Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C10, aka Kawasaki Concours - The Original => The Bike - C10 => Topic started by: Engraverwilliam on April 13, 2015, 04:06:45 PM
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I thought I was only getting 115 miles to the tank.
My gauge was reading in the red so I stopped in for gas.
Only took 3.7 gallons to fill it back to top!
We do have 7.3 gallon capacity yes?
She was far from empty.
Do I need to get a new sender?
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Just found this http://c10mods.blogspot.com/2011/07/c10-fuel-gauge-modification.html (http://c10mods.blogspot.com/2011/07/c10-fuel-gauge-modification.html)
Is this something that I could be needing to do?
Easy fix if so...
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You can either bend the sender float a couple times till you get it reading about where you expect or get a 220 ohm (?) resister and splice it in parallel to the sender wiring.
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I bent my float right after I got the bike in 2002, its right on the red when I go to reserve which is almost always around 180-200 miles. Took me about a 1/2 hour to do, but I think I'll try the resistor idea, its real simple too.
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t cro said it all.
but you might have a bad sender altogether. mine doesn't read red till much later.
did this just happen? i am assuming you have had the bike for a few tankfuls.
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I have the resistor mod so when my gauge kits the white line just above the red line, that's when I hit reserve. I put in 5.5 gallons at that point, which is usually 250 miles +/- a bit.
You can put 7.5 or so gallons into a totally dry tank, but there's about .3 that you can't get out (unusable fuel as they say in aviation).
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But prior to that Nosmo, what was the gauge behavior?
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But prior to that Nosmo, what was the gauge behavior?
Did mine back in 02 but to the best of my memory card when my gas gauge would touch the red it would only take 3.5 or so gallons.... I must say that I think every C10 was born this way....
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Just found this http://c10mods.blogspot.com/2011/07/c10-fuel-gauge-modification.html (http://c10mods.blogspot.com/2011/07/c10-fuel-gauge-modification.html)
Is this something that I could be needing to do?
Easy fix if so...
Yep. Well worth the time and minimal expense. And with Radio Shacks going out of business all over the place, you might even get a discount on the resistors.
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Do I need 1/2 watt or 1/4 cant quite make out the package in the linked photoblog
they sell them 4 bucks for 50 of them on amazon hehe
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1/4 watt should be the most you would need. It isn't like that thing pulls a lot of power. I submit that an 1/8 might even be good enough but I don't know what the current draw on it is.
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t cro said it all.
but you might have a bad sender altogether. mine doesn't read red till much later.
did this just happen? i am assuming you have had the bike for a few tankfuls.
Well I at first attributed the bad gas mileage to the motor. Had the carbs and the valves done. The motor runs freaken nice now. Same gas mileage. Then after the second tank I notice the small fill up and had the eureka moment that started this thread.
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But prior to that Nosmo, what was the gauge behavior?
Sorry, I can't say. It was that way when I bought the bike used.
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I thought I was only getting 115 miles to the tank.
Only took 3.7 gallons to fill it back to top!
This still equates to 31.1 mpg. That is pretty low unless it was "around town" traffic driving. I've got as bad as 28.5 mpg when doing traffic commuting with a lot of squirreling around. On a "typical" ride, most of us get 40 to 44 mpg.
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It is L.A. So yeah lots and lots of "squirreling around" splitting stopping slowing, going, turning, avoiding, duck walking, squeezing in between. I'm sure a lot of you can relate.
My 10 pack of resistors arrives tomorrow probably. I will report back. I will also be giving away any extras that I have to the community here. I will let you all know.
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Decided to try the resistor mod. Found a Radio shack near my house, employee asked "what wattage do you need"? Uhhhh..........I remembered seeing the fuel gauge plug in the pic, remembered they weren't bigger than my thumb nail, extrapolated that I most likely needed either the 1/8 or 1/4 watt based simply on the size since the 1/2 half watt unit "looked' too big. So, at $1.20 per pack of five, I bought both. Guess I'll start with the 1/8. ;D
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Decided to try the resistor mod. Found a Radio shack near my house, employee asked "what wattage do you need"? Uhhhh..........I remembered seeing the fuel gauge plug in the pic, remembered they weren't bigger than my thumb nail, extrapolated that I most likely needed either the 1/8 or 1/4 watt based simply on the size since the 1/2 half watt unit "looked' too big. So, at $1.20 per pack of five, I bought both. Guess I'll start with the 1/8. ;D
I'm shocked that you found a Radio Shack employee that even knew there were different watt ratings. :o
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She looked all of 16 and knew her stuff, even counted my change back to me the old fashioned way instead of looking at the computerized register and handing me my money like most do.
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I just did the 220 ohm resistor mod with a 1/4 watt resistor a couple days ago. So far results look good, I'm waiting to see where the needle ends up when it's time to go to reserve.
The Radio Shack guy I had to deal with was completely clueless. :o
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I recieved mine in the mail...amazon. But now the bike is in the shop. Go figure.
