Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: atilla457 on November 02, 2014, 09:29:05 PM
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Got an unexpected 2wk time-off from work, so I jump straight into valve adjustment on my 2009 ABS black, @ 15k miles.
In general most intakes valves were at or below the low spec (#1 pair being ~0.003mils). Exhaust valves were 0.008~0.009 mils. I took me two tries to get shims right (dealers don't have all sizes in stock). After I buttoned it together, it was pleasure to hear the engine running.
Completed the following
- valve adjust
- changed spark plugs (wasn't really needed)
- removed flies & added PCV
- added hoses for TB #1 & #2 (#3 and #4 already go to CA box)
- K&N air filter change
- changed coolant, oil, rear drive oil.
For removing flies, I ran the engine little bit to warm it up. So all screws were hot and came off easily using JIS #2 screwdriver.
My recommendations for others planning on doing valves:
- If first time, plan for 4 full days (and tell family to forget you).
- Finding right shims locally could take time and extend the work duration (btw I paid $4 per shim)
- Get Fred's videos and watch it while doing the work.
- Plan for space - it took a day to get tons of stuff out of the way. Organize them in order.
- it’s hard to imagine there will be room over the engine to do all the work but actually there is a lot.
- Anytime moving small pieces (like screws, shims) over the engine, hold it as tight as possible; don't drop it.
- Get a strong magnet to lift shim bucket (magnet also holds the shim together too; hence strong)
- if something rotates, think twice before rotating it :)
- Whole thing is not difficult but lots of steps. (plan for milestones and take a break after each milestone.)
- Expect to throw lots of dirty words, gets your hands bloody but then reach calmness & content when done :)
I respect this engine a lot now.
I will do it again in 15k miles - it's kind of fund :)
Since I removed the flies, where do I find a PCV map for "no flies + stock muffler + KN filter"?
Last, if anybody in the bay area wants to do this, I can offer help w/ tools, extra hand, and morale support :)
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Try here
http://www.powercommander.com/powercommander/MapLookUp/powercommander_map_lookup.aspx (http://www.powercommander.com/powercommander/MapLookUp/powercommander_map_lookup.aspx)
:chugbeer:
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Checking mine this winter, ive got 28000 on the clock so she due for sure.
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On PC's website I don't see the configuration my bike has :( there is only one map w/ butterflies removed but it has a different exhaust. would it work?
I realize I should have bought PCV from FuelMoto instead and have access to their maps.
I got it from another party so I'm stuck w/ the maps from powercommander's website.
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On PC's website I don't see the configuration my bike has :( there is only one map w/ butterflies removed but it has a different exhaust. would it work?
I realize I should have bought PCV from FuelMoto instead and have access to their maps.
I got it from another party so I'm stuck w/ the maps from powercommander's website.
Spend some more money and add the Autotune.
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Congrats on some semi-major work. And yes, it is good to budget a bunch of time for it the first couple of times.
I have the HOT CAMS shim kit. Three shims of each size. There are a bunch of sizes I am never going to need...but with TWO ZG14s and a ZX12R Land Speed race bike, I like having a full assortment on hand.
I did one of the ZG14s recently, and barely had enough in the 2.15, 2.20, 2.25mm sizes. Bought refills of 5/$8.85 online, and now have full kits again. ZERO trips to the dealer makes me smile.
Oh, and AutoTune rocks. Bike at the bottom of this post has AutoTune. And it runs very nicely.
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I always had a question about the Auto Tune: what does it do? I don't mean how, but what it does.
Imagine you have to explain it to somebody like... my mother... who thinks that from the fuel pump to the actual movement of the vehicle, there's nothing but black wizardry involved.
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Hi Martin's Mom
So this AutoTune thingie is an electronic box that plugs into the wiring of the Kawasaki. Sort of a little computer that plugs into this other computer called a Power Commander. Oh yes, Ma'am. The Kawasaki already has a computer, but that computer only knows how to do what they told it to do when it was at the factory. It can't really learn to do new things very easily. Yes, I am sure he is a very careful boy, your Martin. Yes, Ma'am. Oh, no, Ma'am. I don't think he ever does THAT.
When the Kawasaki comes from the factory, everything is all brand new and just *perfect*. Boys like Martin sometimes want to put different parts on their Kawasakis, and then everything isn't *perfect* any more. But we want them to be *perfect* again, except with the new parts too.
When you change one thing, other things get out of balance, and the Power Commander can adjust the fuel injection system so it can be *perfect* again. But the Power Commander isn't very smart for a computer. It can learn new things, but you have to tell it what to do, and then it can do what you tell it. But it doesn't know anything until you tell it. If you already knew what to tell it, that would be great. But the Autotune can do something really smart. It can watch what the engine is doing, and figure out what to tell the Power Commander.
So this AutoTune checks up on how much fuel the engine needs, since the original amount from the factory isn't *perfect* anymore. The Autotune tells the Power Commander to give the fuel injectors a little more gas if there isn't quite enough, or a little less if there is too much. The Autotune is paying attention all the time, and can keep adjusting and adjusting and adjusting as long as the engine is running. The Autotune can make everything *perfect* again, just like it was before. The Autotune does the thinking, and it tells the Power Commander what to do, and then the Power Commander tells the Kawasaki what to do.
