Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: Poseidon on March 27, 2018, 05:16:10 PM
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Did anyone see this video from Dodge Rider on YouTube? Thought it would be a good opener for a discussion on all the gadgets and electronics. What are your thoughts on it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7k4jHQGs5W0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7k4jHQGs5W0)
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Sounds to me that’s his shtick. Why “X” bikes suck. Aside from the fact he is entirely in love with the sound of his own voice, he really didn’t say anything that proved his point. In fact, the Connie is one of the least gizmo sport tourers out there. And I didn’t see the wheelie he promised, either....
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Sounds to me that’s his shtick. Why “X” bikes suck. Aside from the fact he is entirely in love with the sound of his own voice, he really didn’t say anything that proved his point. In fact, the Connie is one of the least gizmo sport tourers out there. And I didn’t see the wheelie he promised, either....
I agree. ^^^
I've posted several times that the fact that the Concours has fewer electronics than most other sport tours was a selling point for me.
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At least he pronounces the name correctly. Beyond that, he is a dork.
Wrong about the linked brakes, it is not a setting you need to mess with, the two modes are remembered across restarts.
Wrong about the windscreen- it remembers its position (if you choose) and if you don't want to adjust it, then don't. Requires no interaction.
He is wrong about GPS- not included, has nothing do to with the bike at all.
Wrong about heated grips, you can choose to not mess with them at all or just leave them off. Oh, and the setting is remembered.
He doesn't like ABS, because, oh, I guess he is just too cool/expert for that type of thing. Again, nothing distracting, nothing to change or control.
Wrong about vent- no need to mess with it unless you WANT to.
OMG, he has the OPTION to adjust headlights!! Again, why does that interfere with starting a ride? Oh yeah- settings remembered, of course.
Wow- he doesn't want to know what the ambient temp is- THEN DON'T LOOK AT IT.
So, his conclusion- because a sport tourer has lots of nice features [that can be used or ignored], they distract from the "purity" of the "ride". So, I guess one has to be suffering, uncomfortable, and be made inconvenient to be "really" enjoying the ride. He can't control his own desire to make a ride nicer, so the sport-tourer sucks. He is a "real" biker.... a "real man."
::)
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At least he pronounces the name correctly. Beyond that, he is a dork.
It's not very difficult to pronounce Gee Tee Arrr correctly ;)
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Quote from him in the comments section:
These "why x bike sucks" videos aren't meant to be taken seriously. They all have elements of truth in them, but were recorded to be sarcastic commentary.
Apparently, this is what people do for hits these days. Gotta make that 'controversial' money.
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I made it about 3 minutes in before I declared it a complete waste of my time listening to him rant for the sake of trying to be entertaining. There is not an ounce of logic to his position.
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What a moron. Oh dear me, I have too many options! Maybe the dealers should only sell one bike, have them all exactly the same. Then he wouldn't have to make any decisions. No that wouldn't work because he would still have to decide to buy the one bike or not.
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Yeah, but beyond the video and the guy that made it, what are your thought on all the electronics on bikes? How much is too much? What electronics do you wish you could get a Concours with? What do you wish you could get one without?
That is the reason I posted the video. Just to get the discussion started.
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I like the power windshield, electronic ignition, electronic fuel injection, ABS is probably nice. Heated grips and cruise would be OK if it didn't bump the purchase price much. The rest is just noise.
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What a moron. Oh dear me, I have too many options! Maybe the dealers should only sell one bike, have them all exactly the same. Then he wouldn't have to make any decisions. No that wouldn't work because he would still have to decide to buy the one bike or not.
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+1, especially the moron part.
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Yeah, but beyond the video and the guy that made it, what are your thought on all the electronics on bikes? How much is too much? What electronics do you wish you could get a Concours with? What do you wish you could get one without?
That is the reason I posted the video. Just to get the discussion started.
Well to that end, it seems there has been plenty of discussion on the subject of what forum members would like to see on the C-14. The C-14 needs at a minimum, factory cruise control in my opinion. Doubt very highly it will happen ever though.
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Yeah, but beyond the video and the guy that made it, what are your thought on all the electronics on bikes? How much is too much? What electronics do you wish you could get a Concours with? What do you wish you could get one without?
That is the reason I posted the video. Just to get the discussion started.
All is good. I mostly set mine up the way I wanted it and never touched it again. In fact I want more. I want ride modes with ESA. It's why I bought a Multistrada. The only electronics on the C14 I don't like is the way it goes into PANIC mode when the fuel is low or the batteries in the TPMS are low. The flashing waring that requires pushing 2 buttons in the right sequence at the same time is very dangerous IMO. Have it come up for 5 seconds and then just have some small light or icon stay lit would be fine. Or just allow the rider to acknowledge the warning by pushing the menu button on the left handle bar once.
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All is good. I mostly set mine up the way I wanted it and never touched it again. In fact I want more. I want ride modes with ESA. It's why I bought a Multistrada. The only electronics on the C14 I don't like is the way it goes into PANIC mode when the fuel is low or the batteries in the TPMS are low. The flashing waring that requires pushing 2 buttons in the right sequence at the same time is very dangerous IMO. Have it come up for 5 seconds and then just have some small light or icon stay lit would be fine. Or just allow the rider to acknowledge the warning by pushing the menu button on the left handle bar once.
I haven’t seen those warnings yet. Guess I need to read some more of the manual.
I don’t get the rider modes tho. Why not just give full power all the time and let the rider control the power with how much throttle they give it? I don’t understand why anyone would want less power?
My Can Am ATV (1000 cc) came with 2 keys from the factory. One programmed for full power and the other for reduced power and restricted top speed. I didn’t understand the need for that either and promptly had the dealer reprogram the second key unrestricted also. If the bike has too much power for a particular rider, maybe... just maybe... they should get a smaller bike... just saying.
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Yeah, but beyond the video and the guy that made it, what are your thought on all the electronics on bikes?
I *like* all the electronics and features... as long as they are done well and reliable, they are a benefit.
How much is too much?
To me, no such thing, as long as I have my nice, large analog speedometer and tachometer.
What electronics do you wish you could get a Concours with?
Much larger screen, color, with more info displayed at once (so we don't have to flip between screens). Customizable would be even nicer. Would like cruise control added. Would like the fuel indicator MPG left to continue to work all the time with automatic "miles ON reserve" and without the hyperactive "takeover" when low on fuel. Would love auto lean-adjusting headlights or cornering lights. Would like more/wider tail lights (back), and built-in and higher running lights and turn signals (front). LED all around. HUD would be neat, but would be proprietary due to helmet stuff, making it just as useless as factory coms. More slots for different riding modes would be nice (instead of just two).
What do you wish you could get one without?
I wouldn't omit anything. But I would NOT want GPS or communications added, because that technology changes too much and too often- the customer just gets stuck with something obsolete and impossible to update to modern standards.
