I'll apologize in advance - I know the whole "seat discussion" has been beat to death.  I've read post after post on any number of seats from about a half dozen manufacturers.  I've used my electric carving knife and some past experience to make the stock seat more comfortable, and a Sheepskin cover made a HUGE difference, but my issue remains...forward lean towards the tank (not to mention the same only worse for my bride!).

I'm 6'3", 200 lbs, I've got a 35" inseam - (installed peg lowers to help with leg crunch!), no issues touching the ground - I could even come up a bit!
I've got pull back risers, Puig tall windshield, and canyon bars with forward pegs.

What I'm trying to find out, after reading all the info I could about replacements seats, is there any consensus about which seat does the best to eliminate forward lean?
I know this is opinion, but that's what I'm looking for, the overall opinion of COG riders who have addressed my same discomfort, being pushed into the tank. Seat cover  material (as in the KAWA Tour seat) is not of interest to me, just the ergonomics of the seat itself.
I ride it like I stole it when I get to the roads that allow that. Some are close, some are far (great roads in North and South Carolina, and tons of them) but I'm looking to improve the "Tour" in this amazing Sport-Touring machine. I'm getting ready to "invest" as a "Merry Christmas to me!"
Thanks in advance for your help and replies, and opinions, and again, sorry for 'yet another'...

I doubt there is an consensus because everyone is so different not only in size / shape but also wants and expectations.

I can say with certainty that a Corbin saddle is extremely flat. It is dished quite a bit but in reality, that does not really effect the riding position and is not all that noticeable when using one. That said, I find a Corbin is much too hard for me to use- they are similar to concrete only harder. But a Corbin with an Airhawk air cushion on top of it works the best for me of anything I have tried and that includes a custom made Russel day- long. Both the rider and passenger sections of a Corbin will remove any forward pitch although at the cost of a very hard seat and also a very heavy saddle (maybe they DO use concrete?).

Brian

<snip>

What I'm trying to find out, after reading all the info I could about replacements seats, is there any consensus about which seat does the best to eliminate forward lean?
I know this is opinion, but that's what I'm looking for, the overall opinion of COG riders who have addressed my same discomfort, being pushed into the tank. Seat cover  material (as in the KAWA Tour seat) is not of interest to me, just the ergonomics of the seat itself.
I ride it like I stole it when I get to the roads that allow that. Some are close, some are far (great roads in North and South Carolina, and tons of them) but I'm looking to improve the "Tour" in this amazing Sport-Touring machine. I'm getting ready to "invest" as a "Merry Christmas to me!"
Thanks in advance for your help and replies, and opinions, and again, sorry for 'yet another'...

I'm unsure if Loren's making seats at this time, but his "Baldwin" seat will be built to your specifications.
I had mine built with both positions raised in the front, and widened a bit in the rear, and the step behind the rider was placed at the distance form the front that I wanted it...
Heck of a fine seat!

Ride safe, Ted

The Kawi Touring seat doesn't suck.  That's what I'm sitting on at this time.  It still has a forward rake but the cover is less slippery.  I don't feel any concrete and it still pushes forward.  The answer to your question will lie in the needs you have but I don't feel that all of the needs can be met by one seat.

A good way to imagine the Touring seat is to take the stock seat and spray some Stickem' on it and you have the Touring seat.  I don't ride 2 up so I can't speak to passenger comfort.

The other seats that offer an impression for your butt cheeks can be hard...  but they do break in, it just takes time.

I've said it before and I'll say it again (as so many other have also said):  The Concours is a Ninja with saddlebags.  If you want cruiser-seat-comfort then get a cruiser.

All of this info brought to you by my humble opinion. 

I doubt there is an consensus because everyone is so different not only in size / shape but also wants and expectations.

I can say with certainty that a Corbin saddle is extremely flat. It is dished quite a bit but in reality, that does not really effect the riding position and is not all that noticeable when using one.
Brian

That really depends, for me it does. Because I am not a large guy, I am 5'10 1/2"  and 165 pounds, years of running, biking and lifting. I do not have excessive fat on my posterior. As a result, I had big issues with the hump towards the front causing severe perineum pain, and sit farther back than the stock position. I liked the seat, but needed less of a dish, and needed the hump removed. Corbin was supposed to take all this into account when they made it, but despite what they said, and what was on the order, they sent a stock seat.

