.jpg)
Possibly he is into bullet trains, Tanker ships and electric plants, and not motorcycles... tp
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Possibly he is into bullet trains, Tanker ships and electric plants, and not motorcycles... tp
hey, don't DIS the K tatoo....
its forever... or so they say....
still working with a soldering iron to remove
Terri
June
Laura
Marlene
and a bunch of others...
I'm sure a weed wakker would be less pain, and faster....
just joking, id never tatoo some bimbo's name on my body...
but "Let's Party" or Ludes for us all...maybe.. nah
never get a tatoo..
(http://tattootodo.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Dumbest-Tattoos-of-All-Time-2.jpg)
(http://cdn.viralscape.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Worst-Tattoo-28.jpg)
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hey, don't DIS the K tatoo....
its forever... or so they say....
Wouldn't think of it. My son has tats, as well as his GF. Never been into needles, so no ink on me. That one looks much better than one saying Honda, or Yamaha. tp
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Wouldn't think of it. My son has tats, as well as his GF. Never been into needles, so no ink on me. That one looks much better than one saying Honda, or Yamaha. tp
coulda been worse, like a cog person painted on his tank, and posted years ago ... " KAWASKI".. polish? I dunno
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Heck, the Suzuki X-6 Hustler (T20) built from 1966-1968 had six gears (get it: X-6)... >;o)
So 60s-ish, I guess...
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Let's steer this back to the 2016 C14 speculation, please.
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Let's steer this back to the 2016 C14 speculation, please.
Checked around the interweb, still no '16 info. The Z800 is starting to get some space, but it is not actually new, just a replant to US shores. Three more months? Maybe three more years. . . tp
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BNG for 2016
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Checked around the interweb, still no '16 info.
Well, we are only halfway through 2015, so it shouldn't be all THAT surprising...
Yet one would think something would have slipped/leaked by now if there were anything big to report.
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And that would be the 2016 color..
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And that would be the 2016 color..
And dramatic new graphics, too. . . ;D
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That would be the sparkles in the paint.. :rotflmao:
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BNG for 2016
Do you know what the Urban Dictionary defines BNG as? :rotflmao: :thumbs:
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Do you know what the Urban Dictionary defines BNG as? :rotflmao: :thumbs:
I had to look it up. I'm wondering how you knew... ;D ;D
Jim, think they'll go the MoCo way with Hard Candy metallics?
(http://motorcycleppf.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/hardcandy4-002-500x446.jpg?152daa)
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No.
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I had to look it up. I'm wondering how you knew... ;D ;D
Jim, think they'll go the MoCo way with Hard Candy metallics?
(http://motorcycleppf.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/hardcandy4-002-500x446.jpg?152daa)
Maybe more chrome and a 240 rear tire ;D
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Maybe more chrome ;D
I hope not. Have a Dyna Custom, loaded with Chrome, and what a PITA it is to keep looking nice. No chrome on the RT, and none on the C14, mucho bettero...
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Just spent a week riding the rockies with my son. He has a 2013 FJR with ride by wire and built in cruise control. After experiencing that, I really think that is the next thing Kawi should do to this bike. Add ride by wire with cruise control. The FJR has 2 modes, sport ant touring that change the throttle response and it is just a matter of programing. Throttle tamer by software. And the CC is far more responsive and easy to use than my after market Rostra. I was able to use CC even in the middle of a group just by touching the + and - buttons to add or subtract 1 mph. The Rostra has that but the buttons are not as convenient and the response is much better on the built in CC. If Kawi wants to keep up with the state of the art sport touring segment, this is what they must do ASAP.
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I had to look it up. I'm wondering how you knew... ;D ;D
Jim, think they'll go the MoCo way with Hard Candy metallics?
(http://motorcycleppf.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/hardcandy4-002-500x446.jpg?152daa)
I love that Hard Candy Green. Made me almost put a 72 in the garage, but then common sense kicked in.
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Just spent a week riding the rockies with my son. He has a 2013 FJR with ride by wire and built in cruise control. A[...]If Kawi wants to keep up with the state of the art sport touring segment, this is what they must do ASAP.
