Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => Accessories and modifications - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: jwolffie on March 09, 2014, 05:24:33 PM
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I decided I wanted better light and I also wanted the front of the bike blacked out so I bought a projector headlight retrofit kit from "The Retrofit Source" http://www.theretrofitsource.com/complete-retrofit-kits/motorcycle-stage-iii-kit-dual-headlight.html#.UxztS_ldWuI (http://www.theretrofitsource.com/complete-retrofit-kits/motorcycle-stage-iii-kit-dual-headlight.html#.UxztS_ldWuI)
The kit came very complete and was fairly easy to install and the lights are crazy bright too without annoying other drivers. I got the 4300K bulbs because they are the brightest and whitest, and I got the 70mm angel eye LED's. The angel eyes are way brighter than I expected, they could be used as day time running lights without the low beams on. The low beams have a very white and bright light that goes down the road about twice as far as the stock headlights, and they have a very cool blue line right at the low beam cut off line. It gives a very noticeable flicker to oncoming traffic. Here is what it takes to do it:
First remove all of the plastic from the bike from the gas tank forward, including the windshield and the cover under the windshield, and the mirrors, and then slide the headlight housing out the front of the bike. (see photos) Next bake the housing in the oven to loosen the glue (230 for 6 minutes worked for me) or use a heat gun on the seam (probably easier) and pry the headlight housing apart. Use some cheep home depot gloves because it will be too hot to hold. While I had the housings apart I sprayed all of the chrome parts with oven cleaner to remove the chrome and then I painted everything satin black with high temp engine paint including the shrouds for the projectors. I attached the angel eyes to the shrouds using very fine wire in three places and attached the entire projector to the existing headlight buckets using the hole for the old bulbs. Next test fire the system and make sure the projectors are level by twisting them slightly and close up the headlight and reheat it and then finish closing it with a pair of pliers. I then mounted the ballasts to the two existing screws at the bottom of the headlight housing below the city lights, and wired the angel eyes into the city light sub-harness so they come on with the ignition. (see photo) I ran the provided harness to the battery and plugged it into the right side headlight wire for a trigger signal and ran the rest of the wires to the headlights. Used lots of zip ties too. I put everything back together and aimed the headlights and I was done. This was a two day weekend project but well worth it.
Click on the photos to make them larger.
(http://)
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More photos:
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Last ones:
(http://)
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Thanks for sharing. (Do post some pixs of the finished assembly from the front, you forgot!) I have been, overall, disappointed with my non-projector HID conversion. It is more light, but the pattern is pretty sucky, not putting light where I really need it. I am very spoiled by the *excellent* projector HID's in my G37. Maybe this will be a greatly improved option for some people looking to gain the extra lighting but while also having a reasonable pattern that is both useful for the rider as well as all the other traffic being subjected to it.
It is probably too much for me to tackle, especially after having already invested time and money in a non-projector kit. Maybe one day when LED projectors have some innovation I won't be able to resist anymore...
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Nice.
I started on that project but never finished it. Hmmmmm. Maybe I can see if I can re- start that....
Brian
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close up, If I get any closer all I get is reflection from the outer lens of the headlight.
(http://)
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:finger_fing11: :chugbeer:
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This is something I will be doing before next winter. I had projo's (TRS Mini H1) retro'd on my Ninja 650 and I hate not having them now...
Im considering going with the mini D2S. Can you send some photos of the install process? I know theres PLENTY of room in there (unlike my 650 which I had to cut up the bucket to mount) but i wanna see some details before I go splitting the only housing I have.
Also, does that kit come with the mini-H1 or D2S? I want the D2S for the extra heat handling to run 55W HIDs.
In return, when I finally do mine I'll post massive details about my retrofit.
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Also, does that kit come with the mini-H1 or D2S? I want the D2S for the extra heat handling to run 55W HIDs.
Morimoto 3Five mini H1 35 watt bi-xeonon
http://www.theretrofitsource.com/components/bulbs/morimoto-3five-h1-bulbs.html (http://www.theretrofitsource.com/components/bulbs/morimoto-3five-h1-bulbs.html)
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Morimoto 3Five mini H1 35 watt bi-xeonon
http://www.theretrofitsource.com/components/bulbs/morimoto-3five-h1-bulbs.html (http://www.theretrofitsource.com/components/bulbs/morimoto-3five-h1-bulbs.html)
Should have clarified. He mentioned the "motorcycle 2-light kit" which I believe comes with the MH1's, which can only handle 35w bulbs without melting. I want 55w for the extra brightness.
