Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => Accessories and modifications - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: Clark Kent on June 29, 2012, 02:05:51 PM
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I am short 5'7" now and have to get use to it. I was 5'8" when I was younger.
I can't Flat Foot the 1400 and won't ride one I can't FF.
How do you get a 1400 Concours down to my level? I see that the standard seat height is 31.5"
How low canit go? I would need at least 2"
Right now I have an st1100 and am just shy of being able to ff it. I have a Valk and an 1800 GW. I can FF both of them easy. That's what I'm looking for in the 1400.
Thanks, ck
(I can see all kinds of openings for jokes here but I really just need to find out how to get the bike lower.)
Visit me in the Arena and bring all those jokes. :chugbeer:
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Would four inches lower help?
http://www.soupysperformance.com/catalog/item/4408900/6878922.htm (http://www.soupysperformance.com/catalog/item/4408900/6878922.htm)
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Not sure lowering this bike would be smart, and why must you totally be able to flatfoot?
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I had a hard time with the stock seat and doing the tip toe deal. Got the Corbin seat and now can flat foot my right foot while left is on brake. Just sayin'
FX
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These guys said you could borrow a set of their boots.
(http://www.legendaryhalloween.com/image-files/kiss-boots.jpg)
IIRC maxtog is short also and had to use a combination of lowering links and a shorter seat to reach the ground. You might send him a PM to see what worked well. I would try to keep from lowering the bike to much if at all possible but you gotta do, what you gotta do.
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I am short 5'7" now and have to get use to it. I can't Flat Foot the 1400 and won't ride one I can't FF. How do you get a 1400 Concours down to my level? I see that the standard seat height is 31.5"
How low canit go? I would need at least 2"
Welcome, "Clark"!!!! I can very much relate to your situation.
Always search first (on both accessories and "the bike" forums). Here is the thread you need:
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=260.0
I have pasted your questions there and replied to them there... (I have no idea why this board puts a stupid warning on posting to old threads. It is FAR better to continue a discussion in one place than to have it in many)
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Thanks to all. I will try to address each question:
Blue 14: Isn't 4" too much? Wouldn't the pan be to close to the ground?
Jeremy Mitchel: I could sure use the boots but how would I get all that hair inside my helmet?
Pokey: I am just too old to hold up that much weight without the feet being flat. If i'm not 2 up I can do it.
It may be just too much expense and trouble. My wife says I should get high heel boots! (Very funny)
Then she has the gall to get upset that I make her walk home! :rotflmao:
To safely ride the 1400C what inseam should someone have? Flat footing or not.
I have an inseam of 31-3/4 with bare feet on the floor
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To safely ride the 1400C what inseam should someone have? Flat footing or not.
I have an inseam of 31-3/4 with bare feet on the floor
I'm a 29 inseam CK, I got a Corbin seat with nose job and deep dish cut which dropped it almost 2" from stock seat height, now I'm good to go.
I also agree with Poke, there is no reason to need to completely flat foot this bike, the balls of your feet work just fine...
Good luck bro! :chugbeer:
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I am 5'8" on a good day with a 28" inseam. I spent 9 years on a C-10 and learned that if you use your skull muscle you can get around it. I don't try to "pad" the bike backwards, I am picky about where I park, if I have to back out I walk the bike out before getting on it. At stops, I could easily FF on one side with a little lean, and found it to be very stable.
I got my C-14 yesterday, and those things work just as well. I think the C-14 might be just a touch taller than the C-10 and I plan on getting a Sargent low seat which will help even more. I thought about lowering bikes in the past but when you do you screw with the geometry and then have to deal with modifying or swapping the side stand and usually give up the center stand unless you know someone who can do a cut and weld job.
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If you really "won't ride a bike you can't flat foot", then I think you ought to pass on the C14.
