Author Topic: Faster than the C14  (Read 9299 times)

Offline Deziner

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Faster than the C14
« on: March 15, 2015, 08:01:11 PM »
I'm relatively new, no, really new to the Sport/Touring world so this may be a stupid question to many of you but here goes. Which stock bikes will run away from a C14 out on the open road? Not the traxk or the drag strip, but on the Interstate.
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2015, 08:08:19 PM »
I would think, most of the Big CC Sport bikes would.

Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2015, 08:26:52 PM »
Do you mean higher top end and/or faster acceleration?  I'm thinking ZX-14 and Hayabusa of course.
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Offline Deziner

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2015, 09:03:06 PM »
Those 2 immediately came to mind. I don't even know what big bore sport bikes are out there. With their smaller size and weight, could a CBRxxxRR do it? (600,900, whatever)   Please excuse my lack of knowledge in this area, after many years of riding HDs, I know for sure that it doesn't take much of a Sport bike to disappear from an Electra Glide. ???
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Offline Rick Hall

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2015, 09:22:11 PM »
... Which stock bikes will run away from a C14 out on the open road? Not the traxk or the drag strip, but on the Interstate.

I was at a scooter shop in Denver on my C-10 a few years back, and a freshly minted squid got me interested in a race.
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2015, 09:44:15 PM »
600cc sport bikes are 'snappier' and will outrun the C-14 off the line at or at very low speeds. After that, wind resistance overcomes them and the C-14 will outrun them, especially at highway speeds and beyond. That said, for all its weight, a C-14 will make a surprising show against a 600cc sport bike under any circumstances.

A modern liter (1000 cc) sport bike will outrun a C-14 at any speed but again, at high speeds the difference is not that great due to the C-14's greater displacement. Some of the hotter liter bikes, especially if the rider tucks in, will put significant distance between them and a C-14 at any speeds.

The larger, 'relaxed' sport tourer / sport bikes (ZX 14, Hayabusa) will eat a C-14 for lunch under any / all circumstances.

An aggressive rider on a C-14 will sometimes really surprise a rider of, say, a mildly tuned 1,000 cc bike such as a V-Strom. It helps a lot of the C-14 rider is aware and keeps the RPM much higher than usual; then when 'the game is on', pure displacement will really show up, again even though the C-14 is a heavy bike.

Brian

I'm relatively new, no, really new to the Sport/Touring world so this may be a stupid question to many of you but here goes. Which stock bikes will run away from a C14 out on the open road? Not the traxk or the drag strip, but on the Interstate.
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Offline Rembrant

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2015, 06:47:35 AM »
600cc sport bikes are 'snappier' and will outrun the C-14 off the line at or at very low speeds. After that, wind resistance overcomes them and the C-14 will outrun them, especially at highway speeds and beyond. That said, for all its weight, a C-14 will make a surprising show against a 600cc sport bike under any circumstances.

A modern liter (1000 cc) sport bike will outrun a C-14 at any speed but again, at high speeds the difference is not that great due to the C-14's greater displacement. Some of the hotter liter bikes, especially if the rider tucks in, will put significant distance between them and a C-14 at any speeds.

The larger, 'relaxed' sport tourer / sport bikes (ZX 14, Hayabusa) will eat a C-14 for lunch under any / all circumstances.

An aggressive rider on a C-14 will sometimes really surprise a rider of, say, a mildly tuned 1,000 cc bike such as a V-Strom. It helps a lot of the C-14 rider is aware and keeps the RPM much higher than usual; then when 'the game is on', pure displacement will really show up, again even though the C-14 is a heavy bike.

Brian

I agree with Brian's comments 100% here...

I've been on many spirited rides with all ranges of sport-bikes, and I can say for sure that most modern 600cc RR sport-bikes cannot outrun a C14 on the highway. And what I'm referring to is roll-on speeds from 50mph and above.

I've also done similar roll-ons with 1st and 2nd gen Kawi Z1000's, and they're very similar to the 600cc RR bikes in that range.

If you get into proper liter-bike (1000cc) super-sports.... Kawi ZX10R, GSXR, R1, etc...forget it. They'll walk away from the C14 with ease.

The ZX14 and newer ZX14R bikes...forget them also. They'll leave a C14 like it's parked on the side of the road.

Rem
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Offline George R. Young

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2015, 09:44:54 AM »
. . . after many years of riding HDs, I know for sure that it doesn't take much of a Sport bike to disappear from an Electra Glide. ???
You may not realize it but there is a game played by sport-tourers, 'How many HDs dawdling along in a line can you pass in a single swoop?'.
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2015, 09:47:43 AM »
And double points if any of them are police motorcycles!

 :rotflmao:

Brian

You may not realize it but there is a game played by sport-tourers, 'How many HDs dawdling along in a line can you pass in a single swoop?'.
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Offline Rhino

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2015, 10:04:00 AM »
Two police bikes were parked at Rudy's this morning while I was getting a breakfast taco. One was a Honda ST 1300 and the other a C14. I asked the officers which was faster and they laughed and said the Kawi would walk away from the Honda.

