Author Topic: Foamed oil?  (Read 8888 times)

Offline Summit670

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #20 on: October 24, 2011, 07:45:19 PM »
Goatmar - I would remove enough oil so that the level viewed thru the window is correct.  If the oil still looks chocolaty after you've gone for a nice 30 minute ride (let the bike sit for a few minutes then check to make sure the oil level is correct) then I'd say something is amiss.

Temp gauge should also go 1/4 to 1/2 during this ride.  If it stays on cold then I'd fix that prob first because the engine may not be getting warm enough to burn off any condensation.

There should be no need to change oil.  If it is milky/chocolaty after this then changing oil isn't going to help, imho.
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Offline T Cro ®

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #21 on: October 24, 2011, 07:54:40 PM »
We are not saying that you have too much oil in the bike; you have told us that you have too much oil in the bike. Not only have the recommendations come from long time Concors owners (my 01 was bought new) and MOB has owned a  Concours for much longer than I have; these recommendations are culled directly from both Owner's & Service Manuals alike not pulled from thin air or some faulted interpation.

Leave you bike on it's center stand overnight and if in the morning the oil level is above the sight glass you still have too much oil. Once the oil level is above the glass you have absolutely no idea how much oil is in the bike other than TOO much. The oil level should never be above the upper line in the glass window which is around 3/4 of the glass. I'm not trying to sound overly rude but your problem is/was too much oil with no if ans or buts. Correct the oil level and be done with it!
Tony P. Crochet
(SOLD) 01 Concours Winner of COG Most Modified in 2010

Offline goatmar

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #22 on: October 24, 2011, 08:09:35 PM »
No malice detected Tony, I know what your saying.  I'll take out some more, the window is covered.  Will keep you all posted.  I did take out the oil sensor and cleaned it up and put it back in.

Okay here's the level now, been sitting tonight on the center stand.
Dave Muzzey
COG#7957
'01 Connie "BLUE"

Offline Leo

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #23 on: October 24, 2011, 08:34:35 PM »
T, It looks like I had it backward.   I was told that even one nick in a ball bearing would eat the race until it destroyed all the bearings, so you had to be more careful with them.  We have both seen some pretty nicked up journals actually last pretty long in use.   It probably something to do with how much area the force is spread upon.    I really never had any engine design training, so I just connected the only two dots I had.   I better re evaluate the conclusion.   Either way, that little old 40 horse 650 engine lasted a long time with no oil filter.  I remember it only made about 5 PSIG of oil pressure, so it was really more of a glorified splash lube system.
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Offline T Cro ®

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #24 on: October 25, 2011, 06:23:22 AM »
No malice detected Tony, I know what your saying.  I'll take out some more, the window is covered.  Will keep you all posted.  I did take out the oil sensor and cleaned it up and put it back in.

Okay here's the level now, been sitting tonight on the center stand.

Great that looks perfect now.....
Tony P. Crochet
(SOLD) 01 Concours Winner of COG Most Modified in 2010

Offline T Cro ®

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #25 on: October 25, 2011, 06:37:56 AM »
T, It looks like I had it backward.   I was told that even one nick in a ball bearing would eat the race until it destroyed all the bearings, so you had to be more careful with them.  We have both seen some pretty nicked up journals actually last pretty long in use.   It probably something to do with how much area the force is spread upon.    I really never had any engine design training, so I just connected the only two dots I had.   I better re evaluate the conclusion.   Either way, that little old 40 horse 650 engine lasted a long time with no oil filter.  I remember it only made about 5 PSIG of oil pressure, so it was really more of a glorified splash lube system.

My Ural runs on a ball bearing crank.... It has an oil pump that makes no more than a "few" pounds of oil pressure and I'm told that it's main propose is to pump oil through the oil filer; I've read on the Ural forum of an owner who put thousands of miles on his motor with a broken oil pump shaft. This engine is a lower RPM motor and it does use the crank to dip into the oil and splash oil where needed. There are even a pair of oil channels to run oil out to the cylinder heads to lube the valve train. And while a sliver of metal might be bad for a bearing race it needs to be harder than the race to cause real damage and screen will do a fine job of filtering out such particulates.
Tony P. Crochet
(SOLD) 01 Concours Winner of COG Most Modified in 2010

Offline goatmar

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #26 on: November 03, 2011, 04:50:09 PM »
Well after a few weeks, no problems....... I don't know what happened.  Maybe cleaning out the sensor and the wire fixed it. :o  I have no idea....... but at least there's no issue now.
Dave Muzzey
COG#7957
'01 Connie "BLUE"

