Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: katata1100 on February 07, 2015, 06:36:52 PM
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My C14 is almost four years old with original brake fluid, so a flush is way over do.
What is the best fluid I can get? When I say best, I am talking about DOT 4 with the highest wet and dry boiling points.
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http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=12050 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=12050)
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=9720 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=9720)
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=4458 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=4458)
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=15143 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=15143)
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I use genuine Kwackers brake fluid.
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Four years? Get on it man and don't forget the clutch. Be VERY careful with the clutch so that you don't get any air in the system, you'll be sorry if you do.
I've been using this with good results.
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31z0vPhAmJL.jpg)
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Four years? Get on it man and don't forget the clutch.
Meh- mine is almost 4 years old now and I haven't done anything with the brakes or clutch either. Nor the coolant, spark plugs (their schedule is beyond silly), or vacuum sync.
I think maintenance wise the only thing I have done is tires, adjust the throttle play, replace the engine oil/filter twice, and the final drive oil once.
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Meh- mine is almost 4 years old now and I haven't done anything with the brakes or clutch either. Nor the coolant, spark plugs (their schedule is beyond silly), or vacuum sync.
I think maintenance wise the only thing I have done is tires, adjust the throttle play, replace the engine oil/filter twice, and the final drive oil once.
What color is the fluid in the reservoirs?
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Meh- mine is almost 4 years old now and I haven't done anything with the brakes or clutch either. Nor the coolant, spark plugs (their schedule is beyond silly), or vacuum sync.
I think maintenance wise the only thing I have done is tires, adjust the throttle play, replace the engine oil/filter twice, and the final drive oil once.
I'm on the same maintenance schedule as you are :thumbs: Served me well on all of my bikes that I've owned over the last 30yrs. If it ain't broke.......I've learned that in the long run it only makes a difference to your wallet.
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I'm sure that you all know by now that brake fluid is hygroscopic right? So it's really not a good practice to leave the old fluid unchanged for too long.
Brake fluid is cheap so I doubt that it's going to hurt your wallet much.
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The same goes for coolant.
That being said, my 2010 Connie has the original coolant and brake fluids in her since new. I'll get around to swapping them out before Spring I suppose. I might even do it today. I'd say about a 5% chance. ;)
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What color is the fluid in the reservoirs?
I have no idea!
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I'm sure that you all know by now that brake fluid is hygroscopic right? So it's really not a good practice to leave the old fluid unchanged for too long.
Brake fluid is cheap so I doubt that it's going to hurt your wallet much.
Yeah, but I keep reading all the stories about how hard it is to change.
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Yeah, but I keep reading all the stories about how hard it is to change.
Bleeding the front and rear brakes is VERY easy, at least it was for me the two times that I did it. I used a Motion Pro bleeder valve, worked like a charm. The clutch on the other hand wasn't so easy, at least not the second time I did it. :o
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The valvoline stuff, like the rest of the stuff on the store shelf has a dry boiling point of 480, wet 311. The best I have found since starting this thread is Redline Brake fluid, which has dry point of 604 and 400 wet point. They claim this:
"Blendable with DOT 3, DOT 4 and DOT 5.1 fluids, RL-600 increases ABS cycle times for more responsive and consistent pedal feel".
As soon as brake fluid is put into the brake system, it absorbs water. Apply the brakes hard and some of that water will boil. The rider compensates by squeezing more on the lever. It is very possible to get to the point where squeezing more does...nothing! Also, the water is corrosive. In time, that Dot 4 fluid will turn (ie; have the same performance) as a DOT 3 fluid, and continue to spiral down. By starting with a higher performing fluid, I hope to be able to go longer with out a change (four years though, is too long).
Brake fluid is one of those things that you don't notice until you change it then you notice a big difference. In every vehicle that I have changed brake fluid, the brakes felt better, before, felt like a wood stick. The fluid in my daughters Toyota looked like an old urine sample and the brakes had an on/off feel before the change.