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I haven’t seen those warnings yet. Guess I need to read some more of the manual.
You haven't been low on fuel yet, then?? Wow- wait and see. Blech! Poor design.
I don’t get the rider modes tho. Why not just give full power all the time and let the rider control the power with how much throttle they give it? I don’t understand why anyone would want less power?
Because
1) You might be riding in poor conditions and just want to be conservative beyond ABS/TC.
2) You might be learning the bike or loaning it to someone and want a "chill" mode.
3) You might want different throttle response (not necessarily "less power").
4) You might want to extend your range and have a safe but extra lean mode (what we have now with FEAM).
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You haven't been low on fuel yet, then?? Wow- wait and see. Blech! Poor design.
Because
1) You might be riding in poor conditions and just want to be conservative beyond ABS/TC.
2) You might be learning the bike or loaning it to someone and want a "chill" mode.
3) You might want different throttle response (not necessarily "less power").
4) You might want to extend your range and have a safe but extra lean mode (what we have now with FEAM).
I haven’t been low on fuel yet. I been pulling in as soon as I see one bar, if not before. I don’t like letting the tank get to low.
1) I thought that was the reason for TC. If it works on that slippery blue tarp like the YouTube videos show, I don’t think I’ll ever need anything more than that! I doubt I will ever be riding in conditions remotely close to being that slick!
2) the Concours is not a bike I would recommend for learning on, or loaning it out to someone that I would be concerned about on it. There are lots of better bikes out there to learn on that don’t need a reduced power mode.
3) Why? Isn’t that what the clutch is for?
4) I haven’t used it yet, but if it works, I could see a need for that, especially when you see those signs out West that say last fuel stop for X number of miles. I’ll give you that one. :)
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1) I thought that was the reason for TC.
Yes and no. There are plenty of other "power" ways you can lose control without it just being broken rear traction.
2) the Concours is not a bike I would recommend for learning on, or loaning it out to someone that I would be concerned about on it.
I agree. But EVERYONE learns to ride a Concours on a Concours. And if you just came up from a 400 pound 250, there is a huge difference.
3) Why? Isn’t that what the clutch is for?
No. Throttle response is how quickly and to what degree the engine reacts to the throttle in all conditions, not just shifting. And the C14's throttle is notoriously "snatchy"- with or without shifting.
There are several good reasons for multiple riding modes- one could also have one that emphasizes low-end power over high-end.... another I didn't put in the list. It isn't just about limiting power, but how and when it is delivered. There are far more USEFUL things I would like to see on the C14, but if we are just talking about things that would/could be useful, I think it is valid. Plus, it costs essentially $0 to have, it is just programming.
Something not mentioned yet- electronically adjustable suspension. To me that is a red herring. Sure, I would like it, but that is one of those things that will REALLY jack up the price of the bike, far more than anything else listed so far.
I would prefer built-in USB charging ports (with option for full-time, timed, or ignition-only), built-in battery trickle charging port, built-in heated clothing connectors, built-in accessible extra wiring panel (front and rear) for extras, far better horns, real theft/tamper alarm system with remote notification. And one neat idea I had a while ago- automatically reversing cooling fans that push heat out the front in hot weather when the bike is stopped (instead of back toward the rider) :)
Most of the other things I would want are not "electronics/electrics" related, so they wouldn't be valid here.
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I'd just like to see a KIPASS mod that sounded the horns, flashed the lights & dashboard warnings and then cut off the engine 30 seconds later if you had left your fob out of range or dropped it :)
A little bit of clever coding would mean it wouldn't trigger on a low battery warning or if the bike had been started with the backup RFCID option.
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The low fuel warning is my greatest pet peeve. No way to clear the “Danger Danger Will Robinson!” mode and see what your range is. I have considered buying that low fuel warning eliminator, but, knowing myself as I do, I’d probably run out of gas! ::)
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Yes and no. There are plenty of other "power" ways you can lose control without it just being broken rear traction.
Like wheelies? TC shuts those down shortly after they start. Braking? ABS takes care of that. Cornering? Neither TC or rider modes are going to help you out there.
I agree. But EVERYONE learns to ride a Concours on a Concours. And if you just came up from a 400 pound 250, there is a huge difference.
That is why they make all those sizes in-between a 250 and a 1400. As long as you keep the RPMs down and don't open the throttle up, the Concours is very mild mannered. So much so, I was going crazy trying to make it thru the break in period! Teach throttle control to new riders instead of trying to idiot proof it with electronics!
No. Throttle response is how quickly and to what degree the engine reacts to the throttle in all conditions, not just shifting. And the C14's throttle is notoriously "snatchy"- with or without shifting.
I was referring to the slow speed stuff, which is what I thought you were referring to as well. I wasn't talking about shifting. Just starting from a start, or slow parking lot maneuvers. Riding the clutch a little to take the jerkiness out of the throttle. You know... the way they did it before rider modes.
There are several good reasons for multiple riding modes- one could also have one that emphasizes low-end power over high-end.... another I didn't put in the list. It isn't just about limiting power, but how and when it is delivered.
You might get some shifting of the power band manipulating the timing with rider modes, but it isn't going to be a significant change. The only way you are going to significantly shift the power band up or down the RPM range is by changing cams. I agree tho, if you could significantly shift the power band it would be helpful. Especially for those that are loaded down for a trip, pulling a trailer, etc.
There are far more USEFUL things I would like to see on the C14, but if we are just talking about things that would/could be useful, I think it is valid. Plus, it costs essentially $0 to have, it is just programming.
Like a supercharged 1400!
Something not mentioned yet- electronically adjustable suspension. To me that is a red herring. Sure, I would like it, but that is one of those things that will REALLY jack up the price of the bike, far more than anything else listed so far.
That is another one that I have no interest in. Just one more very expensive item to go bad that provides no added benefit over having a dial to turn.
I would prefer built-in USB charging ports (with option for full-time, timed, or ignition-only), built-in battery trickle charging port, built-in heated clothing connectors, built-in accessible extra wiring panel (front and rear) for extras, far better horns, real theft/tamper alarm system with remote notification. And one neat idea I had a while ago- automatically reversing cooling fans that push heat out the front in hot weather when the bike is stopped (instead of back toward the rider) :)
Now THOSE are some useful electronics!!!! :thumbs:
Most of the other things I would want are not "electronics/electrics" related, so they wouldn't be valid here.
Post them anyway.
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The low fuel warning is my greatest pet peeve. No way to clear the “Danger Danger Will Robinson!” mode and see what your range is.
Well, that is not quite true. You CAN clear it by pressing both buttons on the dash in a certain order. It then returns almost to normal, although the red light will stay on, the fuel indicator will blink and the range will be blank. The problem is that performing those button presses is difficult and dangerous while moving. But it can be done (I do it all the time).
