Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: billyzoom on February 09, 2013, 02:48:00 PM
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I just took my first ride on my new 2012 Concours other than the initial ride home, and I'm getting a feel for the bike. This will be my distance-oriented bike...I have a Ducati S4Rs as my local, around town bike. This is what I'm accustomed to:
(http://i886.photobucket.com/albums/ac67/billyzoom1/S4rsupdated_zps42ed3b79.jpg)
And here's the new Concours:
(http://i886.photobucket.com/albums/ac67/billyzoom1/Concours2_zpsd9586edf.jpg)
Apparently I'm quite fond of black.
Before I get to the riding impressions of the Kawi, I realized as I was riding it, how proud I was of having a Kawasaki. I didn't really think about it when I bought it, but growing up in the 70s, I always thought of Kawasaki as the most kickass and ferocious of the Japanese brands. I've owned bikes from all the major Japanese makers, and to me there's just something about Kawasaki in my mind that separates them from the others.
Anyway. What I love about the new bike:
Comfortable ride.
Tracks well and inspires confidence.
Feels MUCH lighter than it is. Very manageable, especially considering it weighs 200 pounds more than anything I've ever owned before.
Heated grips rock.
Braking power is excellent.
Transmission feels great....smooth, smooth shifting.
Love the adjustable windshield.
Looks classy and badass all at the same time.
The negatives:
Mine feels a little buzzy. Not obtrusive, but definitely noticeable through the bars. This actually is bothering me a bit mentally. Any ideas? I don't know how typical this is.
Torque and power is disappointing so far. It does NOT feel like a 1400 to me. I only have 250 miles on it, so of course I haven't gotten the revs up much as it's still breaking in. Even with that, I'd expect much more torque from this size engine. Part of it may be that the bike is so eerily quiet...I'm used to my Ducati, and on that bike the acceleration is accompanied by wind blast, honking intake, and a full Arrow exhaust.. But if I were guessing at the displacement of the Concourse just by seat of the pants, I'd guess it was a 750. But I've only had it to 5000 briefly, and typically under 4.
Handlebars aren't QUITE right...I'll be buying some risers.
Windshield is a bit small. I'll be buying something a bit wider and taller (I'm 6'2").
Footpegs seem a bit high, causing my legs to fold a bit more than I'd expect.
I do NOT like linked brakes.
The horn is anemic.
So. Overall, I'm quite happy. The issues I have are pretty easily remedied. Already ordered: Full Area P exhaust and PC V with custom map. When these are installed I'll be pulling the flies. I expect this will give a solid boost in power and low-end torque, plus the exhaust sound will give a perceived boost, even if it's not real. :) I have a leftover Stebel Nautilus horn, but finding a spot to mount it is apparently a challenge.
To be ordered this week...bigger windshield, handlebar risers, and some type of radar detector mount. I may get a new saddle to increase comfort and perhaps raise the seat height a tad. This should help my leg comfort. Looking into some fairing protection, and maybe a tail trunk eventually.
Anyway, that's it. Glad to be part of the club. This seems like a great resource and a great forum.
Joel
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Congrats and welcome! See the post on the Guhl motors CPU reflash. I think you will find this makes the bike feel more like a 1400. This is an option that may be used instead of a fly ectomy and a PC5. Add some of the farkles you have mentioned and get rid of the stock tires, and you will love your new bike. Have a good time setting her up the way you like.
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We are about the same height and I love the Helibars but I was coming from a cruiser not a sport bike. But I can say it takes care of the buzz and vibrations you are talking about. I also got the Canyon cages for protection and its a good thing I did. I came out of the store today and my bike had fallen over. I'm to blame, might have been on an incline and I didn't leave it gear but the canyon cages from MCE saved the bike.
I also got a used Corbin on the forum. I love it but it is lower than the stock. It is hard but nicely shaped and I'm willing to give up some leg comfort to be able to be on the bike for 5-9 hours without any discomfort.
Welcome to the club.
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Welcome!
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Look into getting a set of Buell XB12XT black pegs. I love mine. I actually owned a Buell when I bought the Connie so they were easy to find for me.
(http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll112/tomdvaughan/pegs.jpg)
+1 on the Canyon Cages.
And welcome :thumbs:
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Welcome! +1 on the Helibars Horizon ST bars. But like Broz I am also coming from a cruiser. +2 on the canyon cages.