I don't think there is any question this is coming, eventually.... whenever the next generation of C14 hits. I have been saying for years that 2016 will be the earliest, but will it happen in 2016?
Meanwhile, if Yamaha wants to keep up with what has been state of the art for the last 8 years of the Concours in sport touring, they need to add a 6th gear...
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The FJR doesn't look as good as the C14 either...
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That's why I passed on it in 2007. It was a fugly bike then and it still is now.
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The FJR doesn't look as good as the C14 either...
So very true
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I don't think there is any question this is coming, eventually.... whenever the next generation of C14 hits. I have been saying for years that 2016 will be the earliest, but will it happen in 2016?
Meanwhile, if Yamaha wants to keep up with what has been state of the art for the last 8 years of the Concours in sport touring, they need to add a 6th gear...
Perhaps, but I don't use it all that much on my C14. And I certainly didn't miss it at all riding the FJR in the Colorado mountains. Don't get me wrong, I wasn't saying I prefer the FJR, only that it made me a fan of ride-by-wire. I got home to Austin on my C14 and was thrilled to open her up.
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I don't think there is any question this is coming, eventually.... whenever the next generation of C14 hits. I have been saying for years that 2016 will be the earliest, but will it happen in 2016?
Meanwhile, if Yamaha wants to keep up with what has been state of the art for the last 8 years of the Concours in sport touring, they need to add a 6th gear...
Has anyone compared RPMs at given speeds in top gear on the FJR and Connie? I'm wondering because the gear ratio is what matters, not how many gears.
My Versys has 6 gears and I am in 6th at 45 mph with the stock gearing. Many owners that tour on it change the sprockets to get the RPMs down.
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Perhaps, but I don't use it all that much on my C14.
??? I use it ALL THE TIME.... pretty much anytime I am going over 65MPH and don't expect to need to downshift often. It is a very tall gear, so it is extremely comfortable. (I suspect most people do when on the super-slab). Now, out in the country, I don't use it anywhere near as much- the speed limits are lower and even when not, there are lots of corners and hazards, so I would just be going from 5th to 6th back and forth all the time.
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Has anyone compared RPMs at given speeds in top gear on the FJR and Connie? I'm wondering because the gear ratio is what matters, not how many gears.
Extremely good point. Yes, it does matter how many gears, though- as it gives you more control and more ability to keep it in a comfortable range for what you are trying to accomplish. But the assumption is also that the C14's very tall 6th gear is designed for low RPM high-speed cruising. A 5-speed bike could do that too, but it would mean moving the range of all the other gears a lot. I would be very surprised if an FJR in 5th was near the same RPM as a C14 going at the same speed in 6th.
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Kawi website site provides this for the C14:
Gear ratio: 4th 1.545 (34/22)
Gear ratio: 3rd 1.900 (38/20)
Gear ratio: 2nd 2.412 (41/17)
Final reduction ratio 2.036 (14/22 x 32/10)
Gear ratio: 1st 3.538 (46/13)
Gear ratio: 6th 1.074 (29/27)
Primary reduction ratio 1.556 (84/54)
Gear ratio: 5th 1.292 (31/24)
... and this guy http://www.fjrowners.com/forums/8-fjr-central/21818-2014-fjr-2.html#post213778 (http://www.fjrowners.com/forums/8-fjr-central/21818-2014-fjr-2.html#post213778) says these are for the FJR:
Primary reduction ratio 75/48 (1.563)
Secondary reduction ratio 35/37 × 21/27 × 33/9 (2.69)
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Too much math needed for my tired brain :) (Oh, plus one would have to know tire circumferences too, I believe)
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The OEM tire widths are slightly different between FJR and C14 , but have the same diameter, per the Bridgestone catalog anyway. So the net of it all is that in top gear, the FJR engine is turning 15% faster.
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I wish Kawasaki would give me some incentive to buy a new bike. More features, Power, Mileage, and better range would be nice. Wouldn't hurt to make the bike a little better looking either. As it stands there is simply no reason I should part company with my '10 Connie (to buy anything really)
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Has anyone compared RPMs at given speeds in top gear on the FJR and Connie? I'm wondering because the gear ratio is what matters, not how many gears.