As to my personal experience, I normally wear 32" inseam pants. Out of curiosity, I measure pants crotch to floor and came up w/ 31.25". I normally cannot flat-foot the bike w/o wiggling around on the front part of the seat, but it is easy to get the balls of both feet firmly on the ground, with the boot heels just hovering off the pavement.
Backing up is not particularly easy, but only becomes an issue if I'm trying to back uphill (even on slight grades). I have learned to be careful where I park. Sideways inclines can be a stopping/parking risk as well - I dropped the bike once on a slant on a cold, rainy day.
A lowered/shaved seat may help. Lowering the suspension is possible, but has side effects, which may or may not be of concern to you.
The C14 is a great bike, but it is also a big, tall, heavy bike. There are lots of very good bikes out there that weigh less and have lower seat heights. It might be worth checking them out before spending your money.
I think the C14 could work for you, but if the flat-foot thing is truly a no-go for you, well, you know.
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Thanks to all. I will try to address each question:
Blue 14: Isn't 4" too much? Wouldn't the pan be to close to the ground?
To safely ride the 1400C what inseam should someone have? Flat footing or not.
I have an inseam of 31-3/4 with bare feet on the floor
4" is likely much more than you need. The turnbuckle type link lets you adjust until you get what you need. Sounds like an inch or two would be plenty.
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The link above addresses the rear, but how could u lower the rear 4" and not touch the front??
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Fork stops. Not ideal.
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Thanks to all. I will try to address each question:
Looks like you didn't read the lowering thread I offered, at all. Oh well; I tried. Good luck.
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:rotflmao:
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To safely ride the 1400C what inseam should someone have? Flat footing or not.
I have an inseam of 31-3/4 with bare feet on the floor
I have a 30 inseam, at least that's the pants I wear. I might be a bit less than that, though. I wasn't totally flat footed with the stock seat and adding a Russell put me up another inch or so. If the wife is riding with me and we have full gear I can flat foot quite easily. Other times not so much. I'm generally leaning one way or the other. Not much, but still leaning. It's not enough for me to forego the experience.
If you have to be absolutely flat foot on this bike then it isn't for you, unfortunately. Lowering it much castrates it depending on your riding style. I like it a bit sporty in the twisties. Lowering would really suck for my riding. Why buy it to ride straights all the time? You would be wasting your money.
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I had a hard time with the stock seat and doing the tip toe deal. Got the Corbin seat and now can flat foot my right foot while left is on brake. Just sayin'
FX
So with the Corbin install the rear brake lever is moved to the left side of the bike? :o
Or is that your other right foot? ;)
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So with the Corbin install the rear brake lever is moved to the left side of the bike? :o
Or is that your other right foot? ;)
I think he bought the bike in England. :o
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Lowering it much castrates it depending on your riding style. I like it a bit sporty in the twisties. Lowering would really suck for my riding.
Lowering an inch seems to be the most that is "safe" and "reasonable" and doesn't appear to pose any danger or reduce cornering much; at least on a gen2 with a non-heavy rider. But I absolutely think lowering more than that is not just going to ruin twisties, but pose serious danger from bottoming out, pan scraping, front fender hitting.... stuff like that.
Why buy it to ride straights all the time? You would be wasting your money.
Not necessarily. There are LOTS of loud, low-performance, low-tech, annoying, vibrationy, Harley-type bikes out there on the road... many of which would be completely inappropriate for "twisties", yet quite friendly for shorter legged people. However, one might want a Concours for all the other things in which it is so much better than "cruisers"- smoothness, power, quietness, technology, reliability, style, weather protection. Even if it means losing some cornering due to lowering.
Not everyone has the same riding goals. I know you know that, I am not picking on your post. I am just clarifying for those people who love to yell out "maybe this bike is not for you", wrongly thinking there are lower-height alternatives out there that retain all the things that a sport-touring bike can offer. Personally, I would rather have no bike at all than some V-Twin thing.
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Not everyone has the same riding goals.