The reason the range is blank is because it is generally too inaccurate and will lead you into trouble. The best solution is to clear the warning, then reset your B trip meter. Most C14 will go at least 42 miles on the remaining 1.1 or so gallons of gas (if you are driving conservatively)- so you have a very good idea of your limit.
I have considered buying that low fuel warning eliminator, but, knowing myself as I do, I’d probably run out of gas! ::)
That would be my fear- it disables the warning completely AND you have no idea how much gas is left (because the virtual 1.1 gal "reserve" tank no longer exists) AND the range indicator will likely not necessarily be accurate at all. But it does get rid of that horribly, over-the-top alert crap. :)
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Post them anyway.
Oh.... adjustable seat height (with a much lower setting).
Adjustable bars.
Larger and dual "gloveboxes".
Larger fuel tank, by at least one gallon.
Dual kickstands (quad-pod).
Ground lighting at park; probably from mirrors.
Revamped TPS that has external batteries or rechargeable contacts.
Built-in fallover protection.
Smaller active RFID keyfobs.
3 included keyfobs.
Automatic/keyless locks on panniers.
In my case, reverse assist would be nice... but I know that would have very limited appeal. I am usually pretty good at keeping myself out of trouble (learned that pretty quickly with this best and my short legs).
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I have to agree with the OP. My BMW K1, Honda ST 1100 and C14 all sucked. I do not know how I have been able to stand riding them for the last 20 years!!!!!
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He complained several times about too many buttons .uh, there are zero buttons! You have windshield toggle, brake and traction control levers, computer read lever and temperature grip control.
He even threw in rear shock preload!
I don’t think he understands the point of sport tourer. Yes, he went for a ride up a mountain in TN ( they have mountains???), but I do think I have been “one” with my c14. Go on a 2000 mile three week trip on a c14, where everything you got is in that bike and then you might have a better idea.
I like those heated grips, they don’t distract. You know what distracts ? Frozen hands!
I’ve used them down to the mid 20’s.
I have another sport tour- 91 katana 1100, first bike with a power screen. It’s not as fast, gets maybe 42mpg tops, buzzes, not as comfortable. I guess in his world, this would be a better bike. I don’t pose, my bikes are not just for donut runs, I’ve ridden 16 hours straight on both my c14 and my katana 1100, I couldn’t ever do that again on the katana 1100. And I bet mr dodge wouldn’t last four hours on that c14 before he missed his truck or car.
I do have my iPhone mounted where he had gps. I do use the gps on it too. Like I said , I like going on long, multi state drives and it’s useful not getting lost.
Until he goes on a trip so long that he packs laundry pods to wash his clothes every week at whatever motel 6/ super 8 he is holed up, he’s just a poser who belongs on a Burgman scooter.
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I don’t think he understands the point of sport tourer. Yes, he went for a ride up a mountain in TN ( they have mountains???),
Uhm... the Great Smokey Mountains... I also guess you are unaware that a portion one of the most famous "motorcycle roads," Deals Gap, The Dragon, is in Tennessee. Tennessee has great roads for a sport bike. I guess you've never ridden in Tennessee.
As for the "review," yeah, stupid overall, but I am one who agrees on the brakes. I hate linked brakes for a bike intended for sport riding.
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I was being facetious. Most of my riding is in the Sierra Nevadas and the Rockies. I live at 4800’.
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I agree. ^^^
I've posted several times that the fact that the Concours has fewer electronics than most other sport tours was a selling point for me.
Yup. That much less to go wrong.
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I don’t get the rider modes tho. Why not just give full power all the time and let the rider control the power with how much throttle they give it? I don’t understand why anyone would want less power?
On my Ducati I have 4 programable ride modes: Sport, Touring, Urban and Enduro. Besides max power, throttle response, dampening, pre-load, abs and wheelie control are programed differently in each mode. It comes set at the factory but you can individually adjust each of these in each ride mode. Max power is just one aspect of a ride mode.
About 99% of the time I use touring or sport mode which has access to full power output of 152hp. The difference is in touring is a softer ride, full abs, zero wheelie and softer throttle response.
Urban mode has only 100hp with max abs and wheelie. Perfect for rain or wet streets in general.
Enduro mode also only has 100hp, zero abs on the rear and zero wheelie control so you can slip the rear wheel in the dirt to slide around corners (not me but someone who knows what they are doing). I've tried it once or twice but haven't had a chance to really get off road.
You can switch modes at the touch of a button while on the move. And I do. Get into the twisties in the TX hill country pushing it in sport mode but then get onto rough or even dirt road will typically switch to touring. Everything just smooths out.
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I once took the c14 to Bodie, the best ghost town in the country . On the last few miles of road, it’s loose rock/ dirt. The traction control light kept flashing , but I never felt it; the bike was stable and cruised on without any stress.
I passed some HD bikes that lacked TC- they kept their feet out like outriggers and the rear wheels of the bikes were prone to fish tailing.
I love the TC on these bikes .
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I was being facetious. Most of my riding is in the Sierra Nevadas and the Rockies. I live at 4800’.
:finger_fing11:
The older mountains out east make for very nice motorcycle roads.
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Oh.... adjustable seat height (with a much lower setting).
Adjustable bars.
Larger and dual "gloveboxes".
Larger fuel tank, by at least one gallon.
Dual kickstands (quad-pod).
Ground lighting at park; probably from mirrors.
Revamped TPS that has external batteries or rechargeable contacts.
Built-in fallover protection.
Smaller active RFID keyfobs.
3 included keyfobs.
Automatic/keyless locks on panniers.
In my case, reverse assist would be nice... but I know that would have very limited appeal. I am usually pretty good at keeping myself out of trouble (learned that pretty quickly with this best and my short legs).
Nice list. I like the dual glovebox idea. I saw where someone else here posted about trying it. Been thinking about doing it myself ever since.
Larger gas tank and quad-pod I would use too. Not sure about the rest tho. I’m still too new to the bike to say for sure.
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On my Ducati I have 4 programable ride modes: Sport, Touring, Urban and Enduro. Besides max power, throttle response, dampening, pre-load, abs and wheelie control are programed differently in each mode. It comes set at the factory but you can individually adjust each of these in each ride mode. Max power is just one aspect of a ride mode.
About 99% of the time I use touring or sport mode which has access to full power output of 152hp. The difference is in touring is a softer ride, full abs, zero wheelie and softer throttle response.
Urban mode has only 100hp with max abs and wheelie. Perfect for rain or wet streets in general.
Enduro mode also only has 100hp, zero abs on the rear and zero wheelie control so you can slip the rear wheel in the dirt to slide around corners (not me but someone who knows what they are doing). I've tried it once or twice but haven't had a chance to really get off road.
You can switch modes at the touch of a button while on the move. And I do. Get into the twisties in the TX hill country pushing it in sport mode but then get onto rough or even dirt road will typically switch to touring. Everything just smooths out.