For those who have ancient brake fluid, I strongly suggest changing. You will notice that it takes less effort on the lever, better feel/progression. I just put on a new pr4 on the front and have some DP pads coming tomorrow. I want my bike to be tip top for spring/summer
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As Conrad said, brake fluid is hygroscopic, meaning it readily absorbs moisture. And it needs to be replaced every 2 years TOPS, and that's regardless of mileage folks. Brake fluid is so cheap and easy to change that neglecting it could render your brakes useless when you might need them the most. The water in the fluid rusts your expensive brake components, especially on ABS-equipped bikes. Not only that costs thousands of dollars to replace. But the most important factor is YOUR SAFETY (and maybe others'). Motorcycling is an inherently dangerous activity; take it seriously, and don't neglect your #1 safety feature: your brakes ;). Have a good one.
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Thanks for the warnings. I will add brake fluid replacement (possibly also clutch) to my Spring to-do list for sure.
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It looks like the Redline is the fluid to go with. There are a few fluids with marginally higher (maybe a couple of degrees) of boiling point (like Stoptech), but they are almost double the cost of Redline (which I think is a lot).
A 16oz bottle of Redline will cost $17 delivered ground (from Jegs, best deal). I think (hope) that two bottles might be enough for the C14. That's $32 vs about $10 for the stuff at Autozone (read the labels, all the dot 4 stuff has the same specs whether it be Valvoline, Castrol, or whatever.
For those who never change brake fluid, uh, it is "broke"! Swap it out with new fluid and you be amazed how much better the brakes are, honest. My fluid is 4 years old, two years overdue in being flushed out. You don't have to race to notice it.Load up the bike with all my stuff for a long road trip and all it takes a couple of hard stops to get the fluid boiling.
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Thanks for the warnings. I will add brake fluid replacement (possibly also clutch) to my Spring to-do list for sure.
:popcorn: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:
go to autozone, buy a bottle of DOT compatible brake fluid for $4, and change it.... and change it regularly... or, you can send me $79.95, plus shipping and handling ( a mere $27.49, s&h per 4 oz bottle), and I will send you the bestest.... now, you'll need 4 bottles, so get out the calculator... and do it times 4... including shipping (and don't forget your hazmat fees....per bottle....)
or just buy a Quart at the Zone, and get it done..... ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) 8) ;)
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It looks like the Redline is the fluid to go with. There are a few fluids with marginally higher (maybe a couple of degrees) of boiling point (like Stoptech), but they are almost double the cost of Redline (which I think is a lot).
A 16oz bottle of Redline will cost $17 delivered ground (from Jegs, best deal). .....You don't have to race to notice it.Load up the bike with all my stuff for a long road trip and all it takes a couple of hard stops to get the fluid boiling.
really?, dam, I was taking my life in my hands while hauling a harbor freight trailer, about 300# load, behind my C14, from Lake Erie, down to Johnson City to the NR this year, at times doing triple digits? I gotta be more careful....
I've only boiled brake fluid once.... when my rear brake locked up because of the lack of my recall being done, and a pebble locking my rear brake ON for 7 mile high speed jaunt, before I said "sumpin's wrong..." and truley it took 7 miles... before the disc was glowing, no pads, and "damage" was done...
no big dealeo, kaw replaced it all.... but ANY Dot fluid rated 3/4 or 4, is adequate... and will never boil.... you really gotta hold the levers down continually to accomplish that. Boil that is... ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
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really?, dam, I was taking my life in my hands while hauling a harbor freight trailer, about 300# load, behind my C14, from Lake Erie, down to Johnson City to the NR this year, at times doing triple digits? I gotta be more careful....
I've only boiled brake fluid once.... when my rear brake locked up because of the lack of my recall being done, and a pebble locking my rear brake ON for 7 mile high speed jaunt, before I said "sumpin's wrong..." and truley it took 7 miles... before the disc was glowing, no pads, and "damage" was done...
no big dealeo, kaw replaced it all.... but ANY Dot fluid rated 3/4 or 4, is adequate... and will never boil.... you really gotta hold the levers down continually to accomplish that. Boil that is... ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
What's your point?
Also, you say "but ANY Dot fluid rated 3/4 or 4, is adequate".
Is 'adequate" your standard for brake performance? And, while any DOT 4 fluid is fine for the C14, the bigger question is : for how long? That DOT 4 fluid that might be four years old is more like a DOT 2 fluid.
