Dealership recommended to wait on valve adj check

[Jeremy Mitchell]

could be maybe, but an intake sync can do wonders if it out of spec

My comment was made in jest.  I have actually checked my valves twice, the first time I checked them myself around 25,000 miles (previous owner had it done at 15,000) and there were no shims needed since all the valves were smack dab in the middle of spec.  Second time was at 42,000 and the dealer did it for $100 since my bike was having the valve cover gasket changed under warranty.  They provided me with a shim map that showed the same measurements that I recorded.  I am gonna stretch my next valve check to at least 75,000 miles and see what difference there is then.

[Mister Tee]

I'm at 20K and I was going to have the valves checked to address the ticking noise I posted about before. Instead, I washed the bike and the ticking noise is gone.

(Sentence #2 is true by the way.  Don't ask me why the noise went away.  I did spray down the accessible parts of the engine.)

[C1xRider]

Valve adjust at 15K vs 25K is purely a personal preference.  If the factory did a good job, you should be fine waiting for 25K.

However, it's still a gamble that the assembler didn't screw up, or something wasn't seated quite right when they assembled it, causing things to be off by a little.

All things being equal, there shouldn't be much change between new and 25K if everything was done right in the beginning.  For most, it's just 'peace of mind'.

I'm guessing the valves would have to be WAY off for you to know they needed adjustment at 15K (without measuring, of course) .  Maybe that's just me though.

[Elfmaze]

My z1000 i took in for its first valve check at 25K.  Dealer gave me back the bike with a $900 bill.  Said the valves "did not need done"  and they spent more time tightening bolts and going over other things..... 

Dealer was too lazy to do the work.  And justified his bill with labor costs.  Don't take a dealers word for it,  They can be just lazy too.   

[maxtog]

My z1000 i took in for its first valve check at 25K.  Dealer gave me back the bike with a $900 bill.  Said the valves "did not need done"  and they spent more time tightening bolts and going over other things..... 

Dealer was too lazy to do the work.  And justified his bill with labor costs.  Don't take a dealers word for it,  They can be just lazy too.

Why would you think they did not check the valves?  Or are you saying the dealer TOLD you they did not check the valves?  Or was it that you asked for them to be checked, the manual calls for them to be checked, they checked them, and none were out of adjustment so they didn't have to change any shims?   Shims don't actually cost much, if anything (because they are reused/swapped).   Most of the work of a valve check job is the actual getting to them and checking them.  Correcting them is a breeze (or at least it was on my previous bikes).

In general, how would anyone know ANY dealer does the work they claim to be doing, especially when it is internal and/or non-visible stuff.

[Necron99]

Maybe it's just that my mechanic was really persuasive...

[VirginiaJim]

Yep, that would do it for me...

[ZG]

Maybe it's just that my mechanic was really persuasive...

Indeed, sign me up for once a week... 

[dolomoto]

I did my initial valve inspection at 36k. None were out of spec although several were on the tight side. I set every valve to the loose end of the spec.

I'll check them again at 65-70k or so. If they haven't moved much, I may never check them again.

As far as the dealer, there's not a factory (Kawasaki) dealer around Savannah that I would trust. There is an indy dealer that I trust, but he'll only do a C14 (or ZX14) in the off season since it takes so much room to spread the parts out.

The nearest Kawasaki dealer did not own a micrometer or even have shims when I was in there last because "we've never needed them".

IOW, they don't actually adjust valves but charge customers for it.

The one Indy dealer I trust puts his initials on the underside of the valve cover just in case the customer claims the valve inspection was never done.

A DIY valve inspection ain't bad. Take your time, make lots of room in the garage to spread the parts out. Allow time to order/exchange shims and take lots of notes.

[stevewfl]

every 25,000 - 28,000 for me

[jjsC6]

JJsc6, if you do a search on the Magnuson-Moss act, you'll see that it is true.  Its not something I would have invented for purposes of this thread.

The only way Kawi can REQUIRE  the service for warranty is to do the service for free, or have applied for a waiver with the FTC.  The waiver woudl have to state the service was required for the motorcycle to work properly. If they did nto do this, they cannot require us to pay for the service to keep the warranty in force.

