Kawasaki Concours Forum
Riding => It's not a Concours - other Bikes => Topic started by: martin_14 on May 20, 2014, 12:32:15 AM
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I had the chance to check what it feels when a small planet changes orbit or, in other words, when a 800 lb "bike" is moving. I won't go into details about the ride because it's irrelevant, much like a 7-series with 2 wheels missing. But what I did appreciate was the clever Keyless Ride thing that BMW put on this model. As opposed to KI-PASS, you get a fob that you can put in your pocket and never, ever take it out.
Here's why. I store my helmet in the side cases of my C14, so every single time I approach or leave the bike I have to fumble with a key, be it the one from the ignition or the one in the fob, in order to retrieve or leave the helmet. This implies every single ride. I also need a key every time I want to refuel, which depending on the context (travel or commuting) I'd say it involves 1 every 10 rides in average. About 1-2 times a year (if at all) I might lift the seat, which needs a key on both the BMW and the C14.
On the BMW, the side cases, top case, the fuel tank and of course ignition itself are key less. You can use the key for the side cases, but there's a locking button on the right handlebar that locks/unlocks them just as well (when the fob is in range). Opening the gas cap is also only possible with the fob within range, just like the ignition. The cap doesn't even have a keyhole. THAT's the way it should be.
Get it, Kawasaki? (or just give me a freaking normal key and spend the KI-PASS money on driving modes!!!)
EDIT: I forgot about the remote control function of the fob to lock/unlock the cases. Sounds neat, but in my unit it didn't always work, not sure why...
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If you're going to dance with the big girls, you'd best keep your FOB in your pocket! :o ;D
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I'm amazed at the functionality of beemer 1600 FOBs too
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Well, one thing for certain...
With several new advances in technology in the past few years, like automotive-style CC, electronically adjustable suspension on the fly, key fob technology, riding mode settings for remapping, ABS, and traction control settings, ride by wire throttles, multi-adjustable seat positions, tire technology, headlight technology, etc..
Kawasaki should have no problem with improvement ideas for the next Connie.
Shame they've let it get so far behind the class leaders by sitting on their laurels so long.
It's outrageous what I've spent on personal improvements on mine, to make it the way I want it.
Some, not a big deal, a personal choice... Some- should have already been on the bike, IMHO.
But, when it comes to the technology race, you're either in it... Or not.
Personally, now that I have my bike the way I want it, if they were to release a new and improved model I doubt I would trade.
For me... they've blown it. They waited too long.
I plan to ride mine for many more years to come.
Shoot... I kinda have to! I still owe about $5k more til it's paid for! Lol
Sadly, if I hadn't had to spend so much extra to get the bike livable for me, it would have been paid for by now. (2 years.)
Plus, not to mention how much value these things lose on resale!
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Pretty sad when Harley Davidson has a better system than Kawasaki.
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Pretty sad when Harley Davidson has a better system than Kawasaki.
Not when you consider that's the best thing about the HD. :)
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BMW = $$$$$$$$
You can have whatever you want if you throw enough money at it. Those unlocking cases, gas cap, etc. probably cost a few hundred bucks. Would be nice, but so would heated seats, cruise, one touch adjustable suspension, etc., etc. MONEY! Your Connie could be 30K too!
Personally, I have spent maybe 3K in farkles and I'm good!
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BMW = $$$$$$$$
You can have whatever you want if you throw enough money at it. Those unlocking cases, gas cap, etc. probably cost a few hundred bucks. Would be nice, but so would heated seats, cruise, one touch adjustable suspension, etc., etc. MONEY! Your Connie could be 30K too!
Personally, I have spent maybe 3K in farkles and I'm good!
One thing I've noticed, as the new technologies are coming to market, and finding their places on new bikes, the manufacturers don't seem to be raising prices that way. Ie; 2014 Yamaha FJR 1300.
They've added most of the new things I mentioned, yet the MSRP has stayed relatively the same.
The only outlandish costs I see lately has been when you have to buy these things in the aftermarket!