They said later, after many thousands of miles, that they would replace the foam for free, and make adjustments. We decided on a flatter design, filling the dish. Sadly, they simply added softer foam to the top, leaving the harder foam on bottom, which meant the hump remained an issue. I finally tore it apart and removed the hump myself. The seat still makes me sit farther back, creating a longer reach to the bars though, and without the AirHawk, it is still not comfortable after multiple 600-800 mile days causing real pain.  I do prefer the leather of the Corbin, it is much nicer than any other seat covering I have ridden on. Much cooler on any day. 

If you do not carry extra padding on your posterior, which lifts you above the hump in the front, and cannot actually ride in to Corbin so they can actually make a seat to fit you, it has the potential to be a very painful seat. I actually prefer a firm seat, and had the Corbin been made without so much dish, and no hump, it would be great.

The Touring seat woks great for me. I do not slide forward, and it is comfortable, and puts me in a perfect riding position. 

I would like to try a Sargent standard height seat, made with the firmer foam they used in the seat they made for my RC51. I loved that seat. My Sargent was great for about 14,000 miles or so, then it broke down enough that it didn't support me as well, and the front part mashed down too much. I believe the Sargent low is made with firmer foam. I have not personally tried one, and would really not like a lower seat. Now if they would make me a standard height seat with the firmer foam...

Yeah, I am almost in the identical size / shape as you; it has been years since I have bicycled, ran or lifted anything I did not have to..... although I am quite a bit taller, weigh significantly less than 165 kg.   

But yes, a Corbin does result in a much farther rearward saddle (read: where your butt ends up) position. Which in turn changes how every other single aspect of the bike 'fits' a person including bar height, pull-back and even bar angle, footpeg height and fore- aft placement, and even the required height of the windshield.

The passenger is also raised quite a bit from the stock height; my wife really likes that part because she is relatively short while I am relatively tall so the only saddle we have tried that has ever allowed her to see anything but the back of my helmet has been a Corbin on a C-14. The Corbin saddle also necessitated removing the peg lowering arms for the passenger pegs as the saddle jacked my wife up so much higher (yeah, there is both a joke and an 'Easy Boys' in there somewhere.....)

And all of this ties in nicely with the idea that there is no consensus or even general trend in which saddle (or pegs, or grips, or windshield type / brand / height, ad nauseum) is best or even better. 2" bar risers, Buell foot pegs, a Corbin w/ Airhawk (for both of us BTW) and a CalSci XL with a nearly 4" riser or 'wing' on top work for me or us.

Brian

<snip>

If you do not carry extra padding on your posterior, which lifts you above the hump in the front, and cannot actually ride in to Corbin so they can actually make a seat to fit you, it has the potential to be a very painful seat. I actually prefer a firm seat, and had the Corbin been made without so much dish, and no hump, it would be great.

The Touring seat woks great for me. I do not slide forward, and it is comfortable, and puts me in a perfect riding position. 

I would like to try a Sargent standard height seat, made with the firmer foam they used in the seat they made for my RC51. I loved that seat. My Sargent was great for about 14,000 miles or so, then it broke down enough that it didn't support me as well, and the front part mashed down too much. I believe the Sargent low is made with firmer foam. I have not personally tried one, and would really not like a lower seat. Now if they would make me a standard height seat with the firmer foam...

I would like to try a Sargent standard height seat, made with the firmer foam they used in the seat they made for my RC51. I loved that seat. My Sargent was great for about 14,000 miles or so, then it broke down enough that it didn't support me as well, and the front part mashed down too much. I believe the Sargent low is made with firmer foam. I have not personally tried one, and would really not like a lower seat. Now if they would make me a standard height seat with the firmer foam...

Sargent makes good stuff.  But their low seat is very hard.  I have not tried their "standard" seat, since I MUST have a low seat to reach the ground (AND lowered bike AND tall boots), so the standard one might be far better from a comfort standpoint.

So my advice is:  If you must have a low seat, the Sargent World Low is as low as it goes... well made, nice looking, great "pod" option, but not comfortable because there is so little foam.  If you don't have to have a low seat, make sure not to opt for the low model, go for the standard.

Sargent makes good stuff.  But their low seat is very hard.  I have not tried their "standard" seat, since I MUST have a low seat to reach the ground (AND lowered bike AND tall boots), so the standard one might be far better from a comfort standpoint.