Besides the enduro mode, (which I will never need on the Concours) couldn’t all of the other modes be accomplished by twisting the preload dial, throttle control, and TC either on or off? I don’t see where all of those ectra electronics are needed. Just one more thing to go wrong and adds a lot of expense to the cost of the bike and repairs. That’s money that could be spent on mods or trips... or a dirt bike for those off road excursions!
To me, decreasing HP is pointless. Make the power on the bike linear and don’t twist the throttle so far. There you go, less HP! Peak HP and peak torque numbers are obtained at wide open throttle. You are not going to see numbers nearly that high at 10% or 20% throttle. The fact that the computer is cutting power by 1/3 in some of those modes means absolutely nothing unless you are running wide open throttle at the rpm where peak power is being made.
I see most of these rider modes as a gimmick and a way to charge more for the bike, more for replacement parts, and more for repairs. A lot of people seem to be falling for... I mean... like it tho. To each there own I guess.
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Besides the enduro mode, (which I will never need on the Concours) couldn’t all of the other modes be accomplished by twisting the preload dial, throttle control, and TC either on or off? I don’t see where all of those ectra electronics are needed. Just one more thing to go wrong and adds a lot of expense to the cost of the bike and repairs. That’s money that could be spent on mods or trips... or a dirt bike for those off road excursions!
To me, decreasing HP is pointless. Make the power on the bike linear and don’t twist the throttle so far. There you go, less HP! Peak HP and peak torque numbers are obtained at wide open throttle. You are not going to see numbers nearly that high at 10% or 20% throttle. The fact that the computer is cutting power by 1/3 in some of those modes means absolutely nothing unless you are running wide open throttle at the rpm where peak power is being made.
I see most of these rider modes as a gimmick and a way to charge more for the bike, more for replacement parts, and more for repairs. A lot of people seem to be falling for... I mean... like it tho. To each there own I guess.
I see in your signature you have or have had 4 different bikes. Why? Why not buy just the one bike? Wouldn't that be a lot simpler? Or perhaps you enjoy riding different styles and bikes with different feel to it. I do that with a touch of a button. Completely different bike.
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I see in your signature you have or have had 4 different bikes. Why? Why not buy just the one bike? Wouldn't that be a lot simpler? Or perhaps you enjoy riding different styles and bikes with different feel to it. I do that with a touch of a button. Completely different bike.
M109R is more of a show bike, bike night, fat tire muscle cruiser. I still ride it to the mountains occasionally as well. Walk around video of it in the link below. Has air ride on a remote - demo at 1:10. I did the entire build myself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_2czfz8pT0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_2czfz8pT0)
Victory Magnum is a lazyboy on wheels. Long distance bagger that handles as good if not better than any other cruiser I know of. It sees most of the longer trips and 2 up riding. It has cams and several other performance mods. Dyno was just a hair under 120hp/120ft#. It has a 600 watt Arc audio system in it. Built that one myself too. I still have more parts and mods I plan to do to it.
(http://www.thevog.net/data/photos/l/48/48321-1492493199-bc899846e1b9a676f3e11e99b656262b.jpg)
The Concours, I bought primarily for day trips to the mountains. Comfortable two hour ride out there, sport bike performance and handling once I'm there, and a comfortable ride back home. I also got it so I would always have something to ride while I'm doing more mods to the other two bikes.
The Spyder is my wife's bike. I jump on it for a little ride every once in a while. I don't ride it far because I have it set up for her. (she is about a foot shorter than me so it is a little cramped for me to ride it.)
(http://www.thevog.net/attachments/img_4702-jpg.357769/)
So the short version is I have a show bike, a performance bagger with a stereo, (both totally different riding position than the Concours) and a sport tour. I don't think a riding mode will be able to make those kinds of changes.
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So the short version is I have a show bike, a performance bagger with a stereo, (both totally different riding position than the Concours) and a sport tour. I don't think a riding mode will be able to make those kinds of changes.
To a small extent it does. Most summers I do a long trip somewhere (usually in the Rocky Mountains). Getting there for me is a long trip across TX. Putting the Multistrada in touring mode soaks up all the bumps unlike the C14 (no matter what pre-load setting) or even my Valkyrie ever could. I get to the twisty bits in the mountains, push a button and it feels is a hard core sport bike. On one trip we were on a small road along the Colorado/Wyoming border and it turned to dirt and we rode 30 miles on dirt with some mud. I was on the C14 and not loving it. Now I'm l looking forward to doing something like that again on the Multi with Enduro mode. And having less top end power does help a novice like me modulate rear wheel spin on traction compromised roads. But like you said, to each his own. I like all your bikes! So many bikes, so little time!
One last thing, bang for the buck, the C14 wins hands down.
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I agree that a good adjustable suspension goes a long way for comfort. I have that with all three of my bikes. Air ride on the M109R has adjustable pre-load and rebound all controlled with air. It’s range goes from riding on a cloud to firm just by adding or removing air.
Magnum has air adjustable coil over. Air is just for pre-load depending on how much weight is on the bike. In the bags, passenger, etc.
I mod my bikes for the most power and best throttle response I can get. I added a quarter turn throttle ring to the Magnum to make the throttle more responsive and make it so you don’t have to twist it so far for full throttle. Stock was almost 180 degrees. Now it is about 90 degrees to full throttle. I have as much power as I am going to get without moving up to a big bore or a super charger (which has crossed my mind several times).
The M109R is a performance beast to begin with. I’ve done about as much as is available for it from a performance standpoint.
I’m sure I’ll get there with the Concours too, eventually. I can’t leave anything alone.
My point to all of this is that I have never been on a bike and thought to myself... I wish it had less power. ...or I wish it was less responsive. And, I don’t need a computer and buttons in order to have a great adjustable suspension. Rider modes won’t change the seating position or where the controls are located, or the looks and sound of the bike. That is the reason why I own as many bikes as I do. For off road, I have ATVs, but I do enjoy dirt bikes too. I just don’t have any right now.
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Yes most of us do love performance in our bikes, and can't conceive of a riding mode that reduces power.
However on a touring bike, and most C14s are touring some of the time, one can encounter various weather phenomena (heavy rain, sleet, hail). The rider(s) may be in variable states of fatigue (long day in the saddle due too unforeseen detour) and or distraction (GPS routing isn't agreeing with that rough idea in the back of your head of today's route), and perhaps the person sitting on the pillion may have gained a few pounds since your last ride together, and in addition would like for you reroute to find a public bathroom post haste?
These factors might make you wish you had a "rain" setting and high sensitivity Traction Control setting or some such on your bike to protect yourself from the usually embraced high performance.
Perhaps a softer on the fly suspension setting would be appreciated by the person on the pillion to avoid any seepage on the large bumps during the search for an acceptable public convenience.
Un-needed luxuries some would say, safety enhancements would say others. Different strokes say I.
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Yes most of us do love performance in our bikes, and can't conceive of a riding mode that reduces power.