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I just took my first ride on my new 2012 Concours
Congrats!
Torque and power is disappointing so far. It does NOT feel like a 1400 to me. I only have 250 miles on it, so of course I haven't gotten the revs up much as it's still breaking in.
That is why. Trust me, the C-14 is every bit a 14... you just can't tell yet. The consensus, as you will see on this forum, is that the secondary butterflies ("flies") are being used to severely "tame" the bike at lower RPMs. So it will feel a bit "blah" until 3500RPM and then start ramping up. I am kinda used to it now, but a lot of people will either remove the "flies" or flash the ECU with a program that will open them quickly.
The other stuff you listed (except buzzy, which is unusual to hear) is pretty much standard fare and all easily correctable, with the exception of the linked brakes. That you will just have to deal with. Doesn't bother me, but it drives some people crazy :)
Start searching the forums. Everything you have mentioned is covered over and over. Enjoy
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What maxtag said! Wait until its broken in and you can get it into its full torque band 6k to redline. Probably won't keep up with your Duck but probably not too far behind in a straight line. Not bad for a heavy touring bagger.
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Welcome and congrats Joel! :chugbeer:
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Hey Joel.
Don't notice any buzzing, but this is my first in line 4.
You may not feel the acceleration but look at the tach and speedo. Man this bike hits redline before I realize it is getting close. There is nothing to indicate you got the revs up that high if you aren't looking at the tach. My other bikes you know you are getting near redline by the sound and feel, and have time to shift. The bike is very linear in it's power delivery.
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- there's alot of info on the buzziness. Its at the 4K + rpms area and can actually numb your hands (invariably the right hand).
- There's also alot of info on how to deal with it (basically to try to insulate it from your hands and not to dail it out completely).
- the power : well , break it in correctly and then see what happens when you go past 6K rpms. This bike is basically a ZX14 sportsbike with an electric windscreen. The motor seems to like its gearbox and encourages the rider to do the same. From a stop (or from a correctly selected mid-gear situation) , this bike will leave most anything on wheels. You'll have lots off fun coming off highway ramps .... the bike will merge with such a velocity that you'll shock traffic coming along you.
- brakes : just use the brake lever. The bike will sort out your front/rear bias by itself without the linking's abruptness. Avoid the brake pedal. Since you come from a Ducati, you probably know how to do that already.
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Great choice on the Area P, and whack that throttle "it is already broken in". 8) Torque vastly improves with what mods you plan on doing, although this bike does very much in fact starts to wake up at approx 4k. It is sneaky fast compared to the angry Duc, 2 different beasts for sure....but you will be impressed with the C14 in no time.
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I apologise in advance to the older members of this forum (by membership, not age ;D) because they heard my story before, but here it is...
That buzz that you feel was in my bike too, and there have been others with the same complaints. In some cases (like mine) it was due to a 1,6 mm washer missing between the grip and the handlebar weights. If you check in the explosion view on bikebandit.com or the likes, you'll see the part. It drove me crazy for months, the I drove Kawasaki crazy, then a few dealers, until somebody who actually cared about his customers found the issue. 1.60$ is all it took. I liked the bike but I hate vibrations with all my heart. Now I just love her. Smooth as silk. And after those flies went where they belong (a zip bag in a drawer) the torque that the Kawasaki engine department meant for this engine is all there for me.
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I apologise in advance to the older members of this forum (by membership, not age ;D) because they heard my story before, but here it is...
That buzz that you feel was in my bike too, and there have been others with the same complaints. In some cases (like mine) it was due to a 1,6 mm washer missing between the grip and the handlebar weights. If you check in the explosion view on bikebandit.com or the likes, you'll see the part. It drove me crazy for months, the I drove Kawasaki crazy, then a few dealers, until somebody who actually cared about his customers found the issue. 1.60$ is all it took.
I hadn't hear this before. Good info. I have never had any buzzing. I also have throttlemeisters installed. I don't use them for cruise control any more but have kept them on the bike because they are a high quality bar end weight.
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I apologise in advance to the older members of this forum (by membership, not age ;D ) because they heard my story before, but here it is...