I have read bit's and pieces of it, admittedly not the whole thing.  I have not seen that in there and I do not believe it.  Let's use a hypothetical example.  Lets say you burn a valve during the warranty period, but well after the valve adjustment mileage stated in the manual.  Do you think that they cannot deny the warranty because you didn't have the valves checked?

Here are a few links of interest...

http://www.lemonlaw-attorneys.com/avoiding-warranty-denial/

http://zembowersautocenter.com/TIPSADVICE/CARDEALERSHIPFORSERVICING/tabid/19156/Default.aspx

BTW, I just went back and read the article you referenced.  I saw what I think you are referring to.  The wording is very vague, and I think taken out of context.  I'm willing on betting money that a warranty claim can be denied if maintenance was not performed and they can tie said lack of maintenance to the failure.

OK, I just read some more that I found.  I think what they are saying is that they cannot require you to have the service done by someone specific (such as the dealer) unless they offer the service for free. But that does not mean the service is not required.  It just means that you can take it anywhere you want, or even do it your self as long as it is properly documented.

Here is the wording that indicates that to me...

"The essence of the law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle maker's brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge."

Where it says "PARTS OR SERVICE IDENTIFIED BY BRAND".  In other words, they cannot require that Ford (Ford being the "brand") cannot require you to have FORD do the service unless they are willing on doing it for free.

From this link.... http://www.301cycle.com/Service_Warranty.html

[lt1]

Jim, that is correct.  Of course maintainence can be required.  They just cannot specify that you have to use their parts or labor unless they include it in the purchase price / offer to do it for free.  You would need to be able to offer evidence that you did it yourself or took it to a competent place for service.  Many times the law is not based on common sense, but this one comes pretty close.

[rcannon409]

The way you guys describe it, it does make sense.  Otherwise a person could claim oil changes need to be covered free if they were necessary.

[Elfmaze]

Why would you think they did not check the valves?  Or are you saying the dealer TOLD you they did not check the valves?  Or was it that you asked for them to be checked, the manual calls for them to be checked, they checked them, and none were out of adjustment so they didn't have to change any shims?

When i went to pick it up they told me they did not do them.  Didn't even pull the valve cover.  He instead had a list of times and other items they did to fill the time... I doubt they even knew how to do the check...  How many sport bikes survive that long?

[maxtog]

When i went to pick it up they told me they did not do them.  Didn't even pull the valve cover.  He instead had a list of times and other items they did to fill the time... I doubt they even knew how to do the check...  How many sport bikes survive that long?

That is slimy!

[scooter]

i asked my dealer about the 15k valve check and he said he would be glad to do it. he said he would wait till about 20 to 25 k to do it though as most of the ones he has done at 15k needed nothing done.

[rcannon409]

Has anyone seen a situation where not checking valve clearance caused issues?

I have in the dirt bike world, but its not a fair comparison since many brands of dirt bike valves wont last THAT long anyway.

[Elfmaze]

I would expect the engine to run poorly before burning a valve from being too tight too??? or does it go catastrophically when it does?

[martin_14]

Afm,
since I'm in Europe the manual calls for a first valve inspection at 42000 km / 25000 miles. But since I'm active in this forum I got a bit paranoic and at 15000 miles I asked my dealer about it. He told me not to worry, 42000 km is just fine. This will be happening next Tuesday and I'm looking forward to it. I can only tell you that I can hear the valves at some rpms/engine load and I don't like it (I'm the sort of folk who can hear the grass grow, anyway).
I just came back from a 4200 miles trip through Ireland and Britain, and I got very intimate with the bike, so it might just be that, or the valves really need be looked at.

[jjsC6]

I would expect the engine to run poorly before burning a valve from being too tight too??? or does it go catastrophically when it does?

It does not go catastrophically.  But it goes very gradually and you will not feel it until damage is done to the internals.  Despite what the post above said, damn few people will hear it either (one way or another).  There are simply to many other noises, and most of us wear helmets and ear plugs. 

On the other hand, even a valve that is out of spec is not necessarily a problem yet.  And in today's machinery the likely hood of a problem is not very common.  My opinion is to be sure your bike is fully warmed up before running it hard, and is cooled down to "normal" operating temperature before shutting it off.  And as always, short trips are the worst thing for an engine.