However on a touring bike, and most C14s are touring some of the time, one can encounter various weather phenomena (heavy rain, sleet, hail). The rider(s) may be in variable states of fatigue (long day in the saddle due too unforeseen detour) and or distraction (GPS routing isn't agreeing with that rough idea in the back of your head of today's route), and perhaps the person sitting on the pillion may have gained a few pounds since your last ride together, and in addition would like for you reroute to find a public bathroom post haste?
These factors might make you wish you had a "rain" setting and high sensitivity Traction Control setting or some such on your bike to protect yourself from the usually embraced high performance.
Perhaps a softer on the fly suspension setting would be appreciated by the person on the pillion to avoid any seepage on the large bumps during the search for an acceptable public convenience.
Un-needed luxuries some would say, safety enhancements would say others. Different strokes say I.
I must be an odd ball then. If I get caught in the rain, I either change my route to ride around it, pull off and wait for it to pass, or haul ass thru it. I was on my M109R in the worst rain I ever rode in. It was a complete down pour. I’m talking Monsoon category rain (no wind) that we got caught in on a group ride. The rest of the group was content riding the back roads back to the hotel we were staying at. After about 20 to 30 mins of riding at a snails pace, soaked to the bone, I saw that there was an enterence to the interstate up ahead. I got the attention of some of the others in the group and motioned that I was going to split off and take the interstate back to the hotel. Rode 75-80 all the way back. Beat the group back by over an hour. They were all complaining about how long they were stuck in the rain. All I had to complain about was how rain that hard feels at 80mph with a t-shirt and half helmet on! Those fat Metzeler’s have excellent wet traction and never once hydroplaned. So again, not even on that ride did I ever wish I had less power.
Sleet and hail? I can say with 99.999% certainty that I will never be out on a bike in that kind of weather. I watch the weather and the radar too much for that. If there is a chance of that kind of weather, I’m either rerouting around it or just not riding that day! If anyone else rides in that stuff, you are a better man than me! No thank you!!!
When nature calls... that is what Mother Nature made trees and bushes for!
GPS takes me the wrong way, I’ll make a U-Turn. No option but to ride the gravel, I ended up doing that on the BRP last summer when they tar and chipped the road. Had 3-4 inches of chip gravel on the road and the group I was riding with were determined to make it to peaks of Otter for lunch. Rode about 20 miles thru that stuff. If it was just me, I would have turned around and gone somewhere else. TC would have been handy on that ride, but I managed just fine with good throttle control.
Short of riding on Ice, which I would never do on 2 wheels, I do not see a practical need for rider modes. If that 0.001% chance ever occurs, maybe I will wish I had it. Right now, I don’t see it happening. Like I said, maybe I’m the only odd ball that feels that way, but it is my oppinion on it and that is all that matters... at least to me anyway! lol
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I must be an odd ball then. If I get caught in the rain, I either change my route to ride around it, pull off and wait for it to pass, or haul ass thru it. I was on my M109R in the worst rain I ever rode in. It was a complete down pour. I’m talking Monsoon category rain (no wind) that we got caught in on a group ride. The rest of the group was content riding the back roads back to the hotel we were staying at. After about 20 to 30 mins of riding at a snails pace, soaked to the bone, I saw that there was an enterence to the interstate up ahead. I got the attention of some of the others in the group and motioned that I was going to split off and take the interstate back to the hotel. Rode 75-80 all the way back. Beat the group back by over an hour. They were all complaining about how long they were stuck in the rain. All I had to complain about was how rain that hard feels at 80mph with a t-shirt and half helmet on! Those fat Metzeler’s have excellent wet traction and never once hydroplaned. So again, not even on that ride did I ever wish I had less power.
Sleet and hail? I can say with 99.999% certainty that I will never be out on a bike in that kind of weather. I watch the weather and the radar too much for that. If there is a chance of that kind of weather, I’m either rerouting around it or just not riding that day! If anyone else rides in that stuff, you are a better man than me! No thank you!!!
When nature calls... that is what Mother Nature made trees and bushes for!
GPS takes me the wrong way, I’ll make a U-Turn. No option but to ride the gravel, I ended up doing that on the BRP last summer when they tar and chipped the road. Had 3-4 inches of chip gravel on the road and the group I was riding with were determined to make it to peaks of Otter for lunch. Rode about 20 miles thru that stuff. If it was just me, I would have turned around and gone somewhere else. TC would have been handy on that ride, but I managed just fine with good throttle control.
Short of riding on Ice, which I would never do on 2 wheels, I do not see a practical need for rider modes. If that 0.001% chance ever occurs, maybe I will wish I had it. Right now, I don’t see it happening. Like I said, maybe I’m the only odd ball that feels that way, but it is my oppinion on it and that is all that matters... at least to me anyway! lol
You're not an odd ball, man. You're just old school.
My friend has a 14 Kawi Ninja 1000 (sport tourer, not ZX-10R) that has low power mode. He's had it on twice. Once on the ride home from the dealer, his previous bike being an 02 Magna and so wanting to go easy on a more powerful bike. The other time is when I played a joke on him and put it on at a gas stop. Other than that he's never had the inclination, no matter the weather.
He's not alone. My other bike is a 16 Aprilia Tuono. The 11-15s (in USA) had a rain mode. They removed it for the 1100cc refresh. (Used to be 1000cc) They did so because their research said that no one used a low power mode.
That said, the ride modes, while not altering power, do alter engine braking and throttle response. Each mode is quite different, as such I use them in various situations. As I do for the 8 mode TC, 3 mode +off ABS, and 3 mode +off wheelie control. I dont view these nannies as 'one more thing to break.' They're lines of code in the ECU, same as the lauch control. In my view more options is good. If I want raw, untamed savagery I turn eveything off. (A bit different with ESA and ESA II suspension, though.)
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You're not an odd ball, man. You're just old school.
My friend has a 14 Kawi Ninja 1000 (sport tourer, not ZX-10R) that has low power mode. He's had it on twice. Once on the ride home from the dealer, his previous bike being an 02 Magna and so wanting to go easy on a more powerful bike. The other time is when I played a joke on him and put it on at a gas stop. Other than that he's never had the inclination, no matter the weather.
He's not alone. My other bike is a 16 Aprilia Tuono. The 11-15s (in USA) had a rain mode. They removed it for the 1100cc refresh. (Used to be 1000cc) They did so because their research said that no one used a low power mode.
That said, the ride modes, while not altering power, do alter engine braking and throttle response. Each mode is quite different, as such I use them in various situations. As I do for the 8 mode TC, 3 mode +off ABS, and 3 mode +off wheelie control. I dont view these nannies as 'one more thing to break.' They're lines of code in the ECU, same as the lauch control. In my view more options is good. If I want raw, untamed savagery I turn eveything off. (A bit different with ESA and ESA II suspension, though.)
Wait... What? Did I read that correctly? EIGHT modes for traction control?!?! Was that a typo? How could anyone possibly need 8 modes of TC?
