Author Topic: Air Filter  (Read 12494 times)

Offline thundermax

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 78
  • Country: us
Air Filter
« on: November 19, 2012, 10:39:53 AM »
Anyone use a HiFlo filter, HFA2916? Look to be $26 + s&h.
Riding 46 years. In order, 1958 Cushman 721 Highlander, 1960 Cushman Super Eagle, 1971 Honda SL 100, 1974 Yamaha RD 350, 1975 Honda 750 Four, 1971 Honda SL 175, 1998 Yamaha Vmax, 2005 Yamaha Vmax, 2009 Kawasaki Concours 1400, 2012 Kawasaki Concours Arabian Red.

Offline ljcorby

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 439
  • Country: us
  • COG#: 9359
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2012, 10:40:48 AM »
Haven't tried it.
10 Kawi Concours 14 ABS

Offline Pokey

  • Arena
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2487
  • Country: us
  • WESTERVILLE OHIO 'Twit"
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #2 on: November 19, 2012, 03:25:48 PM »
I like the OEM personally.
2006 DL1000  2006 SV650
08 C14 "gone"

"All we have to do is decide what to do with the time given to us". Gandalf the Grey

Offline DaddyFlip

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 238
  • Country: us
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #3 on: July 03, 2016, 10:11:19 PM »
I didn't want to start a new topic because a search for 'Hiflo' produced this good starter thread for the air filter review I'm posting.

So yes, the HFA2916 can be had on amazon for $26. The frame, foam edge, and paper media appears to be identical to the OE filter in every way, right down to the number of pleats. For reference, the shown OE filter on the right has 5000 miles on it. The Hiflo slid into place just like the OE filter. Looking rosy so far.



The flip side is positively thorny, however.



The backing screen on the OE filter has 10 holes per linear inch or 100 per square inch and they are twice as large as the holes in the backing screen of the Hiflo filter, which has 12 holes per linear inch or 144 per square inch (click on the pictures for a closeup). I could have measured and calculated open area, but a picture speaks a thousand words. Why Hiflo chose to put such a dense metal backing screen on their filter is beyond me. All that's needed is support to keep the pleated filter media from being sucked into the intake. Relative to the OE filter, there will be a severe penalty in air flow with the Hiflo filter.

NOT RECOMMENDED. Stick with OE.


I'm withdrawing my negative opinion because I don't have data/facts to support the statement I made. I'm currently running the filter without observable side effects. As always, YMMV and use non-OE at your own risk.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2016, 05:17:46 PM by DaddyFlip »
2001 ZR-7s "Ol' Red"
1995 FXDWG

Offline maxtog

  • Elite Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8871
  • Country: us
  • 2011 Silver
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #4 on: July 03, 2016, 11:04:28 PM »
[...]The flip side is positively thorny, however.[...]NOT RECOMMENDED. Stick with OE.

I have to agree.  It looks like all that unnecessary metal on the back would greatly restrict airflow.  Thanks for the info.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline VirginiaJim

  • Administrator
  • Elite Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11336
  • Country: england
  • I've forgotten more than I'll ever know...
    • Kawasaki 1400GTR
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #5 on: July 04, 2016, 06:49:35 AM »
+1
"LOCTITE®"  The original thread locker...  #11  2020 Indian Roadmaster, ABS, Cruise control, heated grips and seats/w/AC 46 Monitoring with cutting edge technology U.N.I.T is Back! Member in good standing with the Knights of MEH.

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • Arena
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2898
  • Country: 00
  • WHISKEY.Tango.Foxtrot.
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2016, 01:19:57 PM »
As an engineer that did a bazillion calcs on pressure drop across filter media, based on fan forced air cooling of large electrical control cabinets,  I'll pipe up and explain that even tho it appears restrictive, in reality the filter media itself is 20 times more restrictive than the perf plate...

I didn't believe this myself untill I tested numerous patterns of perforations, and screens in the products I was designing,  The filters we used were varied, and depended on fan size, ducting, and environment, and varied from pleated HEPA type celulose paper pleated, glass floss, fiberglass matt, and coarse washable fiber stock...   with exception of the last material, the screening mad very little difference..
And keep in mind the perf plate is on the downstream side of the flow path...so it essentially stays clean, and doesn't collect big goobers..