Offline vinny

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2011, 03:13:31 AM »
The oil level being correct is the cure to the problem.
Cleaning electrical connections is always a good idea - but was not the fix.
The oil in your last photo was at the correct level and LOOKED like CLEAN oil.  :)

Offline 2fast

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #28 on: November 09, 2011, 05:29:29 PM »
Glad it looks your issue is cleared up Dave! Now to slightly hijack this thread, I would like to revisit the Scotts stainless steel filter question. I have one that came with my Vstrom, and it is on there now. Are there particles smaller than 35 microns that some paper filters will catch? That is the claimed filtering level by Scotts.

Superior Filtration:
This should be the last oil filter you will ever buy! Made from laser cut, medical grade, 304 stainless steel micronic filter cloth, this filter provides 200% more filter area in many cases. Most good paper filters will pass particles in the 90 to 95 micron range, and some tested, as much as 300 microns. Sand is about 125 microns and a white blood cell approximately 25 microns. Our stainless filter catches items down to 35 microns "absolute", which is about 3 times better than most good paper or brass filters. The pleat seam is welded, able to withstand up to 600 degrees in our filter, not glued, like paper filters.


Scott's website http://scottsonline.com/products.php?PartType=3

I'm just wondering if there is evidence that these things are really junk? They claim to filter about 3 times better than paper.  If this is not true, I got no problem going back to disposables and selling the Scott.
Brian in Minnesota
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Offline SteveJ.

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #29 on: November 09, 2011, 07:30:06 PM »
I'm just wondering if there is evidence that these things are really junk? They claim to filter about 3 times better than paper.  If this is not true, I got no problem going back to disposables and selling the Scott.
For your perusal:

Lifted from the Amzoil site:

AMSOIL Ea® Oil Filters (EaO, Ea15K) have one of the best efficiency ratings in the automotive/light-truck market. Ea Oil Filters provide a filtering efficiency in accordance with industry standard ISO 4548-12 of 98.7 percent at 20 microns, while competitive filters demonstrate efficiencies as low as 51 percent.


Scoot's is good down to 35 microns. That would settle it for me.
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Offline T Cro ®

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2011, 11:36:00 AM »
Not trying to default the Scott's Filter at all but from the point of view and opinion from an Mechanical Engineer is that oil only needs to be just so clean to fully protect an engine; anything beyond that is just hype and/or overkill... Too fine of a filtering media no matter if it be paper or metal screen can cause more harm than good by getting clogged up and causing the bypass to open up and circulate unfiltered oil through the engine. We clambered for how many years for someone to invent an adapter so that we could use a spin-on automotive type filter on these bikes to which Dan Berman did exactly that and that adapter is still sold today by Murph at Murphskits.com now we want to regress backward in time to a filter that in all likelihood is not any better for the engines longevity than a common paper or synthetic media that we must cleaned by hand.... No thanks I'll stick to my spin-on oil filters.....
Tony P. Crochet
(SOLD) 01 Concours Winner of COG Most Modified in 2010

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #31 on: November 12, 2011, 12:39:32 PM »
heheheheh
T, we all have our opinions on filters, and I for one am thanking Dan for the SPOOFAK, it was the best farkle to come along since the MOB Blind Melon Chittlin' Side Stand Extender.....

it's funny, we have been trying to get a 4 into 1 exhaust on this bike for almost 10 years, and the boys over on the C14 zone are going full circle, and speding big bucks to install the ZX dual system...go figure....just goes to show evy-body has diffr'nt thoughts...(I like my chopped down stock Electrolux muffler.... ;D

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Offline AZBiker

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Re: Foamed oil?
« Reply #32 on: November 12, 2011, 09:43:23 PM »
heheheheh
T, we all have our opinions on filters, and I for one am thanking Dan for the SPOOFAK, it was the best farkle to come along since the MOB Blind Melon Chittlin' Side Stand Extender.....

it's funny, we have been trying to get a 4 into 1 exhaust on this bike for almost 10 years, and the boys over on the C14 zone are going full circle, and speding big bucks to install the ZX dual system...go figure....just goes to show evy-body has diffr'nt thoughts...(I like my chopped down stock Electrolux muffler.... ;D

I'm planning on chopping mine down to the DOT text and riveting it back together.  You have any pics of yours?
rubber side down,

Derek
93 Cali black & red