Fork oil help

[Jet86]

Sprung a leak in the left fork and leaked out all the fluid, I think it was just dirt holding the seal open so i lifted the dust seal up and made a plastic fork thingy out of a plastic bottle and ran it around the main seal hoping to dislodge any dirt.

Question is How do i get fork oil back in there?? i don't want to take it apart if i don't have to, can i use this big syringe and inject some fresh oil back up in there threw the little screw hole, 1986 connie.

4 years ago i replaced all the seals and put in new sonic springs, the seals still look good to me.

[connie_rider]

Bike on center stand, front elevated off the ground.
Towel over gas tank.
Loosen the (upper) pinch bolts on both of the fork legs.
Remove the fork caps. (Be careful spring will shoot the cap)
OOPs;  just saw you have an 86. On an 86 you will probably have to remove handle bar base bolts and set bars to the side.
Allow bike to settle on front wheel.
Remove springs.

Look at fluid levels in both fork legs.  Should be the same. (Approx 6 1/2)
Assuming the leg that leaked is low,,, add fluid to that leg.
  (If both are low, add fluid to both fork legs).
Add until levels the same.   (Approx 6 1/2)
  (If you add too much, suck oil out to desired depth).
Re-install springs.
Raise front of bike.
Push in place and Install caps. (Speed handle works great)
Tighten pinch bolts.
Go ride.

Ride safe, Ted

[RFH87_Connie]

If they are empty or your know the exact amount you want to add, you can do it thru the drain screw at the bottom on the first gen bikes.  I made a special hollow screw (hole down the middle with the head cut off) that goes into the drain screw with a short hose (12") attached.  This hose then goes into your container of pre-measured fluid.  You then remove the schrader valve where you add air to the forks, and apply a vacuum.  I sucks the fluid right in.  Remove the hose and screw while the vacuum is still pulling and put the drain screw back in.  Do them both so you know you have the same amount in each so they are balanced.  I change my fluid at least once a year this way.  This hose also works great for draining with a little pressure applied.

Or you can do the other way as Ted mentioned.  Until you know the amount of fluid this is the correct way.

[Jet86]

The left leg is Empty, right led should still be full because the leak was only on the left, can the right leg drain out the left?? and make them both empty?.

I might as well check the right leg too and make sure both are empty so i have something to go by, not sure i can do this, never done it myself, 4 years ago i bought all the parts and had someone else do it and the labor cost me $160 so i really dont want to go that route again.

If both are empty how many onces do i add?

[Jet86]

urrr i don't have a mitty vac or anything like that.

[RFH87_Connie]

I put in 11.5 ounces on each side.  This of course can be adjust to your riding preferences.

The cross-over tube is located well above the fluid level so it won't drain from one to the other if the bike is upright.  If its been in there 4 years, it is definitely time to change the fluid.

I use an old 20lb freon tank with a 6' x 1/4" flexible tube attached and pull a vacuum on it by using the car or truck's vacuum line while it is running.  The tank has the valve on top.  Great for oil/fluid changes.  When its full I just pressurize it and flip it upside down to pump it into a recycle container.  These are easy to make if you can find a tank that doesn't have a check valve.

[Jet86]

The conk is the only wheels i have, for me and my situation it sounds like pulling the springs and just dump in the 11.5 once per leg would be the best, why must the springs come out to fill with oil? and just how much pressure is on the fork cap bolts? could  i just hold a towl over it while loosening or is it gonna be like a bullet and go flying across the parking lot where i will never find it, that's why i don't like to take things like this apart, if i lose something like that I'm stuck with no ride til parts are shipped then hope i can get it back together.

 

[RFH87_Connie]

Jack the front wheel off of the ground.  Do not do it with the wheel on the ground.  Only do one leg at a time.  Do not mangle the fork cap or it will jamb.  Use a rag so it doesn't pop your hand.  Removing things is for cleaning maintenance.

[Jet86]

oh i have the sonic 1.2 springs in there and pcv pipe from murph, the springs was VERY stiff for the first year and thats how i wanted it because it had to much front brake dive with the stock springs. it handled So much better with new springs and still does with no oil lol..

[Jet86]

Okay thanks, i'm gonna start on it tomorrow at first sun up.

[connie_rider]

Jett, tell us a bit about your tool situation?
What RFH is suggesting will take a bit of (Tool manufacturing).
I really like his idea (for an 86). With the simple/special tool it would be easy to do.

My method will take Metric Allen wrenches, metric wrenches, a socket set, probably a screwdriver, something to accurately measure fluid, and some form of measuring tool.
 Regardless, it's pretty simple to do.
If you don't have tools, find someone who does. Preferably another COGger...


The 86 and other early Connies had a equalizing host that runs between the 2 fork tubes.
If you had 1 fork badly leaking, it's probable that some oil passed (thru that hose)  from the non leaking leg to the leaker because of pressure difference.

Whatever method you use, I suggest you remove the drain screws on both fork legs and drain the old oil. It will be dark grey.
After that, do the refill.

NOTE: For many years I've used Automatic Transmission fluid as my Fork Fluid.
          ATF is a Non foaming 10-15 wt Hydraulic oil that should work fine for you.
          Costs far less.....

