Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C10, aka Kawasaki Concours - The Original => The Bike - C10 => Topic started by: Jet86 on February 11, 2013, 05:03:38 PM
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After more then 5 years of owning this bike and many oil changes i never had this happen befor, after removing the oil filter only about 1oz of oil came out, so i thought ok get ready for the Niagara back splash when i remove the second plug but nothing at all came out.
I looked at the oil sight glass and it was still full, right where i filled it to the last time i changed oil, i change oil Every 3,000 miles and always use Castrol 10w-40.
On all other oil changes the oil could not wait to come out like Niagara Falls soon as the oil filter bolt is pulled. SO whats the hold up and whats the Cure?..
??? :-\
i always let the bike warm up and ride it about 5-10 miles befor the change.
bike on center stand level ground.
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Do the end of the drain plugs look normal?
Try poking up the drain hole(s) with a straw or something :o
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I hesitate to even ask this, so please don't think I think anything but the best and know you've done this before...but......did you remove the correct plug? I almost grabbed the wrong one myself last time because there are several under there... just...asking...if it would be worth double checking?
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I hesitate to even ask this, so please don't think I think anything but the best and know you've done this before...but......did you remove the correct plug? I almost grabbed the wrong one myself last time because there are several under there... just...asking...if it would be worth double checking?
Exactly what I was thinking. Maybe one of the oil line bolts was removed instead of the drain plug?
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You JUST gotta tell us what the problem is!!! :o :o
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After running the engine, does the oil look viscous, or liquid in the site glass?
I'm not liking your chances.
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Can you see air bubble in the sight glass?
Do you have the oem filter canister or the aftermarket spin-on? The filter should be completely saturated/full either way.
There are two other drain bolts and the one closest to the oil filter should do most of the draining so if removing that one and poking something up there like a straw doesn't net you any oil then maybe there isn't any oil in there. There, I said it. Someone had to.
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(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/eek1.gif)
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The oil looks like it always does for 3,000 mile oil, looks ok & pretty much the same on every change, no air bubbles and yes i removed the correct bolts and they looked very good, the crush washer was even good enough to use again for the 3rd time but i will replace that any way on the next change.
I don't have the spin-on' its stock and i use the K&N filters from murph.
I had both plugs and the filter completely out, and only 1oz of oil came out and that was more or less from the soaked filter.
What i really want to know is why this happened, what caused it? and is there anything Seriously wrong with my bike. it runs fine and i ride it about 2-3 times a week every week. its my only transportation.
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Did you mention whether or not the oil is now gone from the site glass, now that the 1 oz of oil is gone?
If there is no more oil in the bike, and you were running on 1 oz, there is certainly something wrong. you have a major leak. Now did it damage your engine, it might have, it might not have. But it most certainly shortened its life.
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, after removing the oil filter only about 1oz of oil came out, so i thought ok get ready for the Niagara back splash when i remove the second plug but nothing at all came out.
I looked at the oil sight glass and it was still full, right where i filled it to the last time i changed oil,
??? :-\
You are correct. No way can there be oil in the sight glass and only 1 oz came out.
You either had no oil in the engine at all or there is still a lot of oil left in the engine now.
It cant be both.
What is going on??
If your pour just any motor oil in right now. Does the oil in the sight glass go up or does it pour out the drain holes??
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Maybe the sight glass is "black" on the inside because maybe running without much oil causes the oil to burn and blacken the glass, hence the glass shows no air bubble. Tip bike to the right some and have someone look for an air bubble.
With plugs (engine oil drain plugs) out, try adding some oil, as suggested and see what happens.
With the main drain plug out, take a small mirror and flashlight and try to look up in there.
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Does the "oil pressure" light work?
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Just throwing stuff herre, don't know if it will stick :)
Some kind of "debris" blocking the drain holes (I know, doesn't bode well)
Have you poked something up thru the drain holes? See if oil flows out now?
Done any engine work where you used RTV to seal parts back together. Now possibly excessive RTV is in the bottom of the engine blocking the drains?
Sounds like time to remove the oil pan and see whats what...........
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Have you removed the oil filler cap?
I may be a long shot, but could there be a partial vac formed which is preventing the oil from dropping?
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Just poor some oil into the filler hole.
If it comes out the drain, you know there is nothing blocking it and you ran out of oil.
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Hey guys, are we sure somebody didn't turn the calendar ahead to April first? Just hope that's the case cuz everything else has dollar signs in front of it.
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Ok i misunderstood the question about the air bubble,,, I will call it a gap in the sight glass, on every oil change i never fill it to the top, i always leave a gap that way i can see where the oil is, i learned long ago if you over fill with oil just a little bit the glass will be solid black and make you think its empty when its full..
I will explain again, i simply removed both (Correct) oil plugs along with the oil filter as i have a new filter to put back in, not much oil came out so i looked at the sight glass and i still have my little gap, it's still just above half-way in the sight glass, so now i'm scratching my head thinking why isn't the oil coming out like it has in every other oil change.
I had been planning this oil change so the day befor the change i checked the oil and it was just over half way up the sight glass, right where i filled it the last time, its not burning or leaking any oil, in fact i went for an 80 mile ride that day, no problems at all.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but with a brand new oil change, the oil that you can see in the site glass should not be black, correct?
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but with a brand new oil change, the oil that you can see in the site glass should not be black, correct?
CORRECT but you can still see the oil but being fresh oil you can see right threw it and see the shiny stuff behind it until you run the engine.
However the problem is i cant get the old oil out to put fresh oil in.
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Put it up on the center stand, put it in thrid gear, and roll the back tire.
Maybe the compression will trigger the oil to drain?
Or maybe this is all a bad idea.
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Put it up on the center stand, put it in thrid gear, and roll the back tire.
Maybe the compression will trigger the oil to drain?
Or maybe this is all a bad idea.
(Neutral Finder), i tried this in the past just to see if i could do it and never could, maybe i could with a second person spinning the wheel while i try to pop in 2nd.
I solved the oil problem and my bike is running fine with fresh oil and filter.
NOT a good idea at all but i bumped the starter a few times and nothing happened so i just let the engine start for about 1-2 seconds and the oil came gushing out about half a quart so i turned off the engine and the flow stopped, i have a 5 quart bucket and the bike holds 3 so i start the engine again and let it fill almost half the bucket with my hand on the kill switch i shut it down soon as the oil light came on witch was right around 2 & half quarts.
So really my oil is not completely fresh, i still have a half quart of old oil in there that mixed with the new oil..
some of you had what seems to be good suggestions, like maybe a strange vacuum problem, but how can that be with both drain plugs completely out including the oil filter.
i also thought about sticking a straw or something up in there but what if it knocked something loose, there is no way i can tear down the engine to fix it.
I still would like more feedback on this, maybe from that lawnmower guy
:feedback:
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You probably tried this but did any oil come out when you opened the filler cap? That would have alleviated any vacuum issues. If you tried that and oil didn't