I also agree with Brian. Any of the modern liter sport bikes will out run a C14. The 600cc bikes not so much. The bike I wonder about is the V-Max. Will the big 1679cc Vmax out run a C14?

Offline Rembrant

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2015, 10:07:18 AM »
You may not realize it but there is a game played by sport-tourers, 'How many HDs dawdling along in a line can you pass in a single swoop?'.

Haha...I suppose so...

Be careful when passing those guys...holy hell,...I think a couple deer wandering onto the road are more predictable...lol.

My friend Larry and I were passing a group of them on the Kancamaugus Hwy in NH one time. We were both on 08 C14's, with wives on the back. I know Brian knows this area well...but we were on the flat section of the hwy on the east end, but heading west. So, we hadn't hit the inclines yet, and the traffic was pokin' along. So, the two of us on C14's were rollin' up the passing lane with a full head of steam on...probably 90 MPH or so, and this guy on a HD pulls out to pass in front us ....no signal, no shoulder check, and no speed...nothing...he didn't even see us coming. If there wasn't smoke coming off of our rotors then, there never was...lol.

So...if you're passing a group of them anywhere...make sure you have somewhere to go if they do something weird in front of you...lol.

Rem :o
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Offline Rhino

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2015, 10:10:18 AM »
Haha...I suppose so...

Be careful when passing those guys...holy hell,...I think a couple deer wandering onto the road are more predictable...lol.

My friend Larry and I were passing a group of them on the Kancamaugus Hwy in NH one time. We were both on 08 C14's, with wives on the back. I know Brian knows this area well...but we were on the flat section of the hwy on the east end, but heading west. So, we hadn't hit the inclines yet, and the traffic was pokin' along. So, the two of us on C14's were rollin' up the passing lane with a full head of steam on...probably 90 MPH or so, and this guy on a HD pulls out to pass in front us ....no signal, no shoulder check, and no speed...nothing...he didn't even see us coming. If there wasn't smoke coming off of our rotors then, there never was...lol.

So...if you're passing a group of them anywhere...make sure you have somewhere to go if they do something weird in front of you...lol.

Rem :o

Was there in 09 on a rented ST1300. LOVE that road. Rode it going east, turned around rode going west, turned around again and rode it east again to continue my ride.

Offline Deziner

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2015, 11:03:52 AM »
What got me to wondering was the KTM I looked at yesterday, their top of the line Adventure Bike. Salesman claimed 150hp and there didn't look to be a whole lot of weight to that skinny thing. I imagine it goes like stink.

  Up until November when I finally decided to get a water cooled bike with some snap to it, I haven't looked at a new import since '82 when I bought my Seca. The imports I've owned since the late '80s have always been cheap wheels and "just temporary" between HDs. Things sure have changed. A BUNCH!
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2015, 12:09:27 PM »
Only regarding noise output :-)   

Perhaps off the line but not otherwise, and absolutely not at higher speeds or if there is a any kind of curve in the road. I think the V-Max launches better, at least in my poorly skilled hands but then again, I find a C-14 difficult to launch hard (Easy Boys!) from a standing start. Judging by the 1/8 mile stats people have published of repeated runs on a drag strip, I am not the only one either 'cause the first couple of passes are usually pretty poor. The V-Max makes its power at a lower engine speed and has more 'grunt' but gets winded pretty quick.

I think the expectations have to be reasonable: if one starts to think of a C-14 as a 'snappy' or 'high performance' bike, he / she is bound to be disappointed because there are a lot of other bikes out that that will equal or surpass it. On the other hand, if one thinks of a C-14 as a heavy, pig of an old man's tourer, then its performance is not only surprising but really quite amazing.... and that is how I think of the bike. For a heavy beast of a sport tourer, it will not embarrass anyone riding one (other than being stranded next to a Mobil fuel pump when it won't start.... and Hardly riders are looking on) and will actually surprise, sometimes stunningly so, other bike riders as well as the person sitting on the thing.

One summer day, my wife and I were headed to the local bike shop. There is a very windy but very clean 2- lane road, speed limit 25 MPH (and places where that is too much- literally), on the way to the shop- it is perhaps 1 1/2 miles long. Anyway, coming off the main road to the stop light at this side road, we end up in the middle of a group of four sport bikes, all sitting at the red light. One 600cc and the other three were liter Yamaha R1's. Just before the light changed, my wife says in the intercom "Don't do it...." :-)   I did not know what those four young bucks were going to do but I had a pretty good idea: sure 'nuff, when the light turned two of them launched pretty hard while the other two guys sort of sat there for a second. That was my opportunity to turn inside the last two and go after the first two. The first section of the road is gentle bends and that allowed me to put the smaller bike behind me. Now of course I could not take the R1 but then again, he could not put nearly as much distance between us as he thought he could, and he proved to be a relatively mild rider, probably new to bikes, and dumped most of his speed WAY early leading into the first very sharp turn..... if I did not have my wife on the back, I would have passed him right then :-)  At any rate, after going around the curve limited by his speed, he was slow to accelerate out of the turn too and I think he was amazed to see me actually get closer for a second. When we got to the bike shop, both kids had to walk over and see what it was; I asked for extra credit because I had baggage AND saddlebags  :rotflmao:. They were just pups and I think my gray hair further surprised them- anyway, the next thing I knew, two of the R1 riders were talking to a salesman about a C-14 they had on the floor.