...and 3 modes of wheelie control? Does it measure the distance the front wheel lifts off the ground or something? Why so many? Don't you either want it to wheelie or not? I would think on and off would be sufficient for those that want it.
I just hate where all of this is headed. The manufacturers, if they actually succeed at what they are attempting to do with all of the rider aids, are going to make it to where no actual skill is needed to ride a motorcycle. After that It is going to be like that motorcycle Honda made a while back that rides its self. Just jump on and tell it where you want to go, sit back with you cell phone and start texting while you are chauffeured around by your bike. When you are not on it, the bike just follows you around like a lost puppy until you are ready to ride. When I saw that video, I was wondering if the bike would heal, sit, roll over, speak, etc. lol
Their is more involved than just lines of code in the ECU. Some bikes have separate ECUs for all of the electronic items. There has to be sensors to feed the info to the ECU, additional wiring harnesses, actuators, relays, etc. And for those that like those push button adjustable suspensions... Do a price check on what a replacement is going to cost you. Do you realize what kind of custom suspension you could get from say Traxxion for that kind of money? Might even have some money left over in some cases.
I guess I am old school. At the same time tho, I do see the benefit in some new technologies, just not the unnecessary ones, or the ones that take away from being an active participant in the ride! For example, I see benefit in TC, ABS, fuel injection, GPS, LED lighting, etc.
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The manufacturers, if they actually succeed at what they are attempting to do with all of the rider aids, are going to make it to where no actual skill is needed to ride a motorcycle.
You and I do view the various electronic aids differently, and that's OK (you ol' oddball you ;D ) but never fear, what you are worried about in the above quote will never happen. Even with all the rider modes, turning/leaning multi mode traction control, dual clutch automatic transmissions, only a very small percentage of people will have the skill set to ride, or want to ride a motorcycle. I think when motorcyclists talk to other motorcyclists they forget how much skill they have compared to the average cage driver. With automatic transmissions, climate control, almost completely level vehicle, many cage drivers can't even stay in their own lane when making a left turn in either lane of a dual left turn lane intersection. Half of the ones that can do it successfully, have their tongue sticking out the corner of their mouth similar to a 4 year old trying to color inside the lines. It may sound like I'm making motorcyclists out as elites of skill and coordination, and that's not my intent. However we do take some of our skills, even at the beginning level, for granted and we can sometimes think that most drivers have these basic skills that we do. They don't. Many cagers cannot even adjust their mirrors correctly to minimize the size of any blind spots. Way too many adjust their side mirrors so they can see the side of their car, leaving huge blind spots from 3 o'clock to 5 o'clock and 7 o'clock to 9 o'clock. Even that assumes that they have 180 degrees of view ahead with their peripheral vision, which many do not, either actually (when tested) or even less perceptively when driving.
If you don't believe me about the general driving public's skill levels, then someday when the weather is nice, go park at a corner gas station of a busy intersection and just watch traffic flow for an hour. I think you'll be amazed at what you observe. Maybe come away a little bit scared too. :yikes:
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However we do take some of our skills, even at the beginning level, for granted and we can sometimes think that most drivers have these basic skills that we do.
I've always said that everybody should learn to ride a motorcycle and ride it for at least a year before being allowed anywhere near a car :)
I am aware this is not practicable :(
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FM, and Poseidon -- have thoroughly enjoyed this discussion.
While I've been riding for many years, I don't consider myself a super-skilled rider. I've had the basic safety courses and can maneuver and handle my bike OK, but I am definitely not tuned in to the point where I need (or could even begin to recognize) those various riding modes -- eight or sixteen or whatever that number is. I don't wheelie, I don't grandstand, I'm just happy to ride a line through a curve and emerge thrilled on the other end.
I initially learned to ride (one never really stops learning, right?) on a 1965 Honda S-90. That thing had a throttle, brakes, clutch, shifter, and hopefully gas in the tank. I was fine with that.
Fast forward to 2018 when we've got cell phones that will make pancakes, shovel the snow off your walk, and allow you to lose yourself for hours. (For the record, I hate my cell phone.)
Most of me sides with Poseidon -- if you want to ride the damned thing, ride it. If you want to play with it, well, that's an option too.
But most of all, I appreciate this discussion. Helps me realize where I am in this world and how much of it I completely reject.
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You and I do view the various electronic aids differently, and that's OK (you ol' oddball you ;D ) but never fear, what you are worried about in the above quote will never happen. Even with all the rider modes, turning/leaning multi mode traction control, dual clutch automatic transmissions, only a very small percentage of people will have the skill set to ride, or want to ride a motorcycle. I think when motorcyclists talk to other motorcyclists they forget how much skill they have compared to the average cage driver. With automatic transmissions, climate control, almost completely level vehicle, many cage drivers can't even stay in their own lane when making a left turn in either lane of a dual left turn lane intersection. Half of the ones that can do it successfully, have their tongue sticking out the corner of their mouth similar to a 4 year old trying to color inside the lines. It may sound like I'm making motorcyclists out as elites of skill and coordination, and that's not my intent. However we do take some of our skills, even at the beginning level, for granted and we can sometimes think that most drivers have these basic skills that we do. They don't. Many cagers cannot even adjust their mirrors correctly to minimize the size of any blind spots. Way too many adjust their side mirrors so they can see the side of their car, leaving huge blind spots from 3 o'clock to 5 o'clock and 7 o'clock to 9 o'clock. Even that assumes that they have 180 degrees of view ahead with their peripheral vision, which many do not, either actually (when tested) or even less perceptively when driving.
If you don't believe me about the general driving public's skill levels, then someday when the weather is nice, go park at a corner gas station of a busy intersection and just watch traffic flow for an hour. I think you'll be amazed at what you observe. Maybe come away a little bit scared too. :yikes:
Although not available yet to the general public, it already has happened!
Here is Honda's version. (The lost puppy I was referring to earlier)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qGX3rn3s0I (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qGX3rn3s0I)
Here is BMW's version.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0W8p9Pc7VUQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0W8p9Pc7VUQ)
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I've always said that everybody should learn to ride a motorcycle and ride it for at least a year before being allowed anywhere near a car :)
I am aware this is not practicable :(
I have said the same thing.
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FM, and Poseidon -- have thoroughly enjoyed this discussion.
While I've been riding for many years, I don't consider myself a super-skilled rider. I've had the basic safety courses and can maneuver and handle my bike OK, but I am definitely not tuned in to the point where I need (or could even begin to recognize) those various riding modes -- eight or sixteen or whatever that number is. I don't wheelie, I don't grandstand, I'm just happy to ride a line through a curve and emerge thrilled on the other end.
I initially learned to ride (one never really stops learning, right?) on a 1965 Honda S-90. That thing had a throttle, brakes, clutch, shifter, and hopefully gas in the tank. I was fine with that.