My Versys has 6 gears and I am in 6th at 45 mph with the stock gearing. Many owners that tour on it change the sprockets to get the RPMs down.
At 100 mph I think the Yamaha was at 5500 rpm and the Concours at 4400 rpm. If I remember correctly.
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I wish Kawasaki would give me some incentive to buy a new bike. More features, Power, Mileage, and better range would be nice. Wouldn't hurt to make the bike a little better looking either. As it stands there is simply no reason I should part company with my '10 Connie (to buy anything really)
One of the best things about the Concours is that it doesn't change much. It is a great design and there will be lots of third party addons due to the stability of the platform. It also means easier for repair parts, more mechanics familiar with it, etc.
The next gen will come eventually. Then you will be able to kiss your wallet good-bye again and watch your insurance and taxes soar again :)
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IMHO that time has come. The bike has been the same for the what now...10 years? Sure it has gone through a slight changes or two, but I cant think that its time for a Major one. Add cruise /electronic suspension and such.
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IMHO that time has come. The bike has been the same for the what now...10 years? Sure it has gone through a slight changes or two, but I cant think that its time for a Major one. Add cruise /electronic suspension and such.
Cruise, I would like; the rest, you can have. Had a 12 R1200RT, with every bell and whistle, nice bike, but at $23K, the payments were just too high. Had to sell it. To me, all the C14 needs is cruise, to be the ultimate Sport Touring bike. Doesn't need the 14R engine or electronic/semi active suspension for 95+% of its riders. Just my opinion; take it for what it is, mine... tp
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IMHO that time has come. The bike has been the same for the what now...10 years?
Need I remind you how long the Concours 10 (C-10/Concours 1000) ran before the Concours 14 came out? (20 years) And the C10 was largely identical from 1994 through 2006 (12 years). The C14 is only 7 years old.
Sure it has gone through a slight changes or two,
The two "generations" of C14 were not slight changes, but not big changes either. Slight would be the 2015 mods.
but I cant think that its time for a Major one. Add cruise /electronic suspension and such.
I really don't think they are going to add cruise until throttle-by-wire... and that, alone, would be a pretty big change (New ECU, removal of the flies, new controls and programming, recertification/testing). Electronic suspension adjustment... meh... we will see. That is a fairly expensive addon with not a lot of bang for the buck. I would not be surprised if that didn't happen with even a big makeover (unless it were an option and not standard).
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Bold new graphics, and smart folks will purchase left overs ;D
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Bold new graphics, and smart folks will purchase left overs ;D
I suppose only Kawi bean counters really know their next move ... and if they're satisfied with recent sales results and sales projections, why risk spending money changing it?
It reminds me of the Nissan Titan (which I have): Came out new in '04 and has barely changed. My '05 is still a great truck, still seems reasonably modern to me, and Nissan must be satisfied with sales.
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What are your wishes by a new development?
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Electronic suspension adjustment... meh... we will see. That is a fairly expensive addon with not a lot of bang for the buck. I would not be surprised if that didn't happen with even a big makeover (unless it were an option and not standard).
I don't know, I for one would like to have that option. I have only nice experience on ESA fitted bikes, but reliability is not that good yet... :-\
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The ESA ll I had on the '12 RT was really nice. Could go instantly from a softer hiway ride to a firm/sporty ride for the twisties, with the touch of a button. It was an expensive add-on, but quickly recreated the bike, when needed.