That buzz that you feel was in my bike too, and there have been others with the same complaints. In some cases (like mine) it was due to a 1,6 mm washer missing between the grip and the handlebar weights. If you check in the explosion view on bikebandit.com or the likes, you'll see the part. It drove me crazy for months, the I drove Kawasaki crazy, then a few dealers, until somebody who actually cared about his customers found the issue. 1.60$ is all it took. I liked the bike but I hate vibrations with all my heart. Now I just love her. Smooth as silk. And after those flies went where they belong (a zip bag in a drawer) the torque that the Kawasaki engine department meant for this engine is all there for me.
No need to apologize, Martin. It's been awhile so it bears repeating every so often. :)
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Regarding the larger/taller windshield... choose your windshield and ride it for a while before getting a seat. I'm just over 6' and my Cee Bailey ultra tour is actually just tall enough in some situations, enough so that I definitely couldn't add any height to my seat to relieve my knees. If I purchased them in reverse order I woulda been f'd.
Murph's drop pegs do provide knee relief for the longer legged riders.
I reduced the handlebar buzz with grip puppies type of covering. It also had the added benefit of increasing the diameter of the grip for my ape hands (XXL) to be more comfortable holding onto.
You will love this bike once you get through break-in.
Congrats.
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Regarding the larger/taller windshield... choose your windshield and ride it for a while before getting a seat. I'm just over 6' and my Cee Bailey ultra tour is actually just tall enough in some situations, enough so that I definitely couldn't add any height to my seat to relieve my knees. If I purchased them in reverse order I woulda been f'd.
Murph's drop pegs do provide knee relief for the longer legged riders.
I reduced the handlebar buzz with grip puppies type of covering. It also had the added benefit of increasing the diameter of the grip for my ape hands (XXL) to be more comfortable holding onto.
You will love this bike once you get through break-in.
Congrats.
Wow! I am of the opposite opinion. I bought an '08 OEM windshield and prefer it over the '12 shield because the air hits me in the chest which hold me up at speed. My Bell Star helmet likes to be in the clean air above the windhield.
I also have the Sargent seat that sits me up a little over the OEM seat and a little closer to the tank.
I don't hold onto the grips. Just rest my gloved hands on the grips with my wrists held straight. The friction of the quality leather holds the thottle with the help of a cramp buster. Sure I grab the grips if and when needed depending on situation, but for the most part just resting my palms on the grips.
The beauty of the adjustable screen is that I can raise it in a rain and cause backpressure that pushes the rain off my faceshield without having to turn my head.
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Windshield choices have too many variables for every rider, due to how long your torso is, your neck, your helmet, do you slouch or sit up tall...etc. What I may consider as clean air, others may consider it to be choppy, too much, or even too turbulent. I always want some clean air hitting me, I am riding a motorcycle for crying out loud.
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Windshield choices have too many variables for every rider, due to how long your torso is, your neck, your helmet, do you slouch or sit up tall...etc. What I may consider as clean air, others may consider it to be choppy, too much, or even too turbulent. I always want some clean air hitting me, I am riding a motorcycle for crying out loud.
I agree with Pokey. Some of us have even cut our stock windsheilds down for more airflow during the warmer months.
(http://www.zggtr.org/MGalleryItem.php?id=349)
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Did you paint your shield Conrad, could ya share exactly what you did to get that dark?
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Fusion paint inside. Tape the edges carefully. Easiest farkle but it will slow down an '08 by about %15 ;)
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I figure I'll keep the stock windshield for warmer months and the larger one for the cooler months. I like that dark look, but the last time I tried painting my windshield was on my Ducati. I painted the inside and it looked okay, but wasn't quite good enough for me. I just bought a tinted shield and was happy. If I need a smaller shield than stock, I may do that for the Kawi as well.
I do plan to ride with the new shield before doing anything else with pegs or a new saddle. We'll feel it out.
Thanks for all the tips.
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Riding the C14 is sweet indeed, but wait till you realize the mad pow-ah of KiPass (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/bigthumb.gif)
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Here's a windshield thread that may interest you.
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=914.0 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=914.0)
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Did you paint your shield Conrad, could ya share exactly what you did to get that dark?
Well, I started off trying to tint that shield using VHT Nightshades. :-[
I was VERY meticulous in my prep and I did tape the edges as Chet suggested. As I was spraying the inside of the shield the damn spray can started to sputter (yes, I did test it first on some scrap and it was fine then) and f'ed up my nice smooth coat. I got pissed and ended up blacking out the shield with multiple coats.
