Replacemet FOB 2011 C14

[mvjr1904]

Since the dealer lost my credit card key, the Service Manager said they would get me a new one "no charge". I should be happy, I guess there doing me a favor. I told the Service Manager it's been 90 days since I purchased the bike and no plates or title. I told the Service Manager "with all I've been through, can I buy a replacement FOB and get some kind of discount"?  He called me back and left a phone message.  He said retail price is $267 but I can get it for $215 plus tax. Not sure if there will be any additional fees for programming.  I'm going to call 2 other local dealers and ask for FOB prices and any reprogramming costs. Stay tuned

[m919]

Wow, I think you need to speak to someone higher on the food chain then the service manager. 3 months no tags, no title and lost your fob!

[wendel]

There will be an additional charge for programming, a replacement key for the fob and having the replacement key cut to fit your locks. Have them reprogram it, buy a new key and cut the new key for free. Go to BikeBandit.com or Ron Ayers.com for the price of the fob.

[C1xRider]

Either that price is for the Active FOB (not the Passive FOB), or they are including some very high programming charges in that quote.  The Passive FOB should cost less than $35.

Look here at part number 21175-0256  : http://www.riderschoiceracing.com/fiche_section_detail.asp?section=1418307&category=Motorcycles&make=KAWASAKI&year=2011&fveh=39446

Regardless, if the Dealer lost it, the Dealer should replace it - at no charge!

[mvjr1904]

Dealer will replace the passive FOB and I'm sure all the associated labor costs. I am looking to buy the active FOB (21175A). But looking at the link, my dealer is not giving me any discount at all. I misspoke..... They dropped the price $3.00  how could I pass that up!!

[C1xRider]

Dealer will replace the passive FOB and I'm sure all the associated labor costs. I am looking to buy the active FOB (21175A). But looking at the link, my dealer is not giving me any discount at all. I misspoke..... They dropped the price $3.00  how could I pass that up!!

Ah, I missed that when I read your original post.  So they lost the passive FOB, they are going to replace it at no charge (as they should).  They've dragged their feet getting your DMV stuff processed causing you to not have plates and registration after 3 months.

After all this, you were asking them to give you a discount on a Active FOB, which it looks like they offered (from MSRP), but you didn't mention if the programming costs were included.

Yours was a reasonable request, and most dealers don't acknowledge you can buy stuff off the web for less than they will sell it to you.  So, if the prices you listed in your opening post haven't changed, they are doing OK in their minds.  The real thing to consider in that offer is if you can get them to program the new Active FOB for no charge.  If so, then it is a good deal.  Since they will be programming the Passive FOB anyway, they should be willing to do that (if they have both FOBs there at that time).

Also, it has been reported here before that the Key ECU only has 6, one time programming slots in it for FOB's, and once those have been used, the Key ECU will have to be replaced if another FOB needs to be added.  That costs a lot more money to replace.

[mvjr1904]

Valid point C1xRider.  As I mentioned, I'm going to contact 2 other dealer and ask about purchasing another active FOB and the total out the door price.  I am not loyal to any one dealer or vendor. Who ever gives me the best price will receive my business. Never knew about the Reprogramming comment you made.  Hopefully it will never come to that.

[dras]

Also, it has been reported here before that the Key ECU only has 6, one time programming slots in it for FOB's, and once those have been used, the Key ECU will have to be replaced if another FOB needs to be added.  That costs a lot more money to replace.

I think that statement is in error. There are 6 memory slots for fob's but it is my understanding that they are reusable. You just can't have more than 6 programmed in at one time. They can 'de-program' a lost fob and open up that memory slot again. If you buy a new active or passive fob online and take it somewhere to get it programmed to the bike, be sure you take ALL of the fob's you want to have programmed into the ECU. When I went through this they needed at least one working fob (active or passive) to get the ignition turned on in order to do any programming / de-programming in the bikes ECU. They then went through the programming sequence for ALL of my fobs - active and passive. Hope you get it worked out.

Dave

[stevewfl]

Stealerships.  One day the word will be out and no one will let the service departments touch their bikes.

[VirginiaJim]

I think that statement is in error. There are 6 memory slots for fob's but it is my understanding that they are reusable.

Dave

Nope, it's not.  It's a permanent write to the ECU.  Once those six slots are filled, that's it.  According to my 08 manual, page 1-23 under the General Information section in the front.

'Once a piece of memory is used for registering a key in the KIPASS ECU, that piece of memory cannot be reused.'

I don't think that has changed in any of the model years.

[Conrad]

Nope, it's not.  It's a permanent write to the ECU.  Once those six slots are filled, that's it.  According to my 08 manual, page 1-23 under the General Information section in the front.

'Once a piece of memory is used for registering a key in the KIPASS ECU, that piece of memory cannot be reused.'

I don't think that has changed in any of the model years.

Jim's right, of course. I think that the confusion comes from the fact that it's the Immobilizer memory slots for the passive section that can rewritten.

See this K-Tech pdf for a bit more info.

http://www.zggtr.org/MGalleryItem.php?id=260

[mvjr1904]

Very interesting link. I feel more educated after reading it. My dealer implied it was a lengthy process to reprogram a new FOB.
Are the K-Tech News technical resource Pdf's available on line for viewing? How/where can I locate more? First I heard or saw about the heat deflectors.

[C1xRider]

Nope, it's not.  It's a permanent write to the ECU.  Once those six slots are filled, that's it.  According to my 08 manual, page 1-23 under the General Information section in the front.