Oh, yes, Ma'am. That Silver one is mine, and it has even more parts on it that didn't come from the factory than Martin's. Yes, Ma'am. Mine has an Autotune, and it runs *perfectly*.
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:thumbs:
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+1
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Hi Mom, just a follow up. We don't want you to worry about Martin though as he can't use the Autotune because his motorbike is made differently for the European market. So he can spend his money on wine, women and song instead of that awful two wheeler.
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It reads the wideband oxygen sensor (that must be added to US bikes) and adjusts the mixture accordingly.
In other (better) words, it takes an open- loop system and makes it a closed- loop system.
Your bikes in the EU already have the sensors and use it to modify alpha-N.... we just have 'canned' alpha-N :-)
Brian
I always had a question about the Auto Tune: what does it do? I don't mean how, but what it does.
Imagine you have to explain it to somebody like... my mother... who thinks that from the fuel pump to the actual movement of the vehicle, there's nothing but black wizardry involved.
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In other (better) words, it takes an open- loop system and makes it a closed- loop system.
Brian
exactly... bringing the technology up to about what, 1990 in automobile terms? It's surprising to me that it wasn't closed loop as delivered, especially if they wanted to advertise touring fuel economy as a selling point... and since the eu version has it, the pinouts are already there. steve
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...but the assignment was to write it for his Mom.
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exactly... bringing the technology up to about what, 1990 in automobile terms? It's surprising to me that it wasn't closed loop as delivered, especially if they wanted to advertise touring fuel economy as a selling point... and since the eu version has it, the pinouts are already there. steve
+1 Already did it for EU. So simple just to keep it on for the US as well.
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I have very high expectations for Martin's mom, based entirely on how clever her son seems to be.... ;)
Brian
...but the assignment was to write it for his Mom.
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I believe it is because the EPA would not pass the bike with the O2 sensors being used.... I know that sounds wrong but it is actually based in some logic:
It is not enough to meet emissions spec.'s new, the EPA has 'accelerated' tests they use to determine how a vehicle will behave with many miles on it (like 50K), plus its likely failure modes. So it does not matter if the C-14 runs cleaner (or better- they really do not care about that) in a closed- loop mode, it only matters what the EPA predicts will happen with some large number of models on the road, with some in various modes of failure but being used anyway, which really does / will happen even in real life.
Also, autos are required to have pretty sophisticated ECUs as well as very sophisticated monitoring and alerting systems (yep, the "engine light" is really quite complex), as well as standardized On Board Diagnostics.... OBD II in our case. Motorcycles do not have that and currently have no way to signal any kind of failure with the exception of a KiPass failure of course, which is signaled by the rider / owner having a bit of a melt- down in the gas station.... but I digress.
Maybe a sideways view would go like this: it is better to have 100,000 vehicles running 95% as clean as possible than it is to have 99,000 vehicles running 100% as clean as possible with the remaining 1,000 running quite dirty.
NOTE: numbers made up for example purposes only. Must be 18 or older to participate. Void where prohibited by law. And so forth....
Brian
Edited to correct really bad math.
+1 Already did it for EU. So simple just to keep it on for the US as well.
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Good point. Based on the "low fuel" warning on the bike, I can only imagine what it would be like if Kawasaki put a "check engine" warning on the bike. :yikes:
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exactly... bringing the technology up to about what, 1990 in automobile terms? It's surprising to me that it wasn't closed loop as delivered, especially if they wanted to advertise touring fuel economy as a selling point... and since the eu version has it, the pinouts are already there. steve
I couldn't agree more. What did it save them on the USA version? $50? On a $14k to $15k bike?
Although I understand what Brian is saying (and I have heard something like that before), it is still frustrating. The bike could easily fallback from closed to open loop in a failure mode and be NO WORSE than if the bike were always open loop.
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Hi Martin's Mom...
:rotflmao:
Thanks, datsaxman! Nice way to start my day at the office ;D
Now I just have to print it out, make a picture in a film camera, process the negative, and stuck it in the leg of Brunnhilde, my German carrier pigeon so my mother can read it in a week or two.
I have very high expectations for Martin's mom, based entirely on how clever her son seems to be.... ;)
Quoting Sheldon Cooper here: sarcasm? ???
;)
I couldn't agree more. What did it save them on the USA version? $50? On a $14k to $15k bike?
Max, sorry to break this down for you, but you're underestimating the power of bean counters, or overestimating reason :banghead:
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Nope, quite serious. I believe you are from South America and your native language is Spanish (?). You live and work in Germany, which means you speak German well enough to at least fool them. :-) And you post often on this forum in excellent English. And I believe you do something technical for a living.... so put that together and I have great confidence you can follow along with any reasonable level of technical discussion..... in one of several languages. My compliments. :thumbs: I, on the other hand, speak English only because I was born in an English speaking country, and have managed enough German to really hurt the ears of a native German speaker. I would not even consider 'dumbing it down' for you.
Brian
Quoting Sheldon Cooper here: sarcasm? ???
;)
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Max, sorry to break this down for you, but you're underestimating the power of bean counters, or overestimating reason :banghead:
So true :(