Seems if it's something made for a motorcycle, the starting price is around $300, regardless of what it is.
My hope is that technology, coupled with competition and public demand, will see these upgrades as part of the next C14, while keeping the competitive edge and maintaining the MSRP as it is currently.
If Kawasaki follows Yamaha's lead and does this, the next C14 will once again kick the competition's azz and regain the throne it once had as king of the SST's.
All I can say is, they've certainly had plenty of time to roll out the next killer bike.
Martin_14, I totally agree with what you're saying. It is a drag having to dig for a key so often. PITA!
Especially when it obviously doesn't have to be that way... (those crafty Europeans... Lol)
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The FJR has electronic adjustable suspension and cruise. And an adjustable rider seat. Other things are the about same as the Connie. The MSRP is 800 bucks more. There is the suspension upcharge. The FJR has a 5 speed. There is the cruise. It has a one year warranty. There is the seat. The FJR is ride by wire. Good? Maybe.
Over all, it really does not have a lot more. And no KIPASS!!!! That could be good...but a cost difference. There is the ride by wire and more.
The BMW has a lot more features.
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Shame they've let it get so far behind the class leaders by sitting on their laurels so long.
But in the mean time Kaw has come out with a new ZX14R, ZX10, 636, Z1000, Ninja 1000....
It's not that Kaw is sittin around doing nothing, it's just where the C14 is in their development cycle. With all the ST's that have come out since the last time Kaw touched the C14, I'm sure a new one is on the horizon?? With all the ST's from the competition I'm sure Kaw isn't going to wait 20yrs to update it like the C10.
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...With all the ST's from the competition I'm sure Kaw isn't going to wait 20yrs to update it like the C10.
of course not. It's not like it ever happened... ;)
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Honda for one has made a sharp turn away from the S/T market, going instead with FB6 bagger wing, and that strange CTX cruiser tour thing.
Yamaha only refreshed the FJR somewhat, no new bike.
BMW always will build whatever it wants to, and has loyal fans.
The Triumph Trophy is much more like a BMW or Wing than it is a Connie or FJR.
Don't see any new S/T entries under 700 lbs on the horizon, within the 12-1400 cc range.
Adventure tour is hot now, and using up a lot of oxygen in the MC world it would seem.
Our Connies may soon be considered classics of a bygone day!
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Our Connies may soon be considered classics of a bygone day!
...and worth 25 cents on the dollar. :(
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Pretty sad when we are too damn lazy to reach into our pockets for an ignition key!
And none of this kind of stuff makes the bike any better.
Why don't we get someone else to ride the bike for us, too?
Rant mode off.
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Pretty sad when we are too damn lazy to reach into our pockets for an ignition key!
And none of this kind of stuff makes the bike any better.
Why don't we get someone else to ride the bike for us, too?
Rant mode off.
a bike will ride exactly the same with keyless stuff or not, but I'd rather have the full keyless thing. It's just more comfortable. I can call home dialing (typing ;)) the number, or I can speed-dial by pressing and holding the #2 on my mobile phone. Both let me talk to the family, the second is just easier.
The point of my post was not to analyse the advantages or need of such system, but the half-way implementation of it by Kawasaki, compared to the much more accomplished implementation by BMW.
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a bike will ride exactly the same with keyless stuff or not, but I'd rather have the full keyless thing. It's just more comfortable. I can call home dialing (typing ;)) the number, or I can speed-dial by pressing and holding the #2 on my mobile phone. Both let me talk to the family, the second is just easier.
The point of my post was not to analyse the advantages or need of such system, but the half-way implementation of it by Kawasaki, compared to the much more achieved implementation by BMW.
^^^ good post (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
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+1 Martin 14.
I got where you were coming from, and feel the same way.
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While i came from a harley that had a real keyless system, bags included! I can honeslty say i have become used to the connies system, my only complaint woudl be that it would be nice to leave the saddlebags unlocked.