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Gearing of Connie vs FJR in top gear is no contest. They're pretty equal both in 5th gear (I owned one. New ones are the same). The Connie has a 6th, and it's turning 88 mph at 4K rpm, while the FJR only does 70 (in 5th). Plus the FJR has a much lower redline of 9K vs 10.5K, so the overall difference is huge. There's no bike with longer legs in top gear than the Connie, period. And I really liked that. The highest before this was one of my BMWs at 75 mph @ 4K rpm. The only downside is you need to downshift for better acceleration, or a headwind. I did several roll-ons from 4 to 5K rpm during break-in that resulted in mild acceleration, thinking I was at half throttle. Turns out I was at almost WOT. When I tried WOT, I thought to myself 'something is wrong with this thing'. Ha ha. Was used to the K1300S, which was A LOT stronger. Even the 2014 R1200RT felt stronger in top gear, but it's turning much higher rpm. Nothing a downshift can't fix, however. If you have a headwind and are cruising near the ton or higher, 5th might be a better choice. Need to experiment next time. I was in 6th, and the temperature rose to where the fans kick in at the ton and near 100F. Probably too little power at that rpm to overcome aerodynamic drag, and lugging the engine a little bit. Higher rpm could also mean better cooling if less stress on the engine (even though rpm is up). Most bikes have marginal cooling systems in hot weather, and this one is no exception. I need to find out if the fans come on at speed when thermostat reaches the trigger temperature; hopefully not. At any rate, it's great to have the option of lower rpm cruising, if you want to. Better fuel economy if not pushing the envelope.
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I am in the Coachella Valley fairly often. Palm Springs, Indio, etc. Effing hot.
My fans will come on at speed when it is good and stinking hot.
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I've formed an opinion on this. So I haven't had my C14 too long (maybe 6K miles, 4K on one trip to Death Valley) and it's a dated '08 ABS at that. But I do pay attention to new bikes, reviews, and ride with guys that are great riders and have some $. Beemers, Ducs, and, of course, FJRs, Sprints, etc....
I think the Kaw decision should be a clear one. They are not going to be able to compete at the price tag of BMW and Ducati, so active suspension and those types of things are simply not going to happen and keep the connie viable. To me, the '10 redesign added to the original model includes a great list like traction control, eco, ABS standard, better heat management, grip warmers, electric shield, modern styling, decent ergos, mostly trouble free shaft drive, and IMO likely the best engine of the lot, and 20 other things I have forgotten is a very capable bike that can be had for many dollars less street price that makes it even a better deal than comparing list prices.
Don't think a used BMW or Duc with 16K miles in great shape could have fallen to me at such a great price with these features.
I do not view this as a C10 Redux. This bike was ahead of the curve when released, not chasing. At 7 years old (what? 5 for the redesign?) this version is aging far better than the C10 in styling and features - and I had and loved my C10. And, the C14 is still the value of the group - especially at street prices.
So maybe you need a throttlemeister. Maybe you have to adjust the suspension with your hands. Maybe it should be 50 or 75 lbs lighter. Maybe if all those things were corrected, it wouldn't sell, and I couldn't afford one. Used prices are getting great. Leftover and new street prices are the best around. The engine ... the engine. Average suspension for the class (handling helped by a 55 rear); still better than most other classes. FJR aside (cause I haven't ridden a new one) the 14 is a great bike. While we can talk price points -- it's less than 20+ thousand dollars -- it stands on its own for what it is. And in a lot of our opinions, does so very well.
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It reminds me of the Nissan Titan (which I have): Came out new in '04 and has barely changed. My '05 is still a great truck, still seems reasonably modern to me, and Nissan must be satisfied with sales.
Didn't Nissan just release a new titan? I recently bought a '15 Frontier because it has been refined over the past 10 years. When it comes to cars, I don't want the latest greatest. Bikes are another story.
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True. I picked up mine before the paint was dry.
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It reminds me of the Nissan Titan (which I have): Came out new in '04 and has barely changed. My '05 is still a great truck, still seems reasonably modern to me, and Nissan must be satisfied with sales.
Love my 2011 PRO 4X! I expect it will be the last truck I ever buy.
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Gearing of Connie vs FJR in top gear is no contest. They're pretty equal both in 5th gear (I owned one. New ones are the same). The Connie has a 6th, and it's turning 88 mph at 4K rpm, while the FJR only does 70 (in 5th).