Now that I'm halfway awake, also: Did you have to do any trimming? I know the MH1 and MD2S come with a rubber/silicone washer type piece thats supposed to go between the housing reflector bowl, and the reflector cup for the projector. I plan on omitting that piece, and instead using JB weld there to eliveate (sp?) any shifting. (Ive heard people say that when using the rubber piece theres enough movement allowed that it can move. I don't plan on removing the lights ever.)
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Ahh! Another issue i just remembered.
How did you remedy the issue of the low beams turning off when thhe high beams are activated?
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Use a large capacitor on the control feed side of the low beam headlights. I ran into this problem retrofitting autos with HIDs. When switching to high beams, the low beam circuit is shut off for a fraction of a second; that is enough to cause the lights to go out and re- arc to start up again. A large capacitor (I believe mine is 4,700 microFarads) will hold the voltage high for long enough to step over this loss of signal voltage.
Brian
Ahh! Another issue i just remembered.
How did you remedy the issue of the low beams turning off when thhe high beams are activated?
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But on the connie the low beams are completely shut off when the highs are turned on, unless you hold down the pass button. (Which I guess you could rewire the switch so both switches did the pass function off highs on without shutting off the lows?)
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How did you remedy the issue of the low beams turning off when the high beams are activated?
I don't know about the above system, but the HID lamps in both my car and bike have a single element. There is no "high beam" and "low beam" lamp, just one lamp that always burns. When the mode is switched on the bike, it physically moves the lamp in and out with a solenoid, changing the angle of the light on the reflector. When the mode is switched on the projectors in the car, it raises or lowers a shroud via a solenoid, allowing or blocking light that would go in the high-beam range.
I had assumed all modern HID worked one of the ways I just described.
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The kit I bought came with a wiring harness that has the following connections:
Battery +
Battery -
Input from 1 headlight socket ( the connector that hooks up to the stock bulbs )
2 Ballast power connections (Ballast 12V + and - )
2 Connectors for the high beam solenoid (moves the shield to give you high beams)
It also contains a inline box that takes the signal from the headlight switch and uses it for high beams, it uses battery power to keep the headlights lit.
It was all plug and play and very easy, they have lots of good YouTube video how-to's that you can watch first also.
I would have taken more assembly photos but I was in a big hurry to get it done in 1 weekend because it is my commuter. My wife wasn't too happy with me baking the paint on the headlight parts for 20 minutes at 200 degrees in her oven to make sure the paint was dry either. (I sent her shopping first)
Flash to pass still works too
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Should have clarified. He mentioned the "motorcycle 2-light kit" which I believe comes with the MH1's, which can only handle 35w bulbs without melting. I want 55w for the extra brightness.
Now that I'm halfway awake, also: Did you have to do any trimming? I know the MH1 and MD2S come with a rubber/silicone washer type piece thats supposed to go between the housing reflector bowl, and the reflector cup for the projector. I plan on omitting that piece, and instead using JB weld there to eliveate (sp?) any shifting. (Ive heard people say that when using the rubber piece theres enough movement allowed that it can move. I don't plan on removing the lights ever.)
No trimming was needed and yes I used the silicone washer on the install. There is a tiny wiggle with the washer but it causes the lights to look like they flicker to on coming traffic, at least they see me. :o
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Thanks for sharing. (Do post some pixs of the finished assembly from the front, you forgot!) I have been, overall, disappointed with my non-projector HID conversion. It is more light, but the pattern is pretty sucky, not putting light where I really need it. I am very spoiled by the *excellent* projector HID's in my G37. Maybe this will be a greatly improved option for some people looking to gain the extra lighting but while also having a reasonable pattern that is both useful for the rider as well as all the other traffic being subjected to it.
It is probably too much for me to tackle, especially after having already invested time and money in a non-projector kit. Maybe one day when LED projectors have some innovation I won't be able to resist anymore...
They make an upgrade kit for people that already have HID, it is less money too.
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This is something I will be doing before next winter. I had projo's (TRS Mini H1) retro'd on my Ninja 650 and I hate not having them now...
Im considering going with the mini D2S. Can you send some photos of the install process? I know theres PLENTY of room in there (unlike my 650 which I had to cut up the bucket to mount) but i wanna see some details before I go splitting the only housing I have.
Also, does that kit come with the mini-H1 or D2S? I want the D2S for the extra heat handling to run 55W HIDs.