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:popcorn: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:
go to autozone, buy a bottle of DOT compatible brake fluid for $4, and change it.... and change it regularly... or, you can send me $79.95, plus shipping and handling ( a mere $27.49, s&h per 4 oz bottle), and I will send you the bestest.... now, you'll need 4 bottles, so get out the calculator... and do it times 4... including shipping (and don't forget your hazmat fees....per bottle....)
or just buy a Quart at the Zone, and bet it done..... ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) 8) ;)
+1, same stuff works GREAT in track bikes too, and believe me we heat some brake fluid out there
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What's your point?
Also, you say "but ANY Dot fluid rated 3/4 or 4, is adequate".
Is 'adequate" your standard for brake performance? And, while any DOT 4 fluid is fine for the C14, the bigger question is : for how long? That DOT 4 fluid that might be four years old is more like a DOT 2 fluid.
I was simplifying the whole procedure, ( and jokingly making fun of someone spending mega bucks for brake fluid...)you can get 3/4 compatible, or search out 4 specific, the 3/4 is completely compatible with the system. You will never boil it.... if you do, better not ride. It's simply not gonna boil, no matter what. And I did note CHANGE it on a regular schedule, if you ride super aggressively, yearly, if you put on 10k a year, and store the bike in a garage, every other year
don't take what i suggest as gospel, spend what you want on fluid you plan to dispose of regularly... we can go on and on.... it's like an oil thread, or a tire thread.... it don't mean squat if you never check it, when I see the reservoirs getting more brown than yellow, it gets changed..... given an option of purple fluid, or any other color.... it gets really rediculous.....
the smartest thing manufacturers COULD do, would be to utilize a dye in the fluid, that would change color when the fluid gets to a contamination point with moisture.... that would be too damned simple..... agree...? but nooooooooo.... they just make clear fluid, that you can't tell when the moisture content has been exceded....
I change this regularly, and have severely abused brakes, never boiled them, and can stand on my statements of such, so do a lot of folks. Racers included. Track days, mountain riding, heavy loads.... it is what it is. If you live in the rainforrest, and your bike sits outside year round, vs someone in Ohio, who's bike may sit 6 months indoors, it's all relative. I NEVER suggested changing fluid at 4 year interval...that's ridiculous....there is a user book supplied at purchase outlining flush intervals.....and that ain't the interval.
I say just keep it fresh, and you are safe.... problem with that? ::)
maybe invest in developing a new fluid, that indicates when it SHOULD be changed.... ooooo, wait, bad suggestion on my part, nothing to see here, move along.....(he says, while trying to figure out this part of the equation....) 8)
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I just use Kawasaki brand and as I don't ride like SBK or MotoGP riders, I think I'll be ok. I also change it every two years or so.
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I now feel guilted into doing some maintenance. I bought a Motion Pro bleeder just after I bought my bike 5yrs ago but have never used it. I've always just bled them manually. Anything to watch out for?
Thanks
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It is extremely unlikely that you would ever work your brakes hard enough on the street to boil the brake fluid. On our bikes, the brakes are large enough, and have so much air flow over them that unless you are on a track such as COTA (150 mph straight with a 40 mph turn at the end), you will probably never start to approach the limits of the brake fluid.
Although it kind of pains me to say this, MOB is right. DOT 4 will work great.
If it makes you feel better, go ahead and spend the big bucks on the Motul or Redline brake fluid. (BTW, I am a big believer in Redline products, I used them in my race cars and only have good things to say about their stuff). That said, I didn't use their brake fluid, I used relatively cheap Motorcraft Heavy Duty DOT 4. You can usually find it at Ford dealers, and it is just as good as Motul or Redline. It is what I used in my race cars, but at half the cost of the other fluids I mentioned.
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It's kind peculiar that were splitting hairs talking about differences of performance brake fluid when we've waited over four year to change something that should be just done annually.
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Thanks for the warnings. I will add brake fluid replacement (possibly also clutch) to my Spring to-do list for sure.
Why wait till Spring Max? While you're waiting the moisture in your bikes braking system is eating away at your precious. ;)
Do it NOW. :)
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I now feel guilted into doing some maintenance. I bought a Motion Pro bleeder just after I bought my bike 5yrs ago but have never used it. I've always just bled them manually. Anything to watch out for?
Thanks
Yes, don't loosen the bleeder valves too much, just barely enough to let the fluid come through. Be VERY careful not to let the reservoirs get too low, you do not want to get any air in the system. The clutch is very unforgiving where air is the system is concerned. Don't ask me how I know this. :o
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Although it kind of pains me to say this, MOB is right. DOT 4 will work great.