Ride safe, Ted

[Jet86]

To late on the fluid, just payed $16.18 for 1 quart at the kawie shop for bel-ray 15wt, i no i no, Murph has it for like 12.50 and its the better maxama brand but i need it now not next week.

i to thought about the ATF but since i will hopefully only need to buy it once or twice a year i don't mind paying for fork oil..

I think i have the tools to do the job i just hope i have the know how, A better place to work would be great but no such place, i hate Apt living, i have to make sure i can get the job done in one day, cant leave my bike tore apart' so like if i loose a major bolt or something i cant let the bike sit til i get parts shipped to me, i still have to put it back together whether i have the parts or not, then i have to tear it down again when the parts arrive 

the simple idea with the tank and stuff sounds really good but im no good at making things like that and have no place to store it. small apt and closet is full of conni parts nuts & bolts and a few tool boxes and socket sets.
I have a good little scissor jack but i am still worried about her falling over cause we all know what breaks when that happens.

I have to say i have learned a lot from this forum, i think just about every person on hear has helped me in one way or another.

one more thing to add is i have never needed air in the shocks since i went to the stiff sonics.

[connie_rider]

Scissor Jack would work to raise the front wheel off the ground.
Tire only needs to be a tiny bit off the ground.

I forgot to add, after you add the fluid (to both legs), exercise the front end up and down to work air out.

Assuming the leg that leaked is low,,, add fluid to that leg.
  (If both are low, add fluid to both fork legs).
after you add the fluid (to both legs), exercise the front end up and down to work air out
Add until levels the same.   (Approx 6 1/2)
  (If you add too much, suck oil out to desired depth).
Re-install springs.
Raise front of bike.

Good luck.
Ride safe, Ted

[Jet86]

Job Complete

Thanks guys you was right it wasn't that hard at all and i did not need to remove the handle bars, but it did take me more than 3 hours but a lot of it was clean up because i made a big oily mess even with card board under the bike. but hey it was my first time, there was still a little oil in the left fork witch i thought was bone dry so hopefully it did not do any damage to the seals as i said i think it was just dirt holding it open.

I only went for a 5 mile ride so i don't know if i fixed the leak or not but so fare so good and i did flush both forks out with fresh oil, i will post back in a week or so with final results weather the leak came back or not.

Thank you All for your help... 

[connie_rider]

Great!
Let us know how she does.

Ride safe, Ted

[MAN OF BLUES]

You guys do know 86 forks rely on "a distance from top of tube level with forks fully extended measurement " don't ya?
Volume in ounces is not reliable for them. Wish I would have seen this sooner.

[connie_rider]

Hello MOB

Yea, I know the 86 was measured; springs out/forks extended.

When I had my 86 I did that and then compressed forks.
 6 1/2 compressed worked out fine.
Compressed is easiest way to see fluid level in a parking lot, so we advised that way.

Not sure why Kawasaki specified it extended, but this was easiest for now.
I suspect that was because fluid could move thru the tube with them compressed.
I agree; Volumn measurement is NEVER as exact as fluid level measurement.

NOTE: He may have a bad seal in 1 tube.
          If it's leaking, will have to pull forks to replace seal.

[Summit670]

RF87, that is a great idea about using the drain hole and air valve combination to fill.  I'll have to keep that in mind.

To pull a vacuum, maybe just use a shop-vac and reduce the end of the hose down with some duct tape or something.   

[RFH87_Connie]

You guys do know 86 forks rely on "a distance from top of tube level with forks fully extended measurement " don't ya?
Volume in ounces is not reliable for them. Wish I would have seen this sooner.

I know exactly what you are saying, that is why I said if you know the "exact amount to add".  And to clarify for anyone else looking at this later, the early models want 355mm or 14" (or your preferred level) from the top of the tube measured down the center of the tube.  That said, if you are doing "regular" street riding and a little "playing around" you will never detect that the level is a few millimeters off between the tubes, especially with air buffered forks with a crossover, nor will it hurt anything as long as you haven't added excess fluid.  Excess fliud can get pushed out around the seal which doesn't mean its self-adjusting its level.

But, like MOB said, there is a correct way to do it if you don't have good experience with this.  That would be to tear them down, flush them out, and refill then to a measured length from the top, not just add a volume of fluid.  "Mud" tends to build up in the bottom (and kind of add a haze to everything else) and can contaminate (or at least make it look dirty) the new fluid pretty quickly.  It is good to tear them down every couple of years.  If you have torn them down, when refilling, add 11 ounces, then compress the forks a few times to burp any air out.  Now check the fluid height, then add small amounts until you get them exact.  Or you can overfill slightly, then put a premarked vacuum tube/hose down inside them and suck the level down to get it exact (that's what I do).  Either way, buy a quart of fluid (of your preference) before you start.

[Jet86]

I put exactly 10 ounces in each fork, that should be ok right? 

first i drained all fluid and pumped the forks til no more came out, then added some fluid to each fork and let it drain out til it went from gray to the new fluid color, i pumped the forks some more til nothing came out again, then i added 10 ounces to each fork.

it doesn't need to be perfect just needs to stop leaking & so fare so good.