'Once a piece of memory is used for registering a key in the KIPASS ECU, that piece of memory cannot be reused.'

I don't think that has changed in any of the model years.

Very interesting info there Jim, as I had only read it on this forum, and didn't know it was actually printed in the 08 FSM.  Thanks!  It also says the 6 slots of memory in the Steering Lock unit are re-writable

That info is not present in the 2010 FSM.  In fact, the whole "Technical Information - KIPASS" section was removed.  That's disturbing, since there's a lot of good stuff right there.

After further looking, I see they replaced all the Tech Info sections.  The Variable Valve Timing, Electrical Windshield, KIPASS, and Tetra Lever Shaft Drive sections are gone, replaced with KTRC, Economy Mode, K-ACT, Grip Warmer, and Storage case descriptions.

WTH?  Were they worried about consuming a couple more trees?  Did they think that info was no longer relevant?  I don't get it. 

[B.D.F.]

The whole fob programming issue is confusing because both thoughts are correct- the memory slots are a one- time use as well as being re-programmable and reusable. See how confusing? KiPass has two different and separate areas; one is the actual KiPass ECU, located under the seat and that is programmed to recognize RF fobs (the ones that work with a battery). Then there is the unit in the ignition switch housing and that is programmed to recognize RFID fobs when they are held close to the ign. switch. That unit (ign. switch housing) also has six fob slots but they can be reused and are not permanently written.

It would actually be possible to have a bike that has used all the ECU programming slots and has no valid fobs available but can still be used using the RFID portion of KiPass only.

Brian

I think that statement is in error. There are 6 memory slots for fob's but it is my understanding that they are reusable. You just can't have more than 6 programmed in at one time. They can 'de-program' a lost fob and open up that memory slot again. If you buy a new active or passive fob online and take it somewhere to get it programmed to the bike, be sure you take ALL of the fob's you want to have programmed into the ECU. When I went through this they needed at least one working fob (active or passive) to get the ignition turned on in order to do any programming / de-programming in the bikes ECU. They then went through the programming sequence for ALL of my fobs - active and passive. Hope you get it worked out.

Dave

[VirginiaJim]

Makes my brane hurt.

[Conrad]

Very interesting link. I feel more educated after reading it. My dealer implied it was a lengthy process to reprogram a new FOB.
Are the K-Tech News technical resource Pdf's available on line for viewing? How/where can I locate more? First I heard or saw about the heat deflectors.

I'm sure that those K-Tech pdfs are available to dealers in their system but I don't know where us mere mortals can get em.

[maxtog]

I'm sure that those K-Tech pdfs are available to dealers in their system but I don't know where us mere mortals can get em.

We are not supposed to, since the only thing Kawasaki sells/makes available are the paper factory  manuals and no ktech stuff.  On the manual, Kawasaki (unlike many other manufacturers) is too worried that a PDF version will destroy sales because people will steal/share them (which they do).  They are floating out there in the ether, however; and if one already purchased the genuine factory manual, there really isn't anything morally wrong with also having the PDF.  I think they don't want the ktech stuff in the hands of non-dealers, which is sad.

Of interest is that Nissan/Infiniti doesn't even have a paper version.  When I  bought the factory manuals (twice- two different cars), they were plain PDF downloads.   Nissan tech bulletins are also restricted but somehow get posted to the forums, probably by dealers themselves.  I don't understand the secretness, myself.  Maybe it competes with the software packages that dealers have to pay for.

[mvjr1904]

Why educate the consumer with a technical service bulliten? That would reduce or elinimate a potential service call, thus less potential profits. If the White House is not immune to leaks, I'm sure the K-Tech PDF's will make it to the web, if there not out there already.

[Breaker19]

Why educate the consumer with a technical service bulliten? That would reduce or elinimate a potential service call, thus less potential profits. If the White House is not immune to leaks, I'm sure the K-Tech PDF's will make it to the web, if there not out there already.

Secret Squirrel Sh*t, gotta love it, eh? lol 

[Breaker19]

We are not supposed to, since the only thing Kawasaki sells/makes available are the paper factory  manuals and no ktech stuff.  On the manual, Kawasaki (unlike many other manufacturers) is too worried that a PDF version will destroy sales because people will steal/share them (which they do).  They are floating out there in the ether, however; and if one already purchased the genuine factory manual, there really isn't anything morally wrong with also having the PDF.  I think they don't want the ktech stuff in the hands of non-dealers, which is sad.

It's simple: they don't want an educated consumer. If you go into any dealer and start talking tech language appropriate to their product or brand, they get nervous. I saw it many times at two different Harley dealers. If I did some research and went into the dealer with a few hypotheses about a problem, they'd get all flustered because they don't know that material... In defense of their position, however, dealer techs are paid to wrench on bikes, not sit around and search forums like this. It's easy to go into a dealer and simply know a lot more about an individual problem or component than they do, unless they've been briefed by a service bulletin or similar update.

I've found of late that it's often better to simply play the dumb card upon entry into their world, then bring out the guns if they try and throw a curve ball past. I could tell you all a great story about my '06 Nomad 1600 and a swing-arm lubrication debacle, where I completely slammed the then service manager who was trying to sell me a bill of goods, using the factory service manual (that I bought) to prove they were trying to scam me. Went up to the owner level. Guess what, he's gone. I'm still around... lol