The FJR (according to my research) has had 1 (2006?) or maybe 2 (2013? anybody..anybody?) gear ratio changes over it's history so it's easy to get conflicting data. Using the numbers presented by MCN (http://www.mcnews.com/mcn/features/2010augsts.pdf) of '10 C14: 3166 RPM and '10 FJR 3476 RPM for an actual speed of 65 MPH. Based on that, my calculations show:
70 mph C14 3409 rpm FJR 3743 rpm difference of 334 rpm
80 mph C14 3897 rpm FJR 4278 rpm difference of 381 rpm
Using MCN's numbers with your example of 4000 rpm the C14 is doing 82.1 mph the FJR 74.8 a difference of 7.3 mph not 18mph.
There's no bike with longer legs in top gear than the Connie, period.
:o
Depends on what you mean by longer legs. There are faster bikes in top gear, and there are bikes that are geared taller, is there one that is both?...I'm not sure, nor do I care as the FJR and the C14 are both fast enough for me. I think most here could come up with some bikes that are faster (top speed in top gear), and as for just being geared taller I think both the Gold Wing and the K1600GT are geared taller in their respective top gears.
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I love the Yami... but i like 6 gears spread out too ;D
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Using MCN's numbers with your example of 4000 rpm the C14 is doing 82.1 mph the FJR 74.8 a difference of 7.3 mph not 18mph.
:o
In 6th gear at 4000 RPMs the Triumph Trophy shows approximately 75mph.
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Using MCN's numbers with your example of 4000 rpm the C14 is doing 82.1 mph the FJR 74.8 a difference of 7.3 mph not 18mph.
You can't rely on math with motorcycle tires. I rode both bikes back to back, and they showed 70 and 88. At any rate, it's a significant speed difference regardless.
And no, there's NO bike geared at 231 mph in top gear that I know of; THAT means tall gearing. Most sport bikes reach top speed at almost redline in top gear, and none reaches 200 except the new H2R (those bikes might be an excpetion, due to much higher low-end supercharged torque). And no, neither the GW nor GL1600 are geared taller than the Connie; not even close. Even if they're close to the 88 mph of the Connie at 4K rpm, they have much shorter gearing since they only rev to 6K and 8K, respectively.
Having said the above, the gearing of the Connie is a bit too tall for the power/weight/drag it has IMO, so not entirely a good thing. I wish it was more like 80 @ 4K, since we might be lugging the engine at higher speeds, especially with a passenger, or head wind. I say the above because on my first and only trip so far (alone, my 160#, and no bags), I opened up the throttle for the first time when doing about 90, and it was almost at WOT already. Was expecting a moderate push, and nothing. After my initial WTF thought, realized it's no K1300S. But mostly it was the tall gearing. And now that I remember, coolant temperature jumped to where the fans kick in. Now that bike is broken in, will probably use 5th when going fast from now on, and also check if coolant gets hotter in 6th than 5th at the same speed, to confirm 6th is just too tall (too low on the powerband) to overcome aerodynamic drag at higher speeds. That being the case would mean higher fuel consumption as well. Felt okay at about 80 mph, for what I remember. Anything higher than that in 6th, could be counterproductive in performance, engine life, and fuel economy. Will do more testing on my next trip. By the way, this is the same issue with Corvettes, for instance. You reach top speed in 5th. If you upshift to 6th, you immediately start slowing down (I've done it on mine), confirming what I said before. The hard question to ask is at what speed you're better off downshifting to 5th. I'm sure it's the same issue with the Connie.
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You can't rely on math with motorcycle tires.
OH! Yeah right, :banghead: for a minute there I just forgot that motorcycle engineering/design was all done with magic and mojo.
I rode both bikes back to back, and they showed 70 and 88.
Please forgive me (or not) if I trust MCNs measurements more than your experience and memory.
MCN's numbers:
@ 65 mph actual not indicated Tallest gear rank (of these 4)
C14 3166 RPM ('10)* 3
FJR 3476 RPM ('10)* 4
GW 2930 RPM ('12) ** 1
K1600 3120 RPM ('11) ** 2
*link (http://www.mcnews.com/mcn/features/2010augsts.pdf) **link (http://www.mcnews.com/mcn/features/2011septglvk1600.pdf)
Perhaps we are separated by terms, I wasn't sure what you meant by longer legs, but I'm fairly certain that taller gearing is accepted as meaning fewer crankshaft revolutions per minute for a given speed or fewer total crankshaft revolutions for a specified distance, regardless of redline. That would make the Gold Wing the tallest geared of this small group.