Id really like to see some figures done on it realistically by SISF, on the dyno, with a/f ratios, combined with his data points of the flash...
I think you would be surprised by the outcome.

I'll try one of those on my next filter change for sure....  I ain't skeered

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline DaddyFlip

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 238
  • Country: us
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #7 on: July 04, 2016, 02:24:07 PM »
I can believe what you are saying. I'm running the evil Hiflo filter now against my own recommendation just because it's new and I paid for it. Without data, all we have is the eye test and it doesn't pass the eye test.
2001 ZR-7s "Ol' Red"
1995 FXDWG

Offline C14lvr

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 215
  • Country: us
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2016, 06:50:44 PM »
I'm on my second hi-flo.
See no problems so far... especially when saving as much as $100 on 2 filters!  :o

Some of those prices are rediculous.

$75 for an air filter?? Wow...
2011 C14 ABS black w/red/yellow, B.D.F lofuel W.E.,SSD h/g's,
2" setback risers, Phil's wedges/rear rack,K Gel-seat, Rostra CC, AST tourpegs, techspec, 2"droppegs, 4"droppass pegs, Fuzeblock,  7"Garmin, fenda ext, LED tag plate, Ip5S Ram mt, TMeister, Mirror LED t/s, Bestem TBox, CB HDUT w/s, TRex front/CC bag, Wolo Badboy, Tailbrights, Scala G9X, Scorpion EXO1200 Jag, PR4GT's55's, 55W Qz Dr

Offline Cold Streak

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 317
  • Country: us
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2016, 07:27:49 AM »
Calculate the open area of all the holes in the HiFlo, then compare it to the area of the duct leading from the air filter box to the engine.  That would be interesting.

Offline smokin

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
  • Country: au
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2016, 08:20:37 AM »
Same Hi flo filter is recommended for a ZX14,which has a higher CFM rating than a C14/GTR1400.I have fitted one to the GTR1400 covered a few miles no different than the OEM filter in terms of performance. Don't think the smaller holes in the metal panel makes any difference in performance.
SONS OF ARTHRITIS RIDE HARD MEDICATE OFTEN.

Offline Diablo6v

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 54
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2016, 12:38:12 PM »
My bike came with a Hi-Flo..I haven't had any issues. I cleaned it with simple green and a soft tooth brush then rinsed it and let it dry out. its working fine. My mileage went up because it was sooo nasty and clogged. Now that I know it only takes 20min to change it. I will be buying a K&N and clean it at every oil change.

Offline ZXShan, 2015 C14 ABS

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 32
  • Country: us
  • 2015 C14 ABS
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2016, 12:52:57 PM »
Can anyone tell me if the computer will compensate for added airflow by adding additional fuel to the mix? For example, the ECU on Harley's will take a 30 minute snap shot of air/fuel mixture and what the sensors are sending to the computer and adjust the mixture to a point as needed for how the bike is being ridden or various elevation changes etc. Does the Connie system do the same thing? If not, I would think the bike would run a bit on the lean side with all the additional air flow. Thanks.
Quote: "A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort."
-Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • Arena
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2898
  • Country: 00
  • WHISKEY.Tango.Foxtrot.
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2016, 01:53:45 PM »
Can anyone tell me if the computer will compensate for added airflow by adding additional fuel to the mix? For example, the ECU on Harley's will take a 30 minute snap shot of air/fuel mixture and what the sensors are sending to the computer and adjust the mixture to a point as needed for how the bike is being ridden or various elevation changes etc. Does the Connie system do the same thing? If not, I would think the bike would run a bit on the lean side with all the additional air flow. Thanks.

I think you may be confused as to lean/rich...
The people commenting on the "restriction" of airflow here may have a point, but as it has not been run on an a/f sensor for exhaust analysis, we don't know...

If you restrict, air, and inject fuel, it runs rich, not lean.
Now, your bike being a 2015, and having O2 sensors in the pre cat area, may give direct feedback to the fueling ecu, and make adjustments based on that, but I can't say for certain it takes place. None of the years has an airflow sensor between the filter, and the intake valves... so that's data that does not have corroboration or can change fuel setting from ECU.