If it pained you that much would it not have been better just to let it go?
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LOL. This thread is awesome. 8)
You guys all worry too much. It's like an oil thread, only better.
For anybody that lays awake at night thinking about your brake fluid, you might want to add brake caliper service to your anxiety. :o
Rem :o
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...but it's freaking winter and we have got to do something...maybe it's time for a nitrogen thread....
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...but it's freaking winter and we have got to do something...maybe it's time for a nitrogen thread....
LOL, I know. We were "winter-free" over here until the beginning of February....then it arrived, like a punch in the nose...LOL. We're getting all of New England's crap a day later. YUCK. :o
Ya know, years ago, the weatherman use to say: "It's going to snow tomorrow". Now, it consumes entire news stations for days on end...everything closes, the public is warned to stay home, and a state of emergency is declared. I'm tellin' ya Mr. Pink, the cold makes people crazy...LOL>
I don't worry about fluids as much as some others do...but it makes for good reading in the winter, that's for sure...LOL>
A nitrogen thread would be awesome right about now....lol 8)
Rem
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^^^ I joke on the FL weather but i'd love to be at the lighthouses/beaches and having pizza at Mystic with snow everywhere
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Please educate me on this mentioned Motion pro bleeder.
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LOL, I know. We were "winter-free" over here until the beginning of February....then it arrived, like a punch in the nose...LOL. We're getting all of New England's crap a day later. YUCK. :o
Ya know, years ago, the weatherman use to say: "It's going to snow tomorrow". Now, it consumes entire news stations for days on end...everything closes, the public is warned to stay home, and a state of emergency is declared. I'm tellin' ya Mr. Pink, the cold makes people crazy...LOL>
I don't worry about fluids as much as some others do...but it makes for good reading in the winter, that's for sure...LOL>
A nitrogen thread would be awesome right about now....lol 8)
Rem
This is representative of everything that's wrong with society today.....they've even started naming snow 'events' :banghead:
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I never changed my clutch or brake fluid, 6yrs. - 58,000mi..
3 Questions? If I remove and replace just the fluid in the res.(don't have a bleeder and I'm lazy ;D)would I feel a difference in braking?
Does anyone know what % fluid is left in the system after the res. is emptied?
Or should I, at the least, buy a cheap Harbor Freight bleeder and do it right?
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I never changed my clutch or brake fluid, 6yrs. - 58,000mi..
The horror..lol. Just kiddin'. :o
3 Questions? If I remove and replace just the fluid in the res.(don't have a bleeder and I'm lazy ;D)would I feel a difference in braking?
Even if you replace ALL of the fluid, your brakes won't "feel" any different, however, changing it in only the reservoir will do nothing for you. The bulk of the dirty fluid is in the calipers....where you never see it.
Does anyone know what % fluid is left in the system after the res. is emptied?
Probably 75%-80%...
Or should I, at the least, buy a cheap Harbor Freight bleeder and do it right?
A bleeder sure makes the job easier.
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The horror..lol. Just kiddin'. :o
Even if you replace ALL of the fluid, your brakes won't "feel" any different, however, changing it in only the reservoir will do nothing for you. The bulk of the dirty fluid is in the calipers....where you never see it.
Probably 75%-80%...
A bleeder sure makes the job easier.
:thumbs:
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A bleeder sure makes the job easier.
+1, I like an extra person around helping too. Teressa is great at all the little bitty tasks!
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/LR%20800/SWP_1186-Edit.jpg)
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Motion Pro brake bleeder
http://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle/partno/08-0143/ (http://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle/partno/08-0143/)
It's basically a one way valve so the fluid can get by but air cannot come back in
I have one and it works great....even on the clutch side. But don't tell Conrad that.
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Please educate me on this mentioned Motion pro bleeder.
(https://ff3d8e6495061f28a832-a7869bbdcfcea96a643a5d6aa79482f7.ssl.cf1.rackcdn.com/enlarged/08-0143.jpg)
Works great. Makes brake or clutch fluid changing a ten minute job. I use it on cars too.
edit great minds but Jim's is quicker than mine >:(
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Don't tell Jim that I already have a MP brake bleeder and the first time that I used it on the clutch it worked perfectly, not so the second time. :-X
[smg id=659]
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:-X back at ya... :rotflmao:
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:-X back at ya... :rotflmao:
:)
I'll be the first to admit that I screwed something up the second time that I bled the clutch. I just don't know exactly what that something was.