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OK Thud, I'll try the 1/4 watt too tomorrow. I'll have 4 of the 1/8 watt and 3 of the 1/4 watt left over if anybody would like one just respond here and I'll reply and get your USPS address and get one off to you ASAP, and the best part, they are FREE! ;D
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This is kinda old, seeing as it dates wayyyyyy back, but the 1/4w. Resistor thing is more dependant on the resistance value ( ohms) than the wattage...
It was found that a 220 ohm value seems to work close, but is still not adjustable... to truely make it adjustable you need a variable resistor, or pontiameter...
Radio shack has a 3/4watt 220 ohm unit for about $2, which does allow you tto trim the gauge correctly and to the point you want.
Its in the COG library, for those of you with current membership, and can be found here
http://cog-online.org/clubportal/clubstatic.cfm?clubID=1328&pubmenuoptID=30728 (http://cog-online.org/clubportal/clubstatic.cfm?clubID=1328&pubmenuoptID=30728)
Sorry, you had to be a member to read it, but it goes thru installing one...
It allows you to adjust the sensitivity of the gage sender unit to allign it when the level is right at reserve... and it has worked for 20 years or so...
I'll probably get slammed for posting this, but its worth reading...
Article By: Dave Cavanaugh
Fuel Gauge Adjustment
Go to Radio Shack and get a multi turn 1000 ohm .75 watt variable resistor (or "trimmer"). Part # 271-342 $2.49
http://www.radioshack.com/1k-ohm-15-turn-pc-mount-cermet-potentiometer-trimmer/2710342.html#.VT_sj7PD-Ag (http://www.radioshack.com/1k-ohm-15-turn-pc-mount-cermet-potentiometer-trimmer/2710342.html#.VT_sj7PD-Ag)
Editor's note: a number of riders have been successful with a 220 ohm resistor instead of going through the trouble of fiddling with the variable model.]
Solder leads six or eight inches long, number 18 wire, to the center and one of the outer pins. Doesn't matter which as long as one is the center lead. Attach the resistor and leads to something so the pins don't get damaged (see below). Put some shrink tube on the solder joints so people won't think you're an amateur.
Remove the two bolts, raise the back end of the gas tank and fish out the plastic connector you disconnect when you remove the tank. (Jam a block of wood or a wadded up towel under the tank to hold it up. If you raise the tank too high, the black rubber knobs under the front of the tank will probably fall off.)
Disconnect the plastic connector, and temporarily jam the stripped ends of the two leads from the resistor into the two holes in the female side of the connector, and reconnect. You want the resistor to be in PARALLEL with the sending unit.
I made my trial pigtail long enough so the resistor stuck out a couple of inches between the seat and the gas tank, and messed with the adjustment over two tanks of gas or so.)
Ride (or drain the tank) until you switch to reserve. Use the small screwdriver you use to adjust your eyeglasses to adjust the resistor. Adjust slowly; the gas gauge is heavily damped and doesn't move very fast. When the needle is where you want it, you're more or less done. (I adjusted mine so the gauge is just touching the red square when it hits reserve).
Once it's adjusted you can solder the resistor wiring into the main wiring below the connector permanently. That way, when you remove the tank, the resistor won't come out.
You should attach the resistor and leads to a piece of circuit board or thin piece of wood to protect the pins (I used a tongue depressor because it was handy). I used little wire ties. Hot glue would work, too.
Dave
[Editor's note: put a dab of silicon on the adjuster screw. This should stop it from adjusting itself from the bike's vibrations.]
This was gleaned from
Article By: Dave Cavanaugh
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I know there used to be a plug-in variety that stopped being made. I was planning on making one myself. Maybe I will revisit that making it with the POT.
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I know there used to be a plug-in variety that stopped being made. I was planning on making one myself. Maybe I will revisit that making it with the POT.
Yes, we had a fantastic lady making harness plug in mlds for our bike many years ago, this was one of them.. as with everything, these have passed...
Carry on, we aim to keep the database alive... and with all due respect, newcomers should stand back, do some research, and take a moment to see what was done wayyyyy back... and yess, there was a LOT of info that got flushed back in the day when the crash occurred.. sadly, there are few thatbarenwilling to resurect it...
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Got my bike back from the shop Saturday as a few of you know. The tank was almost empty due to the fuel problems she was having before the repairs. When I got her home I lifted the tank and installed the resistor per that blog posted above. This morning (Monday) I filled it up. In theory, I should end up at half a tank by Friday instead of the in the red and half tank issue I was having at the beginning of this thread.
See you in a week
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Got my bike back from the shop Saturday as a few of you know. The tank was almost empty due to the fuel problems she was having before the repairs. When I got her home I lifted the tank and installed the resistor per that blog posted above. This morning (Monday) I filled it up. In theory, I should end up at half a tank by Friday instead of the in the red and half tank issue I was having at the beginning of this thread.
See you in a week
I'm guessing that, now that the carbs have been properly cleaned (we hope) that you should see a bump in gas mileage, even with the constant stop & go traffic y'all deal with in the LA area. Keep us posted!