So my advice is:  If you must have a low seat, the Sargent World Low is as low as it goes... well made, nice looking, great "pod" option, but not comfortable because there is so little foam.  If you don't have to have a low seat, make sure not to opt for the low model, go for the standard.

Yes, I like Sargent seats, and have had more than one. I did like the hard foam on my RC51 seat. Yes, it was thin, and yes it was hard, but it supported well. With the standard height C14 seat, there would me thicker foam, which would make the harder foam of the low seat, a bit softer in feel. The issue with the softer foam, on any seat shaped like the OEM and the Sargent, is that once the foam break in, the front tends to smash down, while the rear doesn't,  due largely in part to the shape, and the fact the cover prevents it from compressing more in the back, since the cover material stretches to its max, then stops. If there was a split at the bottom, it would allow the rear to compress as well as the front, mitigating the issue. I like the shape and support the rear of the Sargent provides though, but when the front mashes down, you once again are pushed forward. I really would like to try it with the harder foam.

A bicycle has a seat post, just like a motorcycle forum.
I remember a certain joke about seat posts...

A bicycle has a seat post, just like a motorcycle forum.
I remember a certain joke about seat posts...

Could be worse- could be an oil thread!

...and before you cannot unread it somebody starts talking about oiling their seat.

Yeah, I am almost in the identical size / shape as you; it has been years since I have bicycled, ran or lifted anything I did not have to..... although I am quite a bit taller, weigh significantly less than 165 kg.   
 

The passenger is also raised quite a bit from the stock height; my wife really likes that part because she is relatively short while I am relatively tall so the only saddle we have tried that has ever allowed her to see anything but the back of my helmet has been a Corbin on a C-14.

Yes, that is probably the best part of the design. My wife loves the seat.

My first impression of stock seat ( on my ‘11)- very conmfy when bike is parked. A passerby at a dealership might be impressed . It stays that comfortable for maybe 15 minutes, then the rear end starts to hurt. Found this out the hard way when I bought it new in CO and ride it back home 1200 miles.
Lowered sergeant seat- ordered off of amazon, felt like it had no cushion ,hurt as soon as I started riding, sent back for refund.
Regular sergeant- must say it looks great- came with silver piping to match my atomic silver paint. Much more comfy than stock. However, with 25k miles on it, not so much. It shoves me into the tank
and cushion seams to have disappeared, feels more like a Corbin . I have a rock hard Corbin on my Suzuki but that works because the seat shape is perfect for me. But the shape of the sergeant isn’t ideal . I’m going cross country next summer and I’ll likely get a Kawasaki touring seat.

I think there are forums just for that..... not that there is anything wrong with that..... (the forums or the other 'that', no matter what Megan Kelly may say about it).

Your post could really have used an 'Easy Boys' but I am not sure the 'seat oilers' say that. ??

Brian

...and before you cannot unread it somebody starts talking about oiling their seat.

 

Regular sergeant- must say it looks great- came with silver piping to match my atomic silver paint. Much more comfy than stock. However, with 25k miles on it, not so much. It shoves me into the tank
and cushion seams to have disappeared, feels more like a Corbin . I have a rock hard Corbin on my Suzuki but that works because the seat shape is perfect for me. But the shape of the sergeant isn’t ideal . I’m going cross country next summer and I’ll likely get a Kawasaki touring seat.

That was my experience as well. Initially, and for some time after, the Sargent seat was great, I do like the shape though. After around 20,000 miles, give or take 5,000, I forget how many, the foam broke down enough that it no lover have the support necessary in the front, and you were pushed forward. Great seat until that happened.

Corbin made some great seats for many different bikes, but I cannot fathom why they decided to make the C14 seat shaped like one designed for a cruiser. The shape, for me, simply does not work well on the C14. I do wish I had originally simply cut down the hump in the front part of the seat. The seat does make a nice platform for an Airhawk though.

Well, in all fairness, I am not sure any foam in any seat (or chair or whatever) will last but so long before it starts to lose its spring/form/support.  It probably depends on the quality and type of foam, but also how often it is used, weight, and environmental conditions (like how long it sits in the sun being heated, humidity, temperature cycling).   I am sure some lasts longer than others.