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I know the feeling..
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If it pained you that much would it not have been better just to let it go?
No, I just wanted to give you another example of what is wrong with today's society!
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No, I just wanted to give you another example of what is wrong with today's society!
Either you failed to present your example or I failed to grasp your subtlety.
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The short answer: it is a check- valve that you put in-line with a brake caliber, slave cylinder or clutch cylinder and it allows for direct bleeding of the system without having to open / close the brake bleeder repeatedly.
Longer but more correct answer: one of the many devices, when used on the hydraulics of a C-14, that tortures the owner / rider for days, weeks and often months after by not completely venting all the air out of the system. Speed bleeders are also in this catagory. The C-14 hydraulics are an absolute cast- iron.... well, you know, to bleed and all of these simple, inexpensive 'helpful tools' get in the way to a proper tool that works well: a powered vacuum bleeder tool such as a MityVac MV6830 Vacuum Brake Bleeder, which will pull hard enough and steadily enough to fully bleed the hydraulics on a C-14. Not cheap initially but after several attempts at using other, lesser devices that do not work fully (squishy brakes, soft clutch that changes engagement point with a change in engine temp., etc.), WELL worth the money IMO. I also saw substantially the same thing available at Harbor Freight for something like $30 or such.
I have bled a lot of hydraulic systems over the years but I have never seen anything like the systems on the C-14. I <believe> the basic problem is the port hole (Easy Boys and Girls!) in the reservoir is too small but I have not been able to bring myself to open them up, especially now that I have a power bleeder.
OK, off soapbox, now back to the conversation about the $5 tools that will work just fine.... almost. :-)
Brian
Please educate me on this mentioned Motion pro bleeder.
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I bled my brakes using the old fashioned way - pump the lever, hold the lever, open the bleeder, let some fluid out, close the bleeder. Repeat until no more air comes out and the fluid was fresh. It worked fine!
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I bled my brakes using the old fashioned way - pump the lever, hold the lever, open the bleeder, let some fluid out, close the bleeder. Repeat until no more air comes out and the fluid was fresh. It worked fine!
How about the clutch? And without some help, or really long arms, you'll have some difficulty with the two rear caliper bleed points.
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4 pages of bleeding brakes. I rebuilt calipers on my old bikes in less time.
"how to change battery in FOB" thread needed next ;D
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How about the clutch? And without some help, or really long arms, you'll have some difficulty with the two rear caliper bleed points.
On the rear caliper, I just pushed the brake pedal down with my hand.
I haven't bled the clutch yet. After reading the tales of problems with bleeding it, now I'm nervous about doing that! :-\
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Clutch bleeding virgin!
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4 pages of bleeding brakes. I rebuilt calipers on my old bikes in less time.
"how to change battery in FOB" thread needed next ;D
I'm counting on you to start that thread ;D
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Bah! We're jess' teasin' ya'. How bad can it really be? Besides, how often do you really need the clutch anyway?
:o ::) ;)
The problem is that conventional bleeding leaves a bit of air in the system. Not enough to prevent anything from working but it leaves the brakes, especially the front (who can feel the rear brake on a C-14 anyway?) feeling a bit soft right at the point the pads engage. When all the air is out of the system (i.e., power bled), the brakes are rock- hard (Easy Boys!).
The clutch is a bit different; as the clutch does not really have an engagement point but instead a range, that range will change with engine temperature because the air in the slave cylinder expands and contracts with engine temp. So the point where the clutch engages changes when the bike is warm, hot or cold. It is not that the clutch does not work or work correctly but the place where it starts to engage changes and that causes the launches from a stop to be awkward and sort of 'ungraceful'.
So really, the difference is not that great but it is probably the last 15% or 20% of crisp, hydraulic working that suffers. A lot of people do not really notice the difference until the bike is properly bled and the fluid is clear of all air.... then they get to like it and it ruins them for the next time the bike is bled using the ole' "pump and crack" method of bleeding.
Brian
On the rear caliper, I just pushed the brake pedal down with my hand.