I still say we need examination, prolly from SISF, as he has the setup, and access to the equipment, to asses the effect and differences if any, that this filter may or may not have... and CAN it be tuned to in a flash, to work as a benefit?

Iirc, when he bgan all this, he found that this bike DID in fact run rich at points in the usable rpm range, and O2 readings were somewhat outlined to show this..

Remember, before the flash, came the 2 minute mod..... which cut the airflow on the C10 drastcally, and also allowed much less fuel by jetting to match, without loosing hp, and even increasing usable torque on the old bike.... some times velocity and more fuel, is in effect wasted if the engine can't burn it all...

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline ZXShan, 2015 C14 ABS

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 32
  • Country: us
  • 2015 C14 ABS
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2016, 01:55:41 PM »
Thank you for the correction.
Quote: "A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort."
-Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • Arena
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2898
  • Country: 00
  • WHISKEY.Tango.Foxtrot.
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2016, 02:16:56 PM »
I didn't want to start a new topic because a search for 'Hiflo' produced this good starter thread for the air filter review I'm posting.




The backing screen on the OE filter has 10 holes per linear inch or 100 per square inch and they are twice as large as the holes in the backing screen of the Hiflo filter, which has 12 holes per linear inch or 144 per square inch (click on the pictures for a closeup). I could have measured and calculated open area, but a picture speaks a thousand words. Why Hiflo chose to put such a dense metal backing screen on their filter is beyond me. All that's needed is support to keep the pleated filter media from being sucked into the intake. Relative to the OE filter, there will be a severe penalty in air flow with the Hiflo filter.

NOT RECOMMENDED. Stick with OE.

Now, as the hi flo has holes.in the plates, and the pleats in the fiter medai itself behind it, are not restricted and un covered,  did you think about all the actaul restriction that is occuring in the crests and valleys of the OEM filter, that was sandwiched and pleated, like it was clad in this screening ...as in the complete surface area of every pleate has restriction also...

Just tossing that out for thoughts... to really calculate total restriction on the oem, it would have to be unpleated, and total surface area of the screen and media calculated,

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline jimmymac

  • Arena
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1076
  • Country: us
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2016, 07:36:05 PM »
I have a K&N so my days of buying filters are over. And back when I bought it, it was about the same price as OEM from my dealer.
The grass isn't always greener.

Offline DaddyFlip

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 238
  • Country: us
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2016, 01:50:58 PM »
Now, as the hi flo has holes.in the plates, and the pleats in the fiter medai itself behind it, are not restricted and un covered,  did you think about all the actaul restriction that is occuring in the crests and valleys of the OEM filter, that was sandwiched and pleated, like it was clad in this screening ...as in the complete surface area of every pleate has restriction also...

Just tossing that out for thoughts... to really calculate total restriction on the oem, it would have to be unpleated, and total surface area of the screen and media calculated,

No sir; I did not concern myself with the pleats on the OE filter because this part was identical to the HiFlo filter.  So, using the OE filter as the baseline, my question was- would the more dense metal screen of the HiFlo filter reduce air flow to the engine relative to the OE filter, which has a more open metal screen.

What probably happens is the filter media is more restrictive than the metal plate, so there is probably no difference, which was your earlier observation.

I'm running the filter now, so I change my review conclusion from "not recommended" to "it probably doesn't matter and for half the price, use at your own risk." The construction quality is just as good as OE, the fit is just as good, and the filter media is identical.
2001 ZR-7s "Ol' Red"
1995 FXDWG

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • Arena
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2898
  • Country: 00
  • WHISKEY.Tango.Foxtrot.
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #18 on: July 23, 2016, 02:50:16 PM »
My bike is due for a filter sometime later this year, so I will try the low priced one for certain, and see if I can detect a reduction in power... but as I noted, id like to see SISF's data chart study using it in place of the oem one.. mayb I can convince him to test one...

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline brant bandit

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 50
  • Country: ca
Re: Air Filter
« Reply #19 on: July 26, 2016, 10:31:30 AM »
I just installed this filter and I'm very happy. Those pictures don't do it justice....they look quite restrictive and it's not.

My bike is running perfectly.
2014 Concours 1400 in black (the fastest colour)
COG# 11854