With reasonable expectations, the C-14 is an outstanding performing bike..... as heavy, sport touring bikes go.

Brian


<snip>

 The bike I wonder about is the V-Max. Will the big 1679cc Vmax out run a C14?
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Offline Deziner

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2015, 12:21:11 PM »
The bike I wonder about is the V-Max. Will the big 1679cc Vmax out run a C14?

Nicole should be able to answer that, she owns both.
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Offline Rhino

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2015, 01:11:01 PM »
Brian you like to live dangerously. When the baggage speaks, I always listen.  ;)


Only regarding noise output :-)   

Perhaps off the line but not otherwise, and absolutely not at higher speeds or if there is a any kind of curve in the road. I think the V-Max launches better, at least in my poorly skilled hands but then again, I find a C-14 difficult to launch hard (Easy Boys!) from a standing start. Judging by the 1/8 mile stats people have published of repeated runs on a drag strip, I am not the only one either 'cause the first couple of passes are usually pretty poor. The V-Max makes its power at a lower engine speed and has more 'grunt' but gets winded pretty quick.

I think the expectations have to be reasonable: if one starts to think of a C-14 as a 'snappy' or 'high performance' bike, he / she is bound to be disappointed because there are a lot of other bikes out that that will equal or surpass it. On the other hand, if one thinks of a C-14 as a heavy, pig of an old man's tourer, then its performance is not only surprising but really quite amazing.... and that is how I think of the bike. For a heavy beast of a sport tourer, it will not embarrass anyone riding one (other than being stranded next to a Mobil fuel pump when it won't start.... and Hardly riders are looking on) and will actually surprise, sometimes stunningly so, other bike riders as well as the person sitting on the thing.

One summer day, my wife and I were headed to the local bike shop. There is a very windy but very clean 2- lane road, speed limit 25 MPH (and places where that is too much- literally), on the way to the shop- it is perhaps 1 1/2 miles long. Anyway, coming off the main road to the stop light at this side road, we end up in the middle of a group of four sport bikes, all sitting at the red light. One 600cc and the other three were liter Yamaha R1's. Just before the light changed, my wife says in the intercom "Don't do it...." :-)   I did not know what those four young bucks were going to do but I had a pretty good idea: sure 'nuff, when the light turned two of them launched pretty hard while the other two guys sort of sat there for a second. That was my opportunity to turn inside the last two and go after the first two. The first section of the road is gentle bends and that allowed me to put the smaller bike behind me. Now of course I could not take the R1 but then again, he could not put nearly as much distance between us as he thought he could, and he proved to be a relatively mild rider, probably new to bikes, and dumped most of his speed WAY early leading into the first very sharp turn..... if I did not have my wife on the back, I would have passed him right then :-)  At any rate, after going around the curve limited by his speed, he was slow to accelerate out of the turn too and I think he was amazed to see me actually get closer for a second. When we got to the bike shop, both kids had to walk over and see what it was; I asked for extra credit because I had baggage AND saddlebags  :rotflmao:. They were just pups and I think my gray hair further surprised them- anyway, the next thing I knew, two of the R1 riders were talking to a salesman about a C-14 they had on the floor.

With reasonable expectations, the C-14 is an outstanding performing bike..... as heavy, sport touring bikes go.

Brian

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2015, 01:27:41 PM »
Bah! She says no but she really means yes.... :-)   Besides, she is happy her seat is in front of Mr. Elkhoof's place (although he may have the better view....).

Brian

Brian you like to live dangerously. When the baggage speaks, I always listen.  ;)
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Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2015, 02:45:41 PM »
One summer day, my wife and I were headed to the local bike shop. There is a very windy but very clean 2- lane road, speed limit 25 MPH (and places where that is too much- literally), on the way to the shop- it is perhaps 1 1/2 miles long. Anyway, coming off the main road to the stop light at this side road, we end up in the middle of a group of four sport bikes, all sitting at the red light. One 600cc and the other three were liter Yamaha R1's. Just before the light changed, my wife says in the intercom "Don't do it...." :-)   
Brian

Did your wife hit you after you stopped?  Excellent story by the way.
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Offline maxtog

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2015, 04:23:39 PM »
And double points if any of them are police motorcycles!

 :rotflmao:

LOL!  I will try to avoid that one :)   Oh, and great story/followup post, Brian.
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Offline Rhino

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Re: Faster than the C14
« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2015, 05:17:23 PM »
Did your wife hit you after you stopped?  Excellent story by the way.

Mine would have been screaming at 150 decibels and trying to hold on for dear life and some how punch me at the same time. I don't ride with baggage very often and I'm ok with that.