In return, when I finally do mine I'll post massive details about my retrofit.
here are some of Brian's great photos of the housing disassembled: http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=10405.0 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=10405.0)
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I don't know about the above system, but the HID lamps in both my car and bike have a single element. There is no "high beam" and "low beam" lamp, just one lamp that always burns. When the mode is switched on the bike, it physically moves the lamp in and out with a solenoid, changing the angle of the light on the reflector. When the mode is switched on the projectors in the car, it raises or lowers a shroud via a solenoid, allowing or blocking light that would go in the high-beam range.
I had assumed all modern HID worked one of the ways I just described.
Right, but the TRS kits (I've done these before) use the low-beam signal to power the HID Ballasts, and the high-beam signal to drop the shutter and raise the cutoff. If thw low-beam signal cuts out when you turn on the high-beams, that kindof defeats the purpose because you lose your headlights.
On my 650 it wasnt a problem because the low-beam bulb stayed on when the high beam was turned on (that STUPID one-side low one side high some MFRs like to do....)
If im understanding this correctly:
2 Connectors for the high beam solenoid (moves the shield to give you high beams)
It also contains a inline box that takes the signal from the headlight switch and uses it for high beams, it uses battery power to keep the headlights lit.
That inline p&p box has a capacitor inside that maintains the signal to the ballasts during the transition? (As was mentioned above)
I know on some vehicles you can modify a relay by snipping a prong off and that stops certain lights from turning off.
No trimming was needed and yes I used the silicone washer on the install. There is a tiny wiggle with the washer but it causes the lights to look like they flicker to on coming traffic, at least they see me. :o
Thats a no-go for me. JB Weld it will be haha.
Just glad i wont have to cut it up like I did my 650. One wasnt perfectly lined up, so after a while I cut it all apart to fix it, and still had it tilted a bit..... Was so freaking annoying. I like the idea of being able to set the level in the bike, then re-remove the housing and JB weld the projos in place.
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Right, but the TRS kits (I've done these before) use the low-beam signal to power the HID Ballasts, and the high-beam signal to drop the shutter and raise the cutoff. If thw low-beam signal cuts out when you turn on the high-beams, that kindof defeats the purpose because you lose your headlights.
OK, got it. I seem to have missed that point of it before now. I am not sure how they addressed that in my kit, but it is not a problem. Perhaps they did use a capacitor or something, like Brian pointed out earlier. I can't remember that far back now, or if I ever even knew :)
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Night shots, hard to capture the difference with the camera. They shine easily twice the distance of the stock lights.
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Night shots, hard to capture the difference with the camera. They shine easily twice the distance of the stock lights.
I think they are not adjusted correctly- the two lights are overlapping too much. In fact, they seem to be overlapping exactly. This results in a very bright spot in the middle and dimmer than expected on the sides. I would spread them apart a bit.
Harder to tell about elevation... but they seem like they might be just about perfect. They have a very nice pattern, although less light directly in front, close to the bike than I would want/expect. Far better pattern than the HID H4 conversion I have.
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I think they are not adjusted correctly- the two lights are overlapping too much. In fact, they seem to be overlapping exactly. This results in a very bright spot in the middle and dimmer than expected on the sides. I would spread them apart a bit.
Harder to tell about elevation... but they seem like they might be just about perfect. They have a very nice pattern, although less light directly in front, close to the bike than I would want/expect. Far better pattern than the HID H4 conversion I have.
I don't remember the exact distance between the lights, it is only something like 9 or 10 inches, they are adjusted parallel to each other but far away it starts to look like one light with the camera, not so much in person. The angel eyes actually light up in front of the bike quite nicely.
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So.... what does installing new projectors buy you vs doing something like this?
http://www.socalmotogear.com/GL1500-PROFESSIONAL-HID-KIT-p/gl15.htm (http://www.socalmotogear.com/GL1500-PROFESSIONAL-HID-KIT-p/gl15.htm)
My New 2011 Kawasaki Concours 14 - HID Headlights and LED Running Lights Installed. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkH3xBN4hE8#ws)
I imagine installing new projectors are better?
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Look at the pictures he posted above of the low-beam cutoff line against the wall, then at his high beam cutoff against the wall. See how his is nice and clean, super efficiant, and the cutoff keeps the light from blinding other drivers?
Now pull your bike up to a wall. See how yours is sparatic, wastes light energy (by throwing light where you don't need it), and blinds other drivers? That's the difference.