I haven't bled the clutch yet. After reading the tales of problems with bleeding it, now I'm nervous about doing that! :-\
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I bled my brakes using the old fashioned way - pump the lever, hold the lever, open the bleeder, let some fluid out, close the bleeder. Repeat until no more air comes out and the fluid was fresh.
That's exactly what I've deen doing for decades as well. With vacuum bleeding, you can suck air with the reservoir halfway full, so you have to be very careful doing it that way. The system holds so little fluid once you empty the reservoir (and fill it with fresh fluid) that it only takes a few strokes to fully bleed it. And done right, there's absolutely no chance of any air (I personally don't trust those check-valve devices). I've always done the bleeding by myself, even on bikes with the reservoirs at opposite sides of bleeding valves. The Connie has the clutch slave cylinder on the reservoir side, and rear reservoir is right above lever, so it'll be easy. The trick for bullet-proof bleeding the old-fashion way, is to not open the bleeding valve until you closed the master cylinder hole by pressurizing the line a little. And close it right before you get to the handlebar. Oh, and obviously watch fluid level ;D. Do that, and there's simply no way to screw it up. Hope this helps.
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I changed my hydraulic fluids toady after reading this thread. It had been 22 months since the last change. Went pretty smoothly with my Motion Pro bleeder but extra work was involved as I had to remove the ZSteves heat shield as it was blocking access to the clutch slave bleeder valve. I also had some black powdery residue in the bottom of the clutch res and a little in the brake res. I drained the bowls and wiped it out. After that I couldn't get "traction" from the brake lever, the lever would not firm up and no fluid would move. I didn't think wiping the bowl dry with a paper towel would let air in but apparently I was wrong. I noticed tiny bubbles coming from the bowl orifice as I pumped, so I engaged in a pumping frenzy and more and more bubbles came out and after about ten minutes of this the lever firmed up rock solid.
Here's my bleeding rig:
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There are so many comments I have all at once, they are crashing into each other in my brain. I simply cannot select my favorite so I will not respond. Other than to say I hope you 'rig' heals up and ten minutes is a lot of 'pumping frenzy', at least from what I have heard.
But as far as the hydraulics on a C-14 goes, you will have more time to firm up your lever at your leisure if you just buy a power bleeder in the first place.
Brian
<snip>
....so I engaged in a pumping frenzy and more and more bubbles came out and after about ten minutes of this the lever firmed up rock solid.
Here's my bleeding rig:
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There are so many comments I have all at once, they are crashing into each other in my brain. I simply cannot select my favorite so I will not respond. Other than to say I hope you 'rig' heals up and ten minutes is a lot of 'pumping frenzy', at least from what I have heard.
But as far as the hydraulics on a C-14 goes, you will have more time to firm up your lever at your leisure if you just buy a power bleeder in the first place.
Brian
So, Brian, please educate me. Since I have yet to change my brake fluid, am I wrong in assuming that one can simply gravity bleed the calipers like you can on the American made relics I had?
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There are so many comments I have all at once, they are crashing into each other in my brain. I simply cannot select my favorite so I will not respond. Other than to say I hope you 'rig' heals up and ten minutes is a lot of 'pumping frenzy', at least from what I have heard.
But as far as the hydraulics on a C-14 goes, you will have more time to firm up your lever at your leisure if you just buy a power bleeder in the first place.
Brian
I was going to insert an "Easy Boys" a la BDF but decided it's better to just let the imaginations run wild... And I do have a couple of hand vacs but don't like either one. Fumbling with some awkward apparatus at those special moments is such a buzz kill. :P
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http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=12050 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=12050)
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=9720 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=9720)
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=4458 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=4458)
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=15143 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=15143)
this is why I drop by once a week instead of once a day since a couple of months.
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There are so many comments I have all at once, they are crashing into each other in my brain. I simply cannot select my favorite so I will not respond. Other than to say I hope you 'rig' heals up and ten minutes is a lot of 'pumping frenzy', at least from what I have heard.
But as far as the hydraulics on a C-14 goes, you will have more time to firm up your lever at your leisure if you just buy a power bleeder in the first place.
Brian
Even the name on the bottle..... :rotflmao:
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this is why I drop by once a week instead of once a day since a couple of months.
I think it's kind of handy to have an autosearch function.
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What's not to like?
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10 minutes, wow!