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Just saw this thread. So you are saying BMW really hit one out of the park (American euphemism meaning they did a fantastic job)..... other than the part about the fantastic part (the saddlebags are keyless) didn't quite work? ;)
But my curiosity is regarding the fuel lock- there is no mechanical override? Just curious but what happens when (not if) the lock solenoid fails? How does one open the cap to fix / replace it?
Brian
<snip>
Opening the gas cap is also only possible with the fob within range, just like the ignition. The cap doesn't even have a keyhole. THAT's the way it should be.
Get it, Kawasaki? (or just give me a freaking normal key and spend the KI-PASS money on driving modes!!!)
EDIT: I forgot about the remote control function of the fob to lock/unlock the cases. Sounds neat, but in my unit it didn't always work, not sure why...
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Just saw this thread too. No doubt having all that functionality in a truly keyless system would be nice. But I got to believe that would add some serious bucks to the bottom line of the bike.
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I never had to fumble in my pocket for a key. My FOB had a permanent place of residence in my jacket pocket, which I wear religously. When I need gas, I pulled the stove knob out of the ignition and used it. When wanted in the bags, same thing. The system wasn't perfect, but it was hard from being a pain.
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Lots to swallow there... and just like the old joke about a $#!+ sandwich ( the more bread you have, the less $#!+ you taste) I really have to question the comparo.
There is none. This big lump is $24k for starters, and ANY options you want come in "packages", which don't allow getting a single thing from that package without buying the big extras, at $4k per pop.
Lets say you just gotta have the pretty paint, some chrome, and different colored seats....its now $30k + another $1100 for prep and shipping..
Oh yeah...
http://www.sillsmotor.com/new_vehicle_detail.asp?veh=384611&CatDesc=Motorcycles&ModelYear=2014 (http://www.sillsmotor.com/new_vehicle_detail.asp?veh=384611&CatDesc=Motorcycles&ModelYear=2014)
Add in the fact this thing has a 12.2/1 compression ratio, and is running on the exact same tire sizes the C14 has, you MUST use the highest grade of fuel, and tire life will be worse than we have... cost adders for everyday consumtion.
Now, add in the BMR service costs for this bike that only has a 24 mo warrenty, to keep the bike in spec and warrented, oh yeah, just a minor house payment. And to retort to the fellow saying "I have $5k left to pay off on my conni", I can only laugh and say, " damned site better thaan still owing $16 k". ( which is more than the cost of owning a second Conni).
Mechanicals fail, and the k.I.s.s. principle comes to mind. A lot to think about because you don't want to pull a key out to refill gas, or open your side cases..
And with all the people wanting to add butt dyno farkles like exhausts, and flys out pcXXII stuff, well....
The C bike is a niche, afordable for most, sell the C bike and buy the B bike, and sell it in a couple years when the wife screams at you because you don't ride it enough to warrent another house payment... someone here will be glad to sell you their old Conni to get you back to reality...
These are the options, which are cost adders to the msrp
Adaptive headlight
LED fog lights
DTC
ESA II
Central locking system
Tire pressure monitor
Anti theft alarm
High seat
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MOB, I get your point(s), but I was just pointing at the key-less feature, not BMW's thirst for our hard earned, which I completely agree with you on. As I said in some other thread, if you get a GT or the new RT and want the top-case with it... "very well, sir, please drop the 1200 USD here". Insane :banghead: but since there are folks paying it, BMW keep asking it.
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Lets say you just gotta have the pretty paint
:-X
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a bike will ride exactly the same with keyless stuff or not, but I'd rather have the full keyless thing. It's just more comfortable. I can call home dialing (typing ;)) the number, or I can speed-dial by pressing and holding the #2 on my mobile phone. Both let me talk to the family, the second is just easier.
The point of my post was not to analyse the advantages or need of such system, but the half-way implementation of it by Kawasaki, compared to the much more accomplished implementation by BMW.
I feel the same way. Either do it right, or just give me a standard keyed system. The only two, very modest improvements that could be made to make me completely happy with no increase in price are 1) allow the side cases to be left in an unlocked state, and 2) the same with the gas cap, or don't make it locking in the first place.