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Torque and power is disappointing so far. It does NOT feel like a 1400 to me.
Yep, the C-14 is not a speedster. I bought it as kind of a middle of the road performance tourer. Faster than my Road Kings, but slower that my 'Busa and ZX-10R. But it is underpowered for a 1400cc.
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Yep, the C-14 is not a speedster. I bought it as kind of a middle of the road performance tourer.
Middle of the road tourer compared to WHAT "tourer"?
Faster than my Road Kings, but slower that my 'Busa and ZX-10R. But it is underpowered for a 1400cc.
I think that is more illusion than reality. It is quiet, smooth, and aerodynamic with great protection. It is faster than it appears. It is not as "peaky" as a Busa, and is not as light as a ZX-10. The C-14's power band is flatter/broader (which is nicer for touring) and it also feels stifled due to the secondary butterflies. One you jump over the 4K RPM hump (flies/correctable) and account for the weight, the C-14 performs very well.
If you don't want comfort, quiet, storage, reliability, and amenities then get a ZX-14 which is a sports bike.
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A reflash changes everything down low
I even SEE MaxDog having it done
Group BUY Group BUY 8)
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Group BUY Group BUY 8)
+100, ;D
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But I've only had it to 5000 briefly, and typically under 4.
Hurry up & get thru the break in period, Connie just starts to wake up at 5k...& with the mods you plan on doing I think you'll notice a huge improvement.
Congrats & welcome!
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I agree with Pokey. Some of us have even cut our stock windsheilds down for more airflow during the warmer months.
(http://www.zggtr.org/MGalleryItem.php?id=349)
Yeah the prior owner did a great job cutting down the stock shield......I surely would have butchered it. An absolute necessity for Summer!
(http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss53/mgorbsky/5e0692911a541341e2694a60858fc5be_zps2c133457.jpg)
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Middle of the road tourer compared to WHAT "tourer"?
I think that is more illusion than reality. It is quiet, smooth, and aerodynamic with great protection. It is faster than it appears. It is not as "peaky" as a Busa, and is not as light as a ZX-10. The C-14's power band is flatter/broader (which is nicer for touring) and it also feels stifled due to the secondary butterflies. One you jump over the 4K RPM hump (flies/correctable) and account for the weight, the C-14 performs very well.
If you don't want comfort, quiet, storage, reliability, and amenities then get a ZX-14 which is a sports bike.
Since I own a BKing, which is Hayabusa-powered, I will concur that the C14 does not feel like a 1400 should; this is mostly due to the secondaries. My ZX14 felt the same way, until I pulled the secondaries, which made it feel Ike it should have from the factory.
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- past 6,000 rpms , the bike seems to get plenty fast , right quick.
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- past 6,000 rpms , the bike seems to get plenty fast , right quick.
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The secondaries are open and aren't reducing power. The bike should feel like that everywhere. Instead, it has a feel that is kind of similar to a turbo spinning up.
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Instead, it has a feel that is kind of similar to a turbo spinning up.
I thought it felt more like a 2 stroke lol.
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Congrats and welcome.
I like the Ducati, but I like to bring stuff with me.
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The secondaries are open and aren't reducing power. The bike should feel like that everywhere. Instead, it has a feel that is kind of similar to a turbo spinning up.
This will help with that: http://guhlmotors.com/guts.html (http://guhlmotors.com/guts.html)
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Yes, I've just been too cheap to get it done, but it shouldn't even be necessary. I have no idea what Kawasaki was trying to accomplish with the secondaries. They make even less sense on a ZX14.
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Yes, I've just been too cheap to get it done, but it shouldn't even be necessary. I have no idea what Kawasaki was trying to accomplish with the secondaries. They make even less sense on a ZX14.
Just a guess but I would think it is to help meet pollution and import requirements. Seems like all the FI I4 bikes have them, not just Kawasaki.
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This is from a DL1000 forum:
"To answer your question, the secondary throttle system helps manage and smooth throttle response in part-throttle situations by keeping the velocity of the air/fuel in the intakes high. It's also used to partially restrict engine output in 5th and 6th gear, but this is not its primary function."
