Author Topic: Valve Adjustment  (Read 25280 times)

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #20 on: November 24, 2012, 12:16:56 PM »
In all the posts regarding valve clearances as a maintenance item, I don't recall any valves ever being found to actually be out of spec. One contributor talks about finding a burnt valve and this is what Im talking about when I say abuse. A burnt valve would display obvious symptoms and that is not what we are discussing here. Another contributor Bud Callaghan talks about the clearances being on the low (tight) side. What are you talking about? If the clearance is within spec it's fine. Moving the clearances to the middle of the range will do absolutely nothing except make you sleep better at night. As a matter of fact increasing the clearance decreases the valve lift, not something I would want to do. You, my friend, give the worst possible kind of advice and that is unsubstantiated and TOTAL OVERKILL. The point is, that if you are worried about engine problems in a C14 you are just being paranoid. This engine is bulletproof, unless you totally abuse the sh... out of it. And even that is hard to do with the rev limiter and quality of construction. Of all the motorcycles I have owned this is by far the most dependable. And believe me I am a maintenance freak. However, too many shade tree mechanics have listened to advice form owners like Callaghan, who may actually be able to accomplish this task competently, and attempted to service the valve train themselves by replacing shims with disastrous results. I have seen charts and programs and videos and heard all the comments. You are seriously risking total and catastrophic engine failure if you, or your so called qualified Kawasaki mechanic, makes one small mistake. Why would you rather take that risk over the infinitesimally small risk, and you would decide based on ridiculous and unqualified posts in this and other Concours forums, that the valves were found to be out of spec and require changing? Which by the way requires removing the cams, not something you really want to ever have to do. During the manufacturing process the valve clearances are all checked and double checked by a qualified engine builder. The engine only passes if the valves are found to be IN SPEC. It would be impossible for an engine to slip through this important quality control check and be further assembled. As far as the warranty is concerned. Maintenance done by owner. Period end of story. However, it is your bike. You can listen to the kooks who have nothing better to do then take their engines apart or do the research and see just how many engines are actually found to have valves truly out of spec.


Sir, thanks for stopping by and sharing your oppinions....and vast knowledge of this engine, and the associated database of the accumulation of many of us here that have 5 years on this bike so far.
Coining the phrase "kooks", following the rediculous diatribe you have laid out here wins zero in the credibility file....especially from some of us that HAVE been inside the engine....more than once....because WE DO have the tools and skillset to accomplish something you apparently do not have...

I was the Technical Editor of The Concours Owners Group at the time of the first C14's release, bought it to make sure I could provide the tech advice that needed to be shared.
I checked valve clearance @ 16k, and again at just over 20k, and swapped and moved shims, and replaced others, along with swapping Bucket positions, to provide maximum duration between future swaps... (i.e. took them to the upper threashold of the range.)
as iot was 7 of the valves were at or less than the lowest limit.
I have posted here, and so have others, the amount of shim/valve settings that were not within the operating parameters, but actually BELOW the limits fo clearances.

Your opinions are just that. Opinions. And the thought that everything that went on when the first couple years of engines were assembled in tha factory "perfectly" is rediculous....what world are you living in?
 With 7 posts under your belt. you might be better off adjusting your hatband a bit, and not dis' the folks here that know a bit about this.

My Kawi will go well over 100k before I get into the motor. Change oil and filter, tires, brake pads and ride it. JMHO.

tell us how this all works out for ya....we have lotsa time.... ;)


46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline JS_racer

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #21 on: November 24, 2012, 12:38:30 PM »
7 exhaust shims, 4 intake shims.....all are tight at 20k, 4 out slightly at 40k on my 09

43000 in 2 years on my 09. i saw the work done, and know it wasn't fun. could have been tons easier to rev it and think, "yep all good"

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #22 on: November 24, 2012, 12:53:12 PM »
12 out slightly (dialed in) at 20k, 4 out slightly at 40k on my 09

43000 in 2 years on my 09. i saw the work done, and know it wasn't fun. could have been tons easier to rev it and think, "yep all good"

but you didn't..... :thumbs: :thumbs: :goodpost:
and I bet you sleep perfectly for that also.... ;)


(when you say "slightly out", are you meaning slightly off the mid line, or slightly below the lower limit?...just asking.)

I will add that even though there is a lower limit, it is calculated on the fact the service is done on a cold engine, and things will change once @ operating temps. Even if the valve clearance is "below" on a cold engine, the spec was set to say "it's still safe, but service IS needed....and to heed that advice.... not stick to a blind mentality as was suggested here by someone that you are gonna get 100k out of the bike......ain't gonna happen..... ::)  I still have my 78' kaw, w/ shim over bucket.....in my sig line. ;)

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline texrider

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #23 on: November 24, 2012, 01:00:47 PM »
A valve will seat untill zero clearance is exceeded. The minimum specified clearance assures there is ample heat transfer from the valve to the cylinder head, thus keeping the valve cooler. The valve stays closed a longer duration with the proper minimum clearance.