:yikes:
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I think he bought the bike in England. :o
Nothing wrong with that, mate! :thumbs: :chugbeer:
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Looks like you didn't read the lowering thread I offered, at all. Oh well; I tried. Good luck.
Don't beat yourself up so much. I read it all. Sounded like a lot of work and expense for a few inches. And he never got the amount he expected from each thing he tried.
I probably would get a 1400 if I could get the balls of my feet firmly on the ground. I think it's my age as much as anything.
I lift every other day and am on a stationary bike the other days. But at my age you do have to be careful.
Sounds like the shorter guys here are very thoughtful and careful (and pre-plan) what the do with their 1400 and where they do it. That sounds very smart to me.
But they are younger and can always remember where they parked their bike. Even more importantly when riding with a group, they can remember which bike is theirs! :banghead: :chugbeer:
Maxtog: I agree with you about the HD (V twins) too. It's not that they are too tall that keeps me away from them as much as it is the fact that I can READ and WRITE and I know how to SHAVE! :battle: :stirpot:
That being said, I just rode my friends Road King and it was the smoothest ride I have ever experienced on a big bike in 55 years of riding. Talk about smooth! But it's still not for me.
I really thank all of you for your input. I think I will try the 1400. I may just run it without tires. That should give me the 3 or 4" I'm looking for. :rotflmao:
Again, thanks to all.
I should also say that at the present time I have an st1100, Valk Standard and an 1800 GW.
So I have all classes of riding covered.
I can ff the Valk and the GW, but am getting a little tipsy on the St1100. I love them all. But would feel better on the ST if I were Taller.
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Clark go to your local C-14 store with two 10" long 2 x 4's. Lay them on the floor on either side of the bike and throw your leg over.
Then you will know if you could make the bike reasonable for you or not. :thumbs:
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Clark go to your local C-14 store with two 10" long 2 x 4's. Lay them on the floor on either side of the bike and throw your leg over.
Then you will know if you could make the bike reasonable for you or not. :thumbs:
OK Blue, time for us to go back to the Arena. Obama Care is up today. :banghead:
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Don't beat yourself up so much. I read it all.
OK, cool
Sounded like a lot of work and expense for a few inches. And he never got the amount he expected from each thing he tried.
It was a lot of work and research, but that is what it takes for any bike. Fortunately, most of the research is right there in the thread, so at least that part is easy.
But here is the key: No powerful, non-cruiser bike is going to be much lower or easier to deal with than the Concours. So if you want a powerful non-cruiser, then you are going to have to consider all this, regardless.
And *I* can ride the Concours after a few mods. I have been for over a year now. And it has not been dropped (knock on wood). And it appears that I have considerably shorter legs than you do.
I probably would get a 1400 if I could get the balls of my feet firmly on the ground. I think it's my age as much as anything.
You are only as old as your feel. (Unfortunately, in my case, I feel more like 63 instead of 43).
Sounds like the shorter guys here are very thoughtful and careful (and pre-plan) what the do with their 1400 and where they do it. That sounds very smart to me.
You have to plan ahead more than most people. Put your foot down in the wrong place and BAM. Park on a slightly wrong incline and you are screwed. That kind of thing.
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<snip>
But here is the key: No powerful, non-cruiser bike is going to be any lower or easier to deal with than the Concours. So if you want a powerful non-cruiser, then you are going to have to consider all this, regardless.
<snip>
I snipped the good stuff, but this part isn't completely correct. As just one example, the K1600GTL has a 29.5" (low) seat height. There are lots of powerful, non-cruiser bikes that are lower and lighter than the C14 as well. (The K16 is lower and heavier.) The C14 offers a great combination of features and pricing, but there are still lots of options out there. Especially if you are willing to chuck the bags. Or go with used or older bikes.
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I snipped the good stuff, but this part isn't completely correct. As just one example, the K1600GTL has a 29.5" (low) seat height.