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"To answer your question, the secondary throttle system helps manage and smooth throttle response in part-throttle situations
Translation: "Bikes are getting so powerful/fast now, we are using secondaries to choke down the response/power so as not to freak out the driver"
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the stebal air horn fits under the black panel to the right side of the fairing opposite side of the glove box. you can use a heavy duty zip tie to secure it to the frame and the factory horn is close enough to tap into the harness
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Just a guess but I would think it is to help meet pollution and import requirements. Seems like all the FI I4 bikes have them, not just Kawasaki.
The Hayabusa motors do not have them, of that I am certain. I'm not sure what other bikes have them, but I believe the majority do not use a secondary butterfly setup.
The secondaries make no difference WRT to pollution controls. Cars don't have them, and the pollution requirements on them are much more strict that motrocycles.
I suspect Kawasaki put them in place to make the bike more tractable and reduce their exposure to liability.
Built by accountants (like most things nowadays...)
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This is from a DL1000 forum:
"To answer your question, the secondary throttle system helps manage and smooth throttle response in part-throttle situations by keeping the velocity of the air/fuel in the intakes high. It's also used to partially restrict engine output in 5th and 6th gear, but this is not its primary function."
Maybe on a DL1000. I could believe it is used for smoothing throttle response, except it isn't exactly smooth just off idle (this complaint is echoed on the forums). 3-6K RPMs are not 'just off idle', so by 3000 rpms, the flies should be open all the way.
On the C14 and ZX14/r we know via testing (thanks to Brock) that the flies open fully at 6000 RPM and remain open all the way through the rev range, regardless of what gear you are in.
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The Hayabusa motors do not have them, of that I am certain. I'm not sure what other bikes have them, but I believe the majority do not use a secondary butterfly setup.
The secondaries make no difference WRT to pollution controls. Cars don't have them, and the pollution requirements on them are much more strict that motrocycles.
I suspect Kawasaki .
Built by accountants (like most things nowadays...)
But most cars have port injection not throttle body and they have O2 sensor feedback. But I suspect you are correct that they "put them in place to make the bike more tractable and reduce their exposure to liability".
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The flies are regulated more by throttle position than by rpm.
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The flies are regulated more by throttle position than by rpm.
Where is the information on that? I seem to recall someone showing the flies position and it was a function of RPMs and gearing; I don't recall seeing throttle position in that data, though maybe it was.
I double checked - I was wrong; the Hayabusa motors do have secondaries, but Suzuki apparently uses them to control the power delivery of the various modes. I can tell you in A mode, the BKing definitely pulls like a 1400cc I4 should from off idle to near redline.
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Info here
http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php/topic,28657.0.html (http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php/topic,28657.0.html)
Fred worked with Guhl to get this done
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Info here
http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php/topic,28657.0.html (http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php/topic,28657.0.html)
Fred worked with Guhl to get this done
+1 Thanks.... informative
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Info here
http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php/topic,28657.0.html (http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php/topic,28657.0.html)
Fred worked with Guhl to get this done
That was it, thanks!
Looking at that chart REALLY upsets me. I PAID for a 1400; I'm not a beginner and I don't need the manufacturers to 'look out' for my safety by limiting the engine.
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Now you know how to fix it. :)
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Do the "re-flash" and the flies stay in and you get the same if not better results as if pulling them?
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Info here
http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php/topic,28657.0.html (http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php/topic,28657.0.html)
Fred worked with Guhl to get this done
+3 or 4 I didn't see this before. Good information.
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Do the "re-flash" and the flies stay in and you get the same if not better results as if pulling them?
You get better results by far. The secondaries are used for traction control, starting/idle, and power control. By reflashing, it can still do all three- with it mostly changing the power control. AND the ECU will automatically compensate for the new secondaries map. AND they tweaked the fuel maps some for better performance.
If you remove the secondaries, you completely lose an important part of the traction control system (although it will still work, just not as effectively nor as smoothly). Then you also completely lose a part of the starting/idle/warmup system. And the ECU will *NOT* compensate for the loss of the flies, so I assume the mix will go too lean at points in the map. And that is dangerous for the engine. And, finally, it will not tweak the fuel map for better performance.
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Middle of the road tourer compared to WHAT "tourer"?
I think that is more illusion than reality. It is quiet, smooth, and aerodynamic with great protection. It is faster than it appears. It is not as "peaky" as a Busa, and is not as light as a ZX-10. The C-14's power band is flatter/broader (which is nicer for touring) and it also feels stifled due to the secondary butterflies. One you jump over the 4K RPM hump (flies/correctable) and account for the weight, the C-14 performs very well.