I haven't looked into it as far as some have with spreadsheet calculations (that silly math stuff), but not even if the FJR was on a nearly bald rear tire and the C14 on a brand new 55 series rear would I believe that there is an actual 18 MPH difference at 4000 rpm in top gear.
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OH! Yeah right, :banghead: for a minute there I just forgot that motorcycle engineering/design was all done with magic and mojo.
You mean it's not? :yikes:
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You mean it's not? :yikes:
So you forgot too eh? :rotflmao: I guess it depends on whom you talk to.
On the other hand, I'm almost 100% positive that the art of farkling is totally based on Magic and MoJo with just a touch of madness thrown in for good measure.
Anyway, back to the 2016 discussion, color guesses anyone?
Just to guess I'll say either the more subdued green that was used in Europe (Metalic Dark Green 2011? (http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a54/RichardT/Kawasaki%20GTR%201400/greengtr.jpg~original)) or perhaps Candy Burnt Orange?
They wouldn't do a pearl white for the 30th anniversary, would they?
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...but it's only the 8th anniversary of the superior gen1 c14.
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Anyway, back to the 2016 discussion, color guesses anyone?
Just to guess I'll say either the more subdued green that was used in Europe (Metalic Dark Green 2011? (http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a54/RichardT/Kawasaki%20GTR%201400/greengtr.jpg~original)) or perhaps Candy Burnt Orange?
They wouldn't do a pearl white for the 30th anniversary, would they?
How about going back to the original NEWTON color? Still the fastest color they've had.
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2016 Worldwide color choices:
Metallic Moondust Gray
Metallic Moondust Gray / Metallic Carbon Gray
Dark Blue
Metallic Spark Black
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chicks dig the '10 blue the most. just one of a trillion examples I can post as proof of this phenomenon:
Amy left her BMW parked..........
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/Connie%2014/TN%20spring%202010/CIMG0090.jpg)
To ride with me on my blue '10 IN THE RAIN (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/lol8.gif)
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/Connie%2014/TN%20spring%202010/CIMG0091.jpg)
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OH! Yeah right, :banghead: for a minute there I just forgot that motorcycle engineering/design was all done with magic and mojo.
Please forgive me (or not) if I trust MCNs measurements more than your experience and memory.
MCN's numbers:
@ 65 mph actual not indicated Tallest gear rank (of these 4)
C14 3166 RPM ('10)* 3
FJR 3476 RPM ('10)* 4
GW 2930 RPM ('12) ** 1
K1600 3120 RPM ('11) ** 2
*link (http://www.mcnews.com/mcn/features/2010augsts.pdf) **link (http://www.mcnews.com/mcn/features/2011septglvk1600.pdf)
Perhaps we are separated by terms, I wasn't sure what you meant by longer legs, but I'm fairly certain that taller gearing is accepted as meaning fewer crankshaft revolutions per minute for a given speed or fewer total crankshaft revolutions for a specified distance, regardless of redline. That would make the Gold Wing the tallest geared of this small group.
I haven't looked into it as far as some have with spreadsheet calculations (that silly math stuff), but not even if the FJR was on a nearly bald rear tire and the C14 on a brand new 55 series rear would I believe that there is an actual 18 MPH difference at 4000 rpm in top gear.
while it's true that both the GW and the K16 are geared just slightly taller (8% and 1,5% respectively), there's a catch: they are both 35% bigger (in cc) than the C14's engine and 6-cyl engines, meaning even if they did the same rpm at a given speed, they still have 50% more strokes/explosions, so they could turn at 33% less revs to match the amount of explosions on the C14. It means that proportionally the C14 engine is actually turning VERY slow in top gear.