Brighter isn't always better. It's about light control. Once you have it controlled, then go brighter so you don't blind people :)
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Brighter isn't always better. It's about light control. Once you have it controlled, then go brighter so you don't blind people :)
That.
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Look at the pictures he posted above of the low-beam cutoff line against the wall, then at his high beam cutoff against the wall. See how his is nice and clean, super efficiant, and the cutoff keeps the light from blinding other drivers?
Now pull your bike up to a wall. See how yours is sparatic, wastes light energy (by throwing light where you don't need it), and blinds other drivers? That's the difference.
Brighter isn't always better. It's about light control. Once you have it controlled, then go brighter so you don't blind people :)
That is not my bike in the Vid, just a video I stumbled upon. My thoughts are that while it may not be a perfect solution, it would be much better than stock, no? There is also the factor of not having to completely remove the front off of your bike, **** off the wife with bike parts in the oven, and also potentially F'ing up said parts. What about resealing the housing and not having it leak/fog up?
Don't get me wrong, I think this is an awesome mod, I was just wondering if it is worth the extra hassle and risk?
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That.
+1
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That is not my bike in the Vid, just a video I stumbled upon. My thoughts are that while it may not be a perfect solution, it would be much better than stock, no?
Not necessarily. There is more light [with a non-projector H4 HID kit], but I am not impressed with what I ended up with as far as the pattern. It is much worse than the stock H4 pattern. So it is far less "better" than I thought it would be. Was it worth it? Not sure at this point. I don't know how much the H4 HID kits [non projector] vary from vendor to vendor, but it is my understanding that probably all of them suffer from similar issues.
There is also the factor of not having to completely remove the front off of your bike, **** off the wife with bike parts in the oven, and also potentially F'ing up said parts. What about resealing the housing and not having it leak/fog up?
All true.
Don't get me wrong, I think this is an awesome mod, I was just wondering if it is worth the extra hassle and risk?
Perfectly valid question.
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That is not my bike in the Vid, just a video I stumbled upon. My thoughts are that while it may not be a perfect solution, it would be much better than stock, no?
It's not a perfect solution. Is it better than stock? Sure, you'll be able to see a bit more, but you'll also be quite litterally blinding oncoming drivers (as to them it's like you have your high-beams on ALL the time, but way brighter) so they're more likely to hit you. So if that's an improvement to you, go for it.
There is also the factor of not having to completely remove the front off of your bike, **** off the wife with bike parts in the oven, and also potentially F'ing up said parts. What about resealing the housing and not having it leak/fog up?
Easier to get forgiveness than permission. Bake them while she's not at home.
There's so many how-to's out there on doing this, that it's kindof hard to F*k up parts unless you start really doing crazy stuff like I tend to do. (Like what happened with my 650...)
If you get the right kit, it's almost impossible to screw it up on the Connie because of how deep the buckets are. I bought a spare housing to do the 650 because it was a 3 week project initially, and 5 days when I re-did it. but I would confidently do the Connie headlights in 1 day using my only housing based on all the info I've read and received here.
Don't get me wrong, I think this is an awesome mod, I was just wondering if it is worth the extra hassle and risk?
Yes. Period. Dot. End of story. (Unless you never ride at night, then keep it stock)
Not necessarily. There is more light [with a non-projector H4 HID kit], but I am not impressed with what I ended up with as far as the pattern. It is much worse than the stock H4 pattern. So it is far less "better" than I thought it would be. Was it worth it? Not sure at this point. I don't know how much the H4 HID kits [non projector] vary from vendor to vendor, but it is my understanding that probably all of them suffer from similar issues.
Really, the only good lighting setups are stock, and with projectors. Just by nature HID bulbs don't at all work well in a reflector housing. They were designed for Projectors, and should only be used in such. The cheap modding community in the late 90's early 2000's got a hold of straight bulbs and started making their headlights purple for the "Look at me I'm a H**o" factor, and that's where the phenomenon took off.
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That is not my bike in the Vid, just a video I stumbled upon. My thoughts are that while it may not be a perfect solution, it would be much better than stock, no? There is also the factor of not having to completely remove the front off of your bike, **** off the wife with bike parts in the oven, and also potentially F'ing up said parts. What about resealing the housing and not having it leak/fog up?
Don't get me wrong, I think this is an awesome mod, I was just wondering if it is worth the extra hassle and risk?
I bought a roll of sealant with the projectors, I just added a little more sealer, heated it up and squished it together with pliers.
I think a good heat gun would work just as well as the oven, you just have to get the glue warm.
And yes, it is MUCH better than stock.