If you don't want comfort, quiet, storage, reliability, and amenities then get a ZX-14 which is a sports bike.
Maxtog, I actually bought exactly what I wanted......something I considered a "middle of the road sport tourer". It's difinatey not a screamer. And somewhat underpowered 1400 cc motorcycle. Didn't say I didn't like it. I actually bought it for many of the reasons that you listed. But I am on my 27th motorcyce and, sorry, but I don't consider the C-14 very powerful for the displacement. And the performance, or lack of, really isn't just an illusion. It's actual numbers.
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And the performance, or lack of, really isn't just an illusion. It's actual numbers.
The actual numbers I have show:
* 156hp@10,500 engine with 136+ to the ground in a 688 pounds (wet) vehicle with 102 ft-lb@6,200
* 0-60 MPH in 2.9 seconds
* 0-100 MPH in 6.8 seconds
* 1/4mi in 10.76@126 MPH
That is great performance for a stock 1352cc sports TOURING bike with flies and pollution controls. So I continue to think you are living in an illusion.
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All this 'power' stuff is relative to what bike you had before the C14. I've always had lower powered bikes. To me, at stock, this bike has tremendous power. If you had a ZX-14, or something similar, before, I could see how it might be a letdown of sorts and you would want to pep it up a bit.
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I agree Jim. After years of airhead BMWs and HDs the stock c14 was the most powerful bike I've owned. I rode it for about two weeks before I started screwing with it.
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Maxtog, I actually bought exactly what I wanted......something I considered a "middle of the road sport tourer". It's difinatey not a screamer. And somewhat underpowered 1400 cc motorcycle. Didn't say I didn't like it. I actually bought it for many of the reasons that you listed. But I am on my 27th motorcyce and, sorry, but I don't consider the C-14 very powerful for the displacement. And the performance, or lack of, really isn't just an illusion. It's actual numbers.
No doubt many sport bikes would smoke the connie but what touring bike has better performance?
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No doubt many sport bikes would smoke the connie but what touring bike has better performance?
This touring bike! ;)
(http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t86/st2sam/Zipporide004.jpg)
I gotta agree with VirginiaJim, "all this power stuff is relative to what bike you had before the C14".
The first time I wrung my C14's neck, it felt like I was dragging an anchor. Now, four years and 45,000mi. later, it feels like a rocket ship! ;D
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The first time I opened up the throttle on the way home from the dealer I felt violated. They have denutted the zx14 WHY? I was within a phone call to purchase a turbo untill I was made aware of the cast pistons. Would anyone on this board not be happy with the bike if it had another 40hp? I think its sad that a 1400 that came from one of the most powerful motorcycles produced can be out run by a 600. The reason I bought this bike and left my c10 was because I rode a zx14 few days before.
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This touring bike! ;)
(http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t86/st2sam/Zipporide004.jpg)
I gotta agree with VirginiaJim, "all this power stuff is relative to what bike you had before the C14".
The first time I wrung my C14's neck, it felt like I was dragging an anchor. Now, four years and 45,000mi. later, it feels like a rocket ship! ;D
Bingo! If you really want ZX14 performance, get a ZX14. Or if you want more touring comfort, get a C14. But because of the shaft drive and more weight the C14 is never going to be as fast as a ZX14. But still about as fast a bike with shaft drive, electric windshield and massive side cases that you can buy. It's all about compromise.
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I want a ZX14 with C14 comfort. It really isn't THAT hard.
I test rode a 2001 GL1800 with 117,000 miles on it Saturday. I know that that the C14 is faster, but at low RPMs - which is where most of us spend the most time, the GL1800 'felt' just as fast. (edit: not fast - quick to 45 and 60) This is a bike that is over 200 lbs heavier.
The C14 is a heavy bike, and to restrict it's output below 6000 RPM just doesn't make sense - unless the decisions was being made by lawyers, accountants, and the EPA (probably all 3).
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I want a ZX14 with C14 comfort. It really isn't THAT hard.
The C14 is a heavy bike, and to restrict it's output below 6000 RPM just doesn't make sense - unless the decisions was being made by lawyers, accountants, and the EPA (probably all 3).
