Front brake pads

[wb57]

Just noticed my front right brake pads are essentially gone, but the left side still has a lot of usable life.  I know this is common for this bike with the linked brakes.

Question: is it necessary or even recommended to replace both sides simultaneously?  I'll get the EBC HH pads and assume the OEMs are comparable.

Thanks.

[Stephen.G.Fiddes]

Replace both.  EBC HH are good pads, commonly used. OEM's are considered the preference for these particular bikes, but I have HH on mine right now. They work fine.

[B.D.F.]

I would not hesitate to replace the pads on only one side. No reason to do both if both sides are not worn. Just my <free> opinion though, of course :-)

I have used Gen. 1 OEM, Gen. 2 OEM and EBC and overall, prefer Gen. 2 OEM (C-14 pads 2010 or later). All C-14 pads fit all year bikes so using the earlier or late type pads is not a problem.

The OEM pads also have that wear indicator groove which I find quite useful.

Brian

Just noticed my front right brake pads are essentially gone, but the left side still has a lot of usable life.  I know this is common for this bike with the linked brakes.

Question: is it necessary or even recommended to replace both sides simultaneously?  I'll get the EBC HH pads and assume the OEMs are comparable.

Thanks.

[wb57]

I would not hesitate to replace the pads on only one side. No reason to do both if both sides are not worn. Just my <free> opinion though, of course :-)

I have used Gen. 1 OEM, Gen. 2 OEM and EBC and overall, prefer Gen. 2 OEM (C-14 pads 2010 or later). All C-14 pads fit all year bikes so using the earlier or late type pads is not a problem.

The OEM pads also have that wear indicator groove which I find quite useful.

Brian

I guess part of my question is are the Gen 2 OEM (currently on bike) and EBCs close enough in compound that it wouldn't matter if one side was different than the other?  I'm going to order two sets, but I am cheap enough to only do one side if it won't cause a problem.

Thanks, some more.

[wb57]

Replace both.  EBC HH are good pads, commonly used. OEM's are considered the preference for these particular bikes, but I have HH on mine right now. They work fine.

Thanks for the reply.  Mind if I ask why you'd do both sides if the left still have plenty of life left on them?

[MAN OF BLUES]

I kind of agree on the replace the worn side, and leave the other side, but if you intend to use something other than the equal of whats on there now, I'd do both sets and keep the compound typical. So if you want EBC's do both sets.

I'll tell you after using EBC's, they friction pucks are not as thick as the OEM's are.

[Jay]

Just noticed my front right brake pads are essentially gone, but the left side still has a lot of usable life.  I know this is common for this bike with the linked brakes.

Why is that common for this bike with the linked brakes?
Isn't one-sided brake pad wear a result of uneven distribution of caliper force and/or a sticky piston?

[wb57]

Why is that common for this bike with the linked brakes?
Isn't one-sided brake pad wear a result of uneven distribution of caliper force and/or a sticky piston?

On this bike, when you step on the rear brake, it also activates the right, front caliper.

[Conrad]

On this bike, when you step on the rear brake, it also activates the right, front caliper.

Only on the Gen 2s though. Another reason the Gen 1s are superior.   

[B.D.F.]

I found almost no difference between Gen. 2 OEM and EBC pads other than two things: 1) the EBC pads have no wear slot indicator and 2) the EBC's are noisy- they make a continuous 'hiss' when used.

As far as I know, all brake pads for a C-14 are HH rated and so there will not be a great difference in pad performance or longevity. So mixing pads or pad types on the same wheel would be fine with me. And besides that, even if there were some reasonably small, say 10%, difference in performance, what difference would it make? Braking slightly harder on one rotor will not present any problem.... after all, for years motorcycles only had one rotor so all the braking was on one side. Two rotors are used simply to increase brake efficiency and reduce pad wear but it is not needed for correct braking to happen.

If I were in your shoes, I would only replace the set of pads that required replacing.

Brian

I guess part of my question is are the Gen 2 OEM (currently on bike) and EBCs close enough in compound that it wouldn't matter if one side was different than the other?  I'm going to order two sets, but I am cheap enough to only do one side if it won't cause a problem.

Thanks, some more.

[wb57]

I found almost no difference between Gen. 2 OEM and EBC pads other than two things: 1) the EBC pads have no wear slot indicator and 2) the EBC's are noisy- they make a continuous 'hiss' when used.

As far as I know, all brake pads for a C-14 are HH rated and so there will not be a great difference in pad performance or longevity. So mixing pads or pad types on the same wheel would be fine with me. And besides that, even if there were some reasonably small, say 10%, difference in performance, what difference would it make? Braking slightly harder on one rotor will not present any problem.... after all, for years motorcycles only had one rotor so all the braking was on one side. Two rotors are used simply to increase brake efficiency and reduce pad wear but it is not needed for correct braking to happen.