Fast forward to 2018 when we've got cell phones that will make pancakes, shovel the snow off your walk, and allow you to lose yourself for hours. (For the record, I hate my cell phone.)
Most of me sides with Poseidon -- if you want to ride the damned thing, ride it. If you want to play with it, well, that's an option too.
But most of all, I appreciate this discussion. Helps me realize where I am in this world and how much of it I completely reject.
It's good to know that I am not alone here! :thumbs:
If you have been riding for any decent length of time, which I am assuming you have based on the age of the Honda you started on, You have a lot more road skills than you give yourself credit for. Just like Marty said above, there are skill sets that a rider will learn to survive on the road. Most of us incorrectly assume that everyone on the road has these skills as well. I spend a large portion of my day driving from one location to another for work (around 40k caged miles a year). I see how bad (or distracted) most drivers are on a daily bases.
One perfect example of a skill I think most riders learn early on and take for granted is reading traffic. Actually seeing and identifying those drivers you need to pay close attention to. Watching what cars are doing way ahead of you is another. How many times have you noticed that traffic is slowing down way ahead of you, yet the car in front of you seems to oblivious to the quickly approaching brake lights from the other cars? Also, we tend to have a better idea of what the car behind us is doing. There are lots of other examples as well.
The bike handling skills just come with practice, but they need to be maintained with practice as well. Never hurts to pull into an empty parking lot for some figure 8's every now and then! Sign up for the advanced rider course. It is fun and regardless how long you have been riding, you will learn a thing or two and build a lot of confidence in your riding skills.
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Although not available yet to the general public, it already has happened!
Here is Honda's version. (The lost puppy I was referring to earlier)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qGX3rn3s0I (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qGX3rn3s0I)
Here is BMW's version.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0W8p9Pc7VUQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0W8p9Pc7VUQ)
I would be more impressed with the Honda if they had the confidence to take the stabilisers off ;)
As for that idiot from BMW " In the future we envisage riders not wearing helmets but instead wearing smart spectacles"
Really? and how are they going to stop you hurting your noggin if you come off?
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I would be more impressed with the Honda if they had the confidence to take the stabilisers off ;)
As for that idiot from BMW " In the future we envisage riders not wearing helmets but instead wearing smart spectacles"
Really? and how are they going to stop you hurting your noggin if you come off?
Here is another video of the Honda with no stabilizers.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=VH60-R8MOKo (https://youtube.com/watch?v=VH60-R8MOKo)
As for the BMW, I think they are trying to stress how safe they have made motorcycling.
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Here is another video of the Honda with no stabilizers.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=VH60-R8MOKo (https://youtube.com/watch?v=VH60-R8MOKo)
As for the BMW, I think they are trying to stress how safe they have made motorcycling.
Ok that's more impressive.
Next I would like to see how far off centre you can push it and it recovers :)
As for BMW they obvioulsy havent taken into account the other idiots on the roads trying to kill you.
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here you go... http://litmotors.com/ (http://litmotors.com/)
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Honda: :thumbs: So variable valve timing is OK, but variable trail (https://youtu.be/zY1l6FdNgfA) is crossing the line? I'd love to have this on my C14. I bet most Connie Droppers Anonymous members would like it as well.....depending on cost of course. 8)
BMW: :pukeface:
litmotors: :thumbdown (reserve yours now with a big $$$$ deposit quickly, before we go belly up)
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Not to worry ...chicoms to the rescue... https://electrek.co/2016/06/14/chinese-copycat-lit-motors-self-balancing-2-wheel-electric-vehicle/
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Honda: :thumbs: So variable valve timing is OK, but variable trail (https://youtu.be/zY1l6FdNgfA) is crossing the line?
DEFINITELY crossing the line!
BMW: :pukeface:
I agree
litmotors: :thumbdown (reserve yours now with a big $$$$ deposit quickly, before we go belly up)
I agree... if we are lucky!
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Not to worry ...chicoms to the rescue... https://electrek.co/2016/06/14/chinese-copycat-lit-motors-self-balancing-2-wheel-electric-vehicle/
Hopefully it is for the Japanese market only. Japanese companies do that a lot. Hopefully this is one of those times!
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I made it about 3 minutes in before I declared it a complete waste of my time listening to him rant for the sake of trying to be entertaining. There is not an ounce of logic to his position.
Agreed...what a cock he is
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Wait... What? Did I read that correctly? EIGHT modes for traction control?!?! Was that a typo? How could anyone possibly need 8 modes of TC?
...and 3 modes of wheelie control? Does it measure the distance the front wheel lifts off the ground or something? Why so many? Don't you either want it to wheelie or not? I would think on and off would be sufficient for those that want it.
I just hate where all of this is headed. The manufacturers, if they actually succeed at what they are attempting to do with all of the rider aids, are going to make it to where no actual skill is needed to ride a motorcycle. After that It is going to be like that motorcycle Honda made a while back that rides its self. Just jump on and tell it where you want to go, sit back with you cell phone and start texting while you are chauffeured around by your bike. When you are not on it, the bike just follows you around like a lost puppy until you are ready to ride. When I saw that video, I was wondering if the bike would heal, sit, roll over, speak, etc. lol
Their is more involved than just lines of code in the ECU. Some bikes have separate ECUs for all of the electronic items. There has to be sensors to feed the info to the ECU, additional wiring harnesses, actuators, relays, etc. And for those that like those push button adjustable suspensions... Do a price check on what a replacement is going to cost you. Do you realize what kind of custom suspension you could get from say Traxxion for that kind of money? Might even have some money left over in some cases.
I guess I am old school. At the same time tho, I do see the benefit in some new technologies, just not the unnecessary ones, or the ones that take away from being an active participant in the ride! For example, I see benefit in TC, ABS, fuel injection, GPS, LED lighting, etc.
Yes, 8 is too much, I agree. Off is option 9. 1-3 make it so the rear needs to kick out pretty good before intervention (like Kawi mode 1), 4-6 are 'some' detection of slip and it slowly kicks in cutting/firing ignition, fuel and timing (Like Kawi mode 2) and 7-8 are rain/sissy mode that make the bike pretty much in a purring kitty cat, incapable of being accelerated hard. (Like Kawi mode 3) They'd be better of with 3-4 modes +off, but this bike is all about squeezing that extra second off of the lap time. (Even though it's not a race replica, it's the most aggressive super naked.)
Wheelie mode does know the angle of the bike, yes. The bike has an IMU (inertial measurement unit) that knows the lean angle, pitch, yaw, height etc of the bike. Mode 3 lets the least amount of lift, for the least amount of time, while 1 lets you get a foot in the air for up to 5 seconds or so. Off? With the power of that bike? Off is 'show off' mode.