This has been my experience: in the end (very small pun intended), a mold-able, conforming saddle surface is needed for my own, as well as my wife's, long time riding comfort. Even a saddle that was shaped exactly to fit a person, such as sitting on rigid foam while it hardened (yeah, couple jokes in there somewhere too) would not fit as well once clothes were changed, and the riding position was changed in any amount at all. An air (water would also work but not gel) cushion or actual saddle will always conform to the area above it and even compensate for any lumps (Easy Boys!- I mean like a wallet!). After trying out several saddles, including custom made types, we have found that only an air cushion provides us with the ability to spend eight, ten or more hours in the saddle without discomfort, if not outright pain; A stock Corbin will limit my own riding time to 45 minutes and then I am done for at least 12 hours due to discomfort.

Considering the above, what has worked best for us has been the Corbin, not because it is a 'good' saddle in and of itself but because it is a wide, [close to] flat surface that extends somewhat forward, and gives excellent area for an air cushion. It is actually the cushion that is providing the actual comfort.

The saddle / air cushion combo. is not without its problems though; the cushions are subject to damage / leaks, can be stolen easily, and require some fiddling to get them situated correctly over the saddle as well as filled with the right amount of air. The tendency is to over- fill them by quite a lot, and that is like riding on a beach- ball and I believe a prime reason why some people who try them do not like them at all. Properly filled, you really do not feel like you are floating above the actual saddle at all, in fact, it does not feel like it is even there or actually doing anything.

Brian

That was my experience as well. Initially, and for some time after, the Sargent seat was great, I do like the shape though. After around 20,000 miles, give or take 5,000, I forget how many, the foam broke down enough that it no lover have the support necessary in the front, and you were pushed forward. Great seat until that happened.

Corbin made some great seats for many different bikes, but I cannot fathom why they decided to make the C14 seat shaped like one designed for a cruiser. The shape, for me, simply does not work well on the C14. I do wish I had originally simply cut down the hump in the front part of the seat. The seat does make a nice platform for an Airhawk though.

Well, in all fairness, I am not sure any foam in any seat (or chair or whatever) will last but so long before it starts to lose its spring/form/support.  It probably depends on the quality and type of foam, but also how often it is used, weight, and environmental conditions (like how long it sits in the sun being heated, humidity, temperature cycling).   I am sure some lasts longer than others.

This has been my experience: in the end (very small pun intended), a mold-able, conforming saddle surface is needed for my own, as well as my wife's, long time riding comfort. Even a saddle that was shaped exactly to fit a person, such as sitting on rigid foam while it hardened (yeah, couple jokes in there somewhere too) would not fit as well once clothes were changed, and the riding position was changed in any amount at all. An air (water would also work but not gel) cushion or actual saddle will always conform to the area above it and even compensate for any lumps (Easy Boys!- I mean like a wallet!). After trying out several saddles, including custom made types, we have found that only an air cushion provides us with the ability to spend eight, ten or more hours in the saddle without discomfort, if not outright pain; A stock Corbin will limit my own riding time to 45 minutes and then I am done for at least 12 hours due to discomfort.

Considering the above, what has worked best for us has been the Corbin, not because it is a 'good' saddle in and of itself but because it is a wide, [close to] flat surface that extends somewhat forward, and gives excellent area for an air cushion. It is actually the cushion that is providing the actual comfort.

The saddle / air cushion combo. is not without its problems though; the cushions are subject to damage / leaks, can be stolen easily, and require some fiddling to get them situated correctly over the saddle as well as filled with the right amount of air. The tendency is to over- fill them by quite a lot, and that is like riding on a beach- ball and I believe a prime reason why some people who try them do not like them at all. Properly filled, you really do not feel like you are floating above the actual saddle at all, in fact, it does not feel like it is even there or actually doing anything.

Brian

Yep, the Corbin is a great platform for a cushion like the Airhawk. I actually prefer a firm seat, provided it is shaped properly, for me. I could save money on a vasectomy if I rode the Corbin though, the hump in the front would render me useless anyway after riding very long. If they would have made the seat as I requested, and as they said they would, all would be well. Had they removed the original foam, and rebuilt it as requested, and as they said they would when it was in for foam replacement and reshaping, all would be well, but they didn't, they simply overlaid the old foam, in its original bad shape, with softer foam. The result is the same, the softer foam simply smashed down and adjusts its shape to match the firmer foam underneath, causing the same issue. Truly sad since the new shape is great, a flatter, seat, more like they put on every other sport bike and sport touring bike in the past.