Easily overcome. 45 minutes to yank the flies and install a PCV. Go whole hog, get a full AreaP pipe set, Auto tune, and install a set of ZX14 TBs. Roughly $1500 for a real power increase and in my experience, no downfall (helping the economy one tank at a time). Words do it no justice, ya just have to ride it with the mods to truly appreciate it. As a comparison, take 2 MX bikes, a 250 and a 450. Both have gobs of power, but the torque in the 450 just pulls forever. No waiting for the hit, it's just there.
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while I agree with SoP that you can get more and better power delivery by performing some changes (some of which I did), we are actually fighting what Kawasaki spent millions for. My personal conclusions: a bike this size is not for beginners, yet we get an electronic nanny, space and weight that could've been used for a CC or whatever, or another bit of fuel tank, and leaving the power delivery as it is, thank you very much.
I'll give you an example of another intake system on a bike that could've been great, yet it is insuferable: the K1600 from BMW. It has 1 butterfly (count them: one) feeding the six cylinders. It doesn't have an arrangement in parallel of 6, 3 or 2, because of cost, weight and building space, and it doesn't need butterflies in series because it's computed controlled anyway (with a stepper motor). Yet because the air filter seats so deep in the chassis, there is a long pipe and therefore it takes some time for the column of air to react when the butterfly opens. This translates in a feeling of complete detachment from the throttle input to the engine power delivery, regardless of how well the electronic is programmed (which it is). It's just physics.
Back to the C14, I like this bike a lot, but there were some decisions in the process of making it happen that I don't agree with.
But slow? compared to what, exactly? a Veyron is slow compared to an F-15.
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The first time I opened up the throttle on the way home from the dealer I felt violated. They have denutted the zx14 WHY? I was within a phone call to purchase a turbo untill I was made aware of the cast pistons. Would anyone on this board not be happy with the bike if it had another 40hp? I think its sad that a 1400 that came from one of the most powerful motorcycles produced can be out run by a 600. The reason I bought this bike and left my c10 was because I rode a zx14 few days before.
Before I changed exhaust and did the Flash I rode with a few 600s and they had nowhere near the power of a stock ZG ::) something is wrong somewhere, when I told them I was getting the flash one of them said WHY that thing is a rocket? ?????
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I bought mine late last summer used. It already had a full Muzzy system and a power commander on it. I have no idea what else is done as I have not looked. But I do know that the low end on it is amazing. At low speeds I use 2nd gear just so I'm not jerking around because of the snappyness.
FYI I raced motocross for 15 years, my last MX bike was a YZ400F bored, stroked, ported and milled head. I'm used to quick bikes but this thing is a beast.
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Easily overcome. 45 minutes to yank the flies and install a PCV. Go whole hog, get a full AreaP pipe set, Auto tune, and install a set of ZX14 TBs. Roughly $1500 for a real power increase and in my experience, no downfall (helping the economy one tank at a time). Words do it no justice, ya just have to ride it with the mods to truly appreciate it. As a comparison, take 2 MX bikes, a 250 and a 450. Both have gobs of power, but the torque in the 450 just pulls forever. No waiting for the hit, it's just there.
When I bought mine last year, all these mods had already been done and it is MUCH more powerful than the BMW K1200GT I came off of. The power is awesome! Maybe arguably even a bit much. I've never ridden a bone stock C-14, so I really have no idea what the difference is. This is my 25th bike over the years and I've always been into performance, but I think I've finally reached a point where I'm satisfied. That being said, I also think that at 53 years old and survived some serious crashes, both racing motocross and on the street, I'm about done with my want of "more power". I've hit pavement before. It is HARD and unforgiving. My body still feels the effects every day. It sounds like some of these guys on here hasn't had that unpleasant experience yet. Go ahead, you'll get it one day. Be careful how much power you wish for, you just might get it! LOL! I've already told the wife that the next one in the stable will probably be a full on touring bike. I've reached a point where I have come to the realization that there is NO WAY I can use the power available on this bike 100% and possibly survive. Good luck y'all.
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I did a full dual Muzzys system, pulled the flies, K&N air filter, and PCV with custom map on dyno... doing that added 10% hp. :)
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Jim well said,
Ive had bikes from mopeds to ducati (998) and a lot in between. At 56 my concours is the perfect blend with power and comfort. And i did test drive a 1800, before i bought the c14, no were near the power of the c14 but still a nice bike. maybe for my 60th birthday. or not im really enjoying the concours. its going to be with me for a long time.
Have fun and ride safe.