That measurement is with the optional, lowest seat. When you do the same thing to the Concours, you have a claimed stock height of 32.1" with a claimed 1.4" lower seat, resulting in 30.7". So yes, there are other options, but they are all still pretty close to each other. Generally, if you need more than just 1 or 2 inches lower, there remains a problem and not many options. I should have worded my statement more like that (and I just edited it to say nothing much lower instead of nothing any lower). Thanks.
(I should also mention that in the K1600GTL example, I wouldn't have considered that as an option open to me, anyway, because it is completely unaffordable ($24,000 to $26,000!!))
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What do they do in Japan? Only sell bikes to tall Japaneese riders? :o
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What do they do in Japan? Only sell bikes to tall Japaneese riders? :o
I have often wondered that. Of course, modern Asians are getting taller... diet change and all. I think home-market bikes are different. Yet in the case of Kawasaki, that doesn't appear to be the case. When I was FINALLY able to find their site- the bikes are mostly all the same:
http://www.kawasaki-cp.khi.co.jp/mcy/street.html (http://www.kawasaki-cp.khi.co.jp/mcy/street.html)
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That measurement is with the optional, lowest seat. When you do the same thing to the Concours, you have a claimed stock height of 32.1" with a claimed 1.4" lower seat, resulting in 30.7". So yes, there are other options, but they are all still pretty close to each other. Generally, if you need more than just 1 or 2 inches lower, there remains a problem and not many options. I should have worded my statement more like that (and I just edited it to say nothing much lower instead of nothing any lower). Thanks.
(I should also mention that in the K1600GTL example, I wouldn't have considered that as an option open to me, anyway, because it is completely unaffordable ($24,000 to $26,000!!))
Fair enough, though seat and frame widths can make as much difference as seat height.
For fun, let's combine this thread with the short windshield thread and the removed the bags/new bike thread. For about 10% of the cost of a new K16GTL, I picked up a 95 RF900R with 12.5k miles, cleaned it up, put on PR3's and a few farkles. Per contemporary road tests, it is only a hair slower than the C14 in the quarter, and is a bit faster on the top end. 10.9 @ 127.5 & 159+mph. Not as smooth as the C14, but nice handling. Even though the manual says the seat is only .4" lower than the C14's (31.7 vs 32.1), I can flatfoot the RF easily. Here's a few links to some reviews: http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs/two-for-the-real-world-2520.html (http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs/two-for-the-real-world-2520.html) http://www.suzukicycles.org/RF-series/RF900_articles.shtml (http://www.suzukicycles.org/RF-series/RF900_articles.shtml)
All I'm really saying is that there are a lot of choices out there, some/many of which may work even for the non-giants among us.
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Fair enough, though seat and frame widths can make as much difference as seat height.
For fun, let's combine this thread with the short windshield thread and the removed the bags/new bike thread. For about 10% of the cost of a new K16GTL, I picked up a 95 RF900R with 12.5k miles, cleaned it up, put on PR3's and a few farkles. Per contemporary road tests, it is only a hair slower than the C14 in the quarter, and is a bit faster on the top end. 10.9 @ 127.5 & 159+mph. Not as smooth as the C14, but nice handling. Even though the manual says the seat is only .4" lower than the C14's (31.7 vs 32.1), I can flatfoot the RF easily. Here's a few links to some reviews: http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs/two-for-the-real-world-2520.html (http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs/two-for-the-real-world-2520.html) http://www.suzukicycles.org/RF-series/RF900_articles.shtml (http://www.suzukicycles.org/RF-series/RF900_articles.shtml)
All I'm really saying is that there are a lot of choices out there, some/many of which may work even for the non-giants among us.
OK, but if your going to do that I'd just get a CBR Black Bird or go back to my Ninja 1100 and put givi bags on them.
I'm looking for something with a shaft drive. That leaves all those bikes out.
But they are all great bikes.
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OK, but if your going to do that I'd just get a CBR Black Bird or go back to my Ninja 1100 and put givi bags on them.