That said, I'll still probably wait till 30 or 40k or when the cam cover gasket leaks, whichever comes first.
2014 Valkyrie

Offline JS_racer

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #24 on: November 24, 2012, 01:20:06 PM »
this is all i have, sorry it looks like a crappy picture and done on an etch a sketch. lol

(feel good about the valves, kicking myself about the forks. lol shhh)

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #25 on: November 24, 2012, 01:52:58 PM »
A valve will seat untill zero clearance is exceeded. The minimum specified clearance assures there is ample heat transfer from the valve to the cylinder head, thus keeping the valve cooler. The valve stays closed a longer duration with the proper minimum clearance.

That said, I'll still probably wait till 30 or 40k or when the cam cover gasket leaks, whichever comes first.




THE reason the manufacturer says to have the inspection done, is to INSURE they didn't make a mistake, and to set a precidence for the efficacy of the original assembly.


that said, here's my shim chart...



this is all i have, sorry it looks like a crappy picture and done on an etch a sketch. lol

(feel good about the valves, kicking myself about the forks. lol shhh)
interesting..... you seemed to have 6 @ the limits.... even more interesting is that your mechanic is as particular as myself, and used inch feelers, and recorded those readings in lieu of using metric feelers...
very wise.... I have .0002" feeler stock, and doing this service correctly, does let you use that, or the .0005" feeler also, to get precision....sweet...
 ;)

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline Pokey

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #26 on: November 24, 2012, 02:25:43 PM »
I am not going to attempt it, nor do I honestly trust a dealer to do it.....reckon I am hosed then.
2006 DL1000  2006 SV650
08 C14 "gone"

"All we have to do is decide what to do with the time given to us". Gandalf the Grey

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #27 on: November 24, 2012, 02:38:41 PM »
I am not going to attempt it, nor do I honestly trust a dealer to do it.....reckon I am hosed then.

or you could just ride up to Mentor, and pick up some good beer...... and bring your tent.
 ;)
and your checkbook...... 8)

I know you trust me......






46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline Pokey

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #28 on: November 24, 2012, 02:42:21 PM »
or you could just ride up to Mentor, and pick up some good beer...... and bring your tent.
 ;)
and your checkbook...... 8)


That could happen.  :chugbeer:
2006 DL1000  2006 SV650
08 C14 "gone"

"All we have to do is decide what to do with the time given to us". Gandalf the Grey

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #29 on: November 24, 2012, 02:52:09 PM »

That could happen.  :chugbeer:

 ;)
word thru the grapevine is MOB is gonna host a couple Ohio specific adventures this year.....more to come later  ;)

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline Pokey

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #30 on: November 24, 2012, 03:00:15 PM »
;)
word thru the grapevine is MOB is gonna host a couple Ohio specific adventures this year.....more to come later  ;)


That sounds AWESOME!!!!! If you host it, they will come.  :thumbs:
2006 DL1000  2006 SV650
08 C14 "gone"

"All we have to do is decide what to do with the time given to us". Gandalf the Grey

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline TR34

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #32 on: November 24, 2012, 05:39:52 PM »
Well, I have just finished my valve adjustment. I have an 2009 C 14 , bought it new. And about 16000 miles on it. I do  read this forum everyday, sometimes few times actually. I was going to wait to check my valves for at least untill 25 to 30 thousand miles. But, at the end of the riding season, I have noticed valve cover gasket leak. So, I have decided to go in with the confedence I have collected from you guys and also from Fred H. Video series. All I wanted to say is a BIG Thank you to all of you. I have not dealt with shim under bucket valve set up before but when I have started to work on it I have felt like I have done this many times. And , pretty much all of my in. and ex. specs were on eather lowest or below. I think I may have bonded to my bike even more now, lol.

Ahmet.
2009 Concours. Area P. Slip on, Flies out, PC V, Quick shifter.
Dual Muzzy someday!

Offline thundermax

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #33 on: November 24, 2012, 06:45:37 PM »
Does anyone know a link to the valve specs? How does the specs work, give high and low tolerance, maybe a sweet spot?
Riding 46 years. In order, 1958 Cushman 721 Highlander, 1960 Cushman Super Eagle, 1971 Honda SL 100, 1974 Yamaha RD 350, 1975 Honda 750 Four, 1971 Honda SL 175, 1998 Yamaha Vmax, 2005 Yamaha Vmax, 2009 Kawasaki Concours 1400, 2012 Kawasaki Concours Arabian Red.

Offline C1xRider

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #34 on: November 24, 2012, 07:03:33 PM »
Does anyone know a link to the valve specs? How does the specs work, give high and low tolerance, maybe a sweet spot?

Have you looked through the Wiki threads on the subject yet  : http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=10264.0
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Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #35 on: November 25, 2012, 09:00:52 AM »
Thank You!
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Offline MGvaleri

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #36 on: November 25, 2012, 09:53:06 AM »
Double overhead camshaft, valve clearance ... I'll do it no earlier than 50,000 miles.


MGvalerio. 8)
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Offline Toadestaber

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #37 on: November 25, 2012, 09:56:58 AM »
If the valves need to be adjusted, just trade it.


Offline Pokey

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #38 on: November 25, 2012, 11:04:44 AM »
If the valves need to be adjusted, just trade it.


I will be using this philosophy to my wife.

2006 DL1000  2006 SV650
08 C14 "gone"

"All we have to do is decide what to do with the time given to us". Gandalf the Grey

Offline Toadestaber

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Re: Valve Adjustment
« Reply #39 on: November 25, 2012, 03:54:38 PM »
Works for me.