If I were in your shoes, I would only replace the set of pads that required replacing.

Brian

Thanks.  I ordered two sets of the EBCs, but may replace only the right side based on this train of thought. 

[VirginiaJim]

If you do change brands/compounds, it might be a good idea to get the brake leavings off the rotor before the new pads are put on.

[wb57]

If you do change brands/compounds, it might be a good idea to get the brake leavings off the rotor before the new pads are put on.

Changing brands, yes.  Compounds - different manufacturers interpretation of the same compound, I suppose.  Not familiar with "brake leavings" or removing them.  Could you elaborate?  Spray the rotors with brake cleaner?  Resurface them somehow?

[B.D.F.]

Yep, resurface them. At least abrade away any remaining brake pad material, even if using the identical brake pads.

The way modern brakes work is that a significant amount of brake pad material is transferred to the rotors and in turn, it is that material that wears against the new brake pad material. Put another way, the brake pads leave a little brake pad on the rotor and that IS the wear surface. That is why the brake pads wear and the rotors do not, or at least not so much.

The problem is that the pad material is not deposited evenly and that causes brake pulsing. The way to fix it is to remove all the pad material from the rotor and that has to be done mechanically, not chemically or with any solvent. Turning the faces of the rotors (or drums) will do it but that also removes a bit of rotor material. An abrasive pad used against the rotor's surface works great- I like those hard, silicone carbine paint removal pads spun in a drill against the rotor while the rotor slowly turns.... it is easy to do if you have a wheel balancer. That way the surface is very even. But it can be done by hand, just be careful to take off all the original brake pad marks from the rotor and all will be well. And clean the abrasive off the rotors before using them so the abrasive does not get imbedded into the pad and continue to abrade the rotors.

This is how I do it:


Brian

Changing brands, yes.  Compounds - different manufacturers interpretation of the same compound, I suppose.  Not familiar with "brake leavings" or removing them.  Could you elaborate?  Spray the rotors with brake cleaner?  Resurface them somehow?

[wb57]

Yep, resurface them. At least abrade away any remaining brake pad material, even if using the identical brake pads.

The way modern brakes work is that a significant amount of brake pad material is transferred to the rotors and in turn, it is that material that wears against the new brake pad material. Put another way, the brake pads leave a little brake pad on the rotor and that IS the wear surface. That is why the brake pads wear and the rotors do not, or at least not so much.

The problem is that the pad material is not deposited evenly and that causes brake pulsing. The way to fix it is to remove all the pad material from the rotor and that has to be done mechanically, not chemically or with any solvent. Turning the faces of the rotors (or drums) will do it but that also removes a bit of rotor material. An abrasive pad used against the rotor's surface works great- I like those hard, silicone carbine paint removal pads spun in a drill against the rotor while the rotor slowly turns.... it is easy to do if you have a wheel balancer. That way the surface is very even. But it can be done by hand, just be careful to take off all the original brake pad marks from the rotor and all will be well. And clean the abrasive off the rotors before using them so the abrasive does not get imbedded into the pad and continue to abrade the rotors.

Thanks.  I'll grab one of the paint removal wheels today.  I'm guessing you just pull against the opposite side of the rotor with the drill/wheel to clean it rather than going through the wheel from the other side?

[VirginiaJim]

I removed my rotors and put them inside out after I did the outsides.  Of course, then you put them back the way they were.

http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=17971.msg219869#msg219869

[wb57]

Due to the measures I have to take to get the front wheel off (not hugely elaborate, but I have to do this outside on a slightly sloped driveway), I'm going to do this with the wheel on the bike.  This assumes it doesn't seem like a bad idea once it's underway.  I do have a wheel balancer if it gets to that point.

[B.D.F.]

Just a thought but I would be wary of doing that due to the abrasive flinging around. But if you do do it that way, you might want to wipe down all the moving parts as best you can- wheel bearing points (where the axle hits the seal at least), fork ends, etc. Silicon carbide is nasty, sharp and very aggressive abrasive that you really do not want in / on any moving parts of the bike.

And I think it is going to be quite difficult to get the backside (Easy!) of the rotors w/out taking the wheels off. I flip them around when cleaning them on the tire balancer.

Brian

Due to the measures I have to take to get the front wheel off (not hugely elaborate, but I have to do this outside on a slightly sloped driveway), I'm going to do this with the wheel on the bike.  This assumes it doesn't seem like a bad idea once it's underway.  I do have a wheel balancer if it gets to that point.

[jbirdnc]

What mileage do you get out of the front pad

[udoggie]

I got 12,000 out of mine.  I'm not sure if that is good or bad :-)

Jeff