I'm looking for something with a shaft drive. That leaves all those bikes out.
But they are all great bikes.
Well, it's not like we really care what you wind up with. This is a fun game for us, and if it helps you out, that is great. At least now we have some more information to play with. Flat-foot and a shaft drive. Probably w/ bags, or at least optional bags. Still a lot of options. OTOH, you started just asking how to lower a c14, not asking us to pick your next bike for you. :)
Once you have your criteria in mind, it's easier to pick out a bike. Personally, I don't see any reason to have more that 2 shaft-drive bikes. I would have kept the BlackBird or the Ninja before going w/ an ST11. :)
Have fun with whatever you wind up with.
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I have a question.....why does Superman need a motorcycle? 8)
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These three guys were out camping in the mountains and drinking a few beers around the campfire. One of them points out that there was a cliff near there that had tremendous updrafts. They decided to go over and take a look. One of the old-timers told the new guy that the updraft was strong enough to hold a man up, and to prove it, he stepped off the cliff and just hung there in the breeze. He stepped back on to the cliff and finally talked the new guy into trying it. After some encouragement, he stepped of the cliff into the updraft and fell screeming to his death. The third camper turned to the first, and said "Superman, you are a mean drunk."
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Don't beat yourself up so much. I read it all. Sounded like a lot of work and expense for a few inches. And he never got the amount he expected from each thing he tried.
<snip>
I do not think it is expensive at all. I used muzzys lowering links which cost $60 used. It lowers the rear by about 1.5". Between that an losing 10 lbs enabled me to comfortably plant my foot. I still cannot quite flat foot with my doc martins when riding solo, but I get enough surface area to be very confident. With my wife and gear on, I can easily flat foot. A few good things about muzzys is that after installing, you do not have to do anything else ! no lowering the front, no cutting the side stand, no losing the center stand !! Of course, it will be harder to put the bike on centerstand. But the rear wheel on a pice of 2x4 or 1X4 (or 1X6), it is easy as pie.
And I cannot say this enough, one important thing for me was getting used to the bike. Coming from cruisers, the bike felt so intimidating to me!! All the top heaviness and tallness ! oh my! Almost felt like I made the wrong choice. Couples years down the road, my cruiser is now collecting dust. Having half a mind to sell it and pocket some money.
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I do not think it is expensive at all. I used muzzys lowering links which cost $60 used. [...]
He was really referring to MY costs- between the seat, the links, the stand, and the boots.... none of it used equipment. But I knew before I bought the bike I would have to spend several hundred dollars to make it usable.
It lowers the rear by about 1.5".
No. I measured this VERY carefully, multiple times. The Muzzy links lower the rear by exactly 1".
A few good things about muzzys is that after installing, you do not have to do anything else ! no lowering the front, no cutting the side stand
I strongly disagree with that. Lowering the rear and not lowering the front is generally a bad idea. Not only does it not lower the bike as much as it can be for the rider, but it changes the handling and geometry of the bike in ways that are not good. When you lower the back, it is best practice to lower the front by the same amount, unless you know and understand exactly how the handling is going to change and know what you want.
After lowering, the bike is not sturdy enough with the stock side stand. I am not sure why your experience would be different...
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Muzzy links, did not lower front, I got an inch and a half lower, corners great, no change to side stand (its a tad more upright but not an issue watching how you park), and center stand works as reported, I put the rear tire on a 1x6 and its easy. Others I have talked to at the nationals, etc love the bike lowered as I do. On my 2nd year with it lowered, wish I would have done it right away.
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Muzzy links, did not lower front, I got an inch and a half lower, corners great, no change to side stand (its a tad more upright but not an issue watching how you park), and center stand works as reported, I put the rear tire on a 1x6 and its easy. Others I have talked to at the nationals, etc love the bike lowered as I do. On my 2nd year with it lowered, wish I would have done it right away.
I suppose it is possible they changed the design and you have an earlier model. Still a bad idea to lower rear and not front.