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I guess I just don't worry about it too much! When I first got my bike (2006 with ~11,000 miles) I noticed a disconnect between the fuel gauge, the stated tank capacity, and how much fuel I could put in when I was in the red zone of the fuel gauge. A quick perusal of the forum revealed how common a problem this is - but is it really a problem? I go until the bikes starts coughing and then move the fuel tap to the reserve position and can reliably go another 30 miles. I will say that after my friend did the 'igniter ground modification', the gauge seems to be a little more accurate. I don't know if this is just coincidence or not. At illegally fast highway speeds I usually go 220-240 miles before hitting reserve - equating to mpg in the low 40's. Keeping the speed in the legal range I've gotten 48+ mpg.
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Every C10 I had for any length of time had a guage that showed empty with 1/2 tank. I never got around to "fixing" any of them, just used the odometer for estimates and looked for a gas station about every 200 miles when I traveled (I usually needed a bio break at that time anyway). For local use, I would by gas when I hit reserve.
A 1/4 watt resistor is plenty to handle the power needed by the gauge. Probably a 1/16th watt would work, but you also have mechanical stress from vibration, and the carbon resistors can be brittle.
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Ok Update time:
So far since I added the resistor 220ohms 1/4 watt?
The gauge still hit dead empty at 130mi. I am at about 155 now and still haven't switched to RES yet. Combo street/freeway driving.
I am going to probably try adding a second one and see if that does the trick. If not then I will see about obtaining the variable resistor and seeing if I can fix it that way.
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Strange? I used the 220 ohm resistor across the tank plug wire and I can get to 250 miles before the gauge gets into the red and then I'm real close to reserve.
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166 miles to reserve. 5.1 gals. 31 mpg not to bad. Could be better. I am going to check the resistor that I have in there and make sure the connection is good, Then add a second for grins. Before I try the variable one. It that don't work, I will give up and just use the ODO whatever right? She runs very well atm I have no complaints. I am running 91. I hear a 50 50 or so argument about what I should be putting in my bike for the best performance and mileage. If I had to choose I would choose performance. What side of the coin do you guys fall on on the matter?
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91 in an engine designed to run on 87 is a waste of money in my opinion plus the owner's manual calls for the 87 so I see no reason to run something else....
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I have regular unleaded available here. Typically I get 40 to 43 miles per gallon. I will fill up this next week and find out what my mileage was for today's ride. I have 240+ miles on this tank full and still did not switch it to reserve.
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Could the higher octane cause a lower mpg if she wants 87 instead? Just did valves and carbs anything else? Less stop and go and lower rpms I assume for starters...
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no.
what's going on with your bike? you should be getting 39-40mpg in town and perhaps 42-45 on the highway.
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i will report at the second tank. then fill it with the 87 and report with that. I have 19.5 mile round trip for work easy flying in the morning and stop and go spliting in the afternoon....
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with that you should be getting no less than 40mpg. more like 41-42.
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Hey Engraverwilliam!
If you can arrange for a weekend ride away from the city congestion (i.e. a ride at highway speeds), that might be a good way to get some good feedback on your mileage. The numbers still sound low to me, but if you are spending a lot of time at 5 MPH, I suppose those could be possible.
The main thing is that she's running well for now. That in of itself is a major accomplishment, considering your recent history with the bike.
On an unrelated note (based on a comment you made somewhere recently) I'd offer to come by sometime to show you how easy valve adjustments are, but I'm a couple of states away. The first time was a bit intimidating, but yeah it's not that bad, once you figure out how to get the valve cover off...
Might be a great excuse for you to hit one of the national yearly Concours rallies, or one of the local get togethers as a vacation, although I don't know how your Significant Other would react to a vacation with a bunch of Concours fanatics...
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Yeah Im just nitpicking and messing around at this point. Love the ride.
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get in there and clean the air filter..
my '86 with a clean filter, fresh correct valve adjust, carb synch, and idle adjusted at 1100 rpm netted me almkst 50 mpg for about 6 months, and when it started droppin, claning my k&n, and oiling it properly brought it back to 48+ mpg..
but then that was a silverdammit bike.. with 100k miles on it... (138,000 when I sold it) .
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MOB,
Wow. 48-50mpg on the highway exclusively?
get in there and clean the air filter..
my '86 with a clean filter, fresh correct valve adjust, carb synch, and idle adjusted at 1100 rpm netted me almkst 50 mpg for about 6 months, and when it started droppin, claning my k&n, and oiling it properly brought it back to 48+ mpg..
but then that was a silverdammit bike.. with 100k miles on it... (138,000 when I sold it) .
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My mileage sucks but at the same time I have a short ride to work and am kinda heavy on the throttle. Those two don't mix well for good mileage. I do think one of the problems is my carbs are due for a serious cleaning. I am going to try to get that done next year.
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I have regular unleaded available here. Typically I get 40 to 43 miles per gallon. I will fill up this next week and find out what my mileage was for today's ride. I have 240+ miles on this tank full and still did not switch it to reserve.
Rode it to work today. Total of 259 miles, still not on reserve. Filled it up with 5.798 gallons of regular unleaded for an average of 44.67 mpg. :banana :banana :banana