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while it's true that both the GW and the K16 are geared just slightly taller (8% and 1,5% respectively), there's a catch: they are both 35% bigger (in cc) than the C14's engine and 6-cyl engines, meaning even if they did the same rpm at a given speed, they still have 50% more strokes/explosions, so they could turn at 33% less revs to match the amount of explosions on the C14. It means that proportionally the C14 engine is actually turning VERY slow in top gear.
That is an interesting and creative thought!
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Interesting and creative but not really accurate. The amount of torque being produced at that speed is all that really matters. Usually more displacement means more torque which then delivers more power. The amount of explosions just means a smoother power cycle but not more or better power.
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while it's true that both the GW and the K16 are geared just slightly taller (8% and 1,5% respectively), there's a catch: they are both 35% bigger (in cc) than the C14's engine and 6-cyl engines, meaning even if they did the same rpm at a given speed, they still have 50% more strokes/explosions, so they could turn at 33% less revs to match the amount of explosions on the C14. It means that proportionally the C14 engine is actually turning VERY slow in top gear.
I'm not sure the number of strokes/explosions means much if the cylinder sizes are all different, however another way to measure it (more proportional) is to factor in the total displacement. This does change the rankings. I'll admit that I might have screwed this up. I determined the distance traveled per rev. in feet, and then divided the displacement by that to get the number of cc needed to go one foot. (at least that's what I think I did)
@ 65 mph actual not indicated Tallest gear rank disp.cc/ft. per rev cc per ft. traveled Proportional Rank
C14 3166 RPM ('10) 3 1352/1.8066 = 748.3 1
FJR 3476 RPM ('10) 4 1298/1.6455 = 788.8 2
GW 2930 RPM ('12) 1 1832/ 1.9522 = 938.4 4
K1600 3120 RPM ('11) 2 1649/ 1.8333 = 899.4 3
My original issue however, was with the the earlier post which used the word "period" not "proportional", and I thought that made quite a bit of difference. However thinking proportionally that would work with the "longer legs" term used and I can see that now.
Well done Martin, your next task is to show me some references or logic that would explain an 18 mph difference in actual speed between a FJR and a C14 @ 4000rpm.
..but I'll settle for the 2016 C14 (C15, C16) color scheme and a list of any other changes. (just to stay on topic)
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I'm not sure the number of strokes/explosions means much if the cylinder sizes are all different, however another way to measure it (more proportional) is to factor in the total displacement. This does change the rankings. I'll admit that I might have screwed this up. I determined the distance traveled per rev. in feet, and then divided the displacement by that to get the number of cc needed to go one foot. (at least that's what I think I did)
@ 65 mph actual not indicated Tallest gear rank disp.cc/ft. per rev cc per ft. traveled Proportional Rank
C14 3166 RPM ('10) 3 1352/1.8066 = 748.3 1
FJR 3476 RPM ('10) 4 1298/1.6455 = 788.8 2
GW 2930 RPM ('12) 1 1832/ 1.9522 = 938.4 4
K1600 3120 RPM ('11) 2 1649/ 1.8333 = 899.4 3
My original issue however, was with the the earlier post which used the word "period" not "proportional", and I thought that made quite a bit of difference. However thinking proportionally that would work with the "longer legs" term used and I can see that now.
Well done Martin, your next task is to show me some references or logic that would explain an 18 mph difference in actual speed between a FJR and a C14 @ 4000rpm.
..but I'll settle for the 2016 C14 (C15, C16) color scheme and a list of any other changes. (just to stay on topic)
You sure know how to give a Homeboy a headache. ;D
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You ain't the only one..
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Interesting and creative but not really accurate. The amount of torque being produced at that speed is all that really matters. Usually more displacement means more torque which then delivers more power. The amount of explosions just means a smoother power cycle but not more or better power.
As you mentioned, it is still meaningful when talking about the main reason for tall gears- smoothness (less vibration, less turning, less noise). I suspect the second most important reason would be efficiency (fuel mostly), but I think that won't be a meaningful absolute comparison.
I don't think anyone on this thread was thinking about the amount of "power" in the tall gears. Well, at least I wasn't :)
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I broke into the sixes! :o
It ain't easy being such a pimp. 8)
http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/batgirlcraig.jpg (http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/batgirlcraig.jpg)