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Couldn't do that. My hand (easy boys) would have died at 30 seconds and I would have died from boredom. A word of advice, never ever ever let the master cylinders get empty whilst bleeding the brakes and if you are bleeding the clutch, about half way down in the master cylinder is all that I let it get down to before I add more.
I changed my hydraulic fluids toady after reading this thread. It had been 22 months since the last change. Went pretty smoothly with my Motion Pro bleeder but extra work was involved as I had to remove the ZSteves heat shield as it was blocking access to the clutch slave bleeder valve. I also had some black powdery residue in the bottom of the clutch res and a little in the brake res. I drained the bowls and wiped it out. After that I couldn't get "traction" from the brake lever, the lever would not firm up and no fluid would move. I didn't think wiping the bowl dry with a paper towel would let air in but apparently I was wrong. I noticed tiny bubbles coming from the bowl orifice as I pumped, so I engaged in a pumping frenzy and more and more bubbles came out and after about ten minutes of this the lever firmed up rock solid.
Here's my bleeding rig:
This does not surprise us.... :rotflmao:
this is why I drop by once a week instead of once a day since a couple of months.
I'm here uncountable times every day. I think I'm :censored: :loco: :nuts: .
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this is why I drop by once a week instead of once a day since a couple of months.
Yeah, it is probably painful seeing someone spend 10 minutes searching through threads to find things to help someone else.
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I have not found it to work on this bike. Nor any of the other conventional methods. And the hand pumps (Easy Lather!) will not pull and hold (Easy!) a vacuum for long enough to do it either.
Bleeding any of the three hydraulic systems on this bike proved to be exasperating for me. It will work but only mostly and then after a fair amount of torture. What you have left is soft brakes, a variable clutch and in general, lousy hydraulics due to the small amounts of air that I, and quite a few other people going by the posts, could just not get out of the systems. So I am not saying manual bleeding of the hyd. systems can not be done, just that it can not be done well enough to leave the brakes and clutch 100% functional..... like they were when the bike was new. A power bleeder easily and quickly gets all systems to 100%, every time.
But I got to say that Bob (Lather) has me re-thinking all of this. I mean 10 minutes of furious pumping? Lots of bubbles, left things hard at the end? What's not to like about all of that? By comparison, the power bleeder is downright boring. :o
Brian
So, Brian, please educate me. Since I have yet to change my brake fluid, am I wrong in assuming that one can simply gravity bleed the calipers like you can on the American made relics I had?
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Is 'adequate" your standard for brake performance?
It's my standard for everything.
Not that I was the one being asked of course..just sayin'.
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I understand what Brian is saying but my first experience bleeding the brakes and the clutch on my C14 using the MP bleeder went without a hitch and I had very good brake and clutch feel, hard all the way around. ;)
On my second attempt the brakes went perfectly again but not so the clutch!
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=18451.0 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=18451.0)
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Me too- adequate should always be good enough. Though I find it is tough to find anniversary cards with that word anywhere on them....?
You know, something like "To my darling wife and so many years of adequate marriage." Yep, that would be the word I would choose first.
:rotflmao:
Brian
It's my standard for everything.
Not that I was the one being asked of course..just sayin'.
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Me too- adequate should always be good enough. Though I find it is tough to find anniversary cards with that word anywhere on them....?
You know, something like "To my darling wife and so many years of adequate marriage." Yep, that would be the word I would choose first.
:rotflmao:
Brian
Bread and water might be adequate for dinner that night and in the weeks to come.
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Me too- adequate should always be good enough.
LOL...every single time I hear that something is adequate, I can't help but think of News radio. Phil Hartman was awesome:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOxpuKXhlss (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOxpuKXhlss)
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Adequate is NOT what I strive for, however, it beats the :censored: out of inadequate.
In addition, it's all a perception issue. I find the performance of the C14 to be exceptional, a Moto GP pilot such as Mr. Rossi probably has higher expectations for his motorcycle.
Everything in excess, moderation is for Monks.
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LOL...every single time I hear that something is adequate, I can't help but think of News radio. Phil Hartman was awesome:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOxpuKXhlss (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOxpuKXhlss)
HEH Heh heh ;D ..he said adequatulence (http://www.11secondclub.com/competitions/february14/entry/INAT62). ;D
Adequate ... however, it beats the :censored: out of inadequate.
In addition, it's all a perception issue.
..and thus my earlier response (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=18911.msg232989#msg232989). ;)