Agreed that it's going to be ridiculous to see some guy riding down the road on his bike with his head buried in the cell phone. Kinda like this guy... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QE3XsZaL-zo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QE3XsZaL-zo)
It's true there is more wiring and what-have-you on the new bikes with ECUs/IMUs and the like, but the my bike is fuggin Italian. If the spaghetti electrics on my Tuono can hold, I have little concern about a Japanese bike's ECU/IMUs/Sensors etc lasting a good while. (Or maybe that's just blind faith.)
That said, as I mentioned earlier...you can turn all of this crap off. If you want to tell the people at the gas station/forums/bike meet that you're a 'REAL' rider in full control of your ****, tell them that all of the aides are turned off. Congrats, you now have a screaming hellcat of a bike that you have to tame, instead of a purring kitten in full on nanny mode.
...since you love over the top electrics. The Tuono (and RSV4) come with a 'calibration' mode for when you change tires or sprockets. You're to get to this mode in the menus and run the bike at 24mph in 2nd gear until 'calibrate' disappears on the dash. The purpose of it is, via Aprilia manual, THE CALIBRATION OPERATION IS USEFUL FOR OPTIMIZING OPERATION OF THE a-PRC IN CASE OF VARIATION OF THE TIRE TYPE AND THE END TRANSMISSION RATIO (PINIONSPROCKET). IF TIRES DIFFER FROM THOSE INDICATED IN THE USER AND SERVICE MANUAL ARE BEING USED, IN ORDER TO OBTAIN THE SAME PERFORMANCE FROM THE ATC SYSTEM, IT MAY BE NECESSARY TO MODIFY THE SETTINGS OF THE SYSTEM ITSELF.
Oh, and self-cancelling turn signals. (And they don't even consider that a feature.)
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I wish I had auto turn signals on my c14. My ‘84 Suzuki Madura 1200 had them and hey, that was 34 years ago!
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Yes, 8 is too much, I agree. Off is option 9. 1-3 make it so the rear needs to kick out pretty good before intervention (like Kawi mode 1), 4-6 are 'some' detection of slip and it slowly kicks in cutting/firing ignition, fuel and timing (Like Kawi mode 2) and 7-8 are rain/sissy mode that make the bike pretty much in a purring kitty cat, incapable of being accelerated hard. (Like Kawi mode 3) They'd be better of with 3-4 modes +off, but this bike is all about squeezing that extra second off of the lap time. (Even though it's not a race replica, it's the most aggressive super naked.)
Wheelie mode does know the angle of the bike, yes. The bike has an IMU (inertial measurement unit) that knows the lean angle, pitch, yaw, height etc of the bike. Mode 3 lets the least amount of lift, for the least amount of time, while 1 lets you get a foot in the air for up to 5 seconds or so. Off? With the power of that bike? Off is 'show off' mode.
Agreed that it's going to be ridiculous to see some guy riding down the road on his bike with his head buried in the cell phone. Kinda like this guy... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QE3XsZaL-zo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QE3XsZaL-zo)
It's true there is more wiring and what-have-you on the new bikes with ECUs/IMUs and the like, but the my bike is fuggin Italian. If the spaghetti electrics on my Tuono can hold, I have little concern about a Japanese bike's ECU/IMUs/Sensors etc lasting a good while. (Or maybe that's just blind faith.)
That said, as I mentioned earlier...you can turn all of this crap off. If you want to tell the people at the gas station/forums/bike meet that you're a 'REAL' rider in full control of your ****, tell them that all of the aides are turned off. Congrats, you now have a screaming hellcat of a bike that you have to tame, instead of a purring kitten in full on nanny mode.
...since you love over the top electrics. The Tuono (and RSV4) come with a 'calibration' mode for when you change tires or sprockets. You're to get to this mode in the menus and run the bike at 24mph in 2nd gear until 'calibrate' disappears on the dash. The purpose of it is, via Aprilia manual, THE CALIBRATION OPERATION IS USEFUL FOR OPTIMIZING OPERATION OF THE a-PRC IN CASE OF VARIATION OF THE TIRE TYPE AND THE END TRANSMISSION RATIO (PINIONSPROCKET). IF TIRES DIFFER FROM THOSE INDICATED IN THE USER AND SERVICE MANUAL ARE BEING USED, IN ORDER TO OBTAIN THE SAME PERFORMANCE FROM THE ATC SYSTEM, IT MAY BE NECESSARY TO MODIFY THE SETTINGS OF THE SYSTEM ITSELF.
Oh, and self-cancelling turn signals. (And they don't even consider that a feature.)
Ok, I definitely need to dig back into the owners manual. We have 3 TC modes on the Concours? I thought it was just on or off.
Your Aprilia is a bit over the top in electronics for me.
I hope I never end up driving in India! When cars start lane splitting it’s time to get off the road!!!
My Magnum has self canceling turn signals. I can deal with those, although, they are a PITA when they turn off on their own before you have made your turn and you have to turn them back on. I would rather just push the button and turn them off myself when I’m ready. I can take them or leave them.
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Ok, I definitely need to dig back into the owners manual. We have 3 TC modes on the Concours? I thought it was just on or off.
You are correct, only on or off; which I guess could be considered two modes. He might have been comparing to another Kawasaki model.
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Ok, I definitely need to dig back into the owners manual. We have 3 TC modes on the Concours? I thought it was just on or off.
Your Aprilia is a bit over the top in electronics for me.
I hope I never end up driving in India! When cars start lane splitting it’s time to get off the road!!!
My Magnum has self canceling turn signals. I can deal with those, although, they are a PITA when they turn off on their own before you have made your turn and you have to turn them back on. I would rather just push the button and turn them off myself when I’m ready. I can take them or leave them.
I'm sorry, I meant to type N1K having 3 TC modes.
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here you go... http://litmotors.com/ (http://litmotors.com/)
litmotors: :thumbdown (reserve yours now with a big $$$$ deposit quickly, before we go belly up)
Did either of you see this article? Looks like the owner of Lit Motors is trying to get more funding.
https://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/could-this-lawsuit-affect-track-days-and-club-racing?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=3/31/2018_CT&utm_term=Common%20Tread%20%7C%20Combined (https://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/could-this-lawsuit-affect-track-days-and-club-racing?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=3/31/2018_CT&utm_term=Common%20Tread%20%7C%20Combined)
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Looks like he needs to move to self balancing cars.
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I wish I had auto turn signals on my c14. My ‘84 Suzuki Madura 1200 had them and hey, that was 34 years ago!
My 78 KZ1000 Z1R TC had them too, and that was 40 years ago! ::)
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My 78 KZ1000 Z1R TC had them too, and that was 40 years ago! ::)
My 1980 440LTD had them. C’mon Kawasaki... :doh:
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Looks like he needs to move to self balancing cars.
Isn't that what he is already doing? Looks like a 2 wheeled car to me!
(http://litmotors.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/new-design-rounded.jpg)
(http://litmotors.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/c102.jpg)
(https://images.hgmsites.net/med/lit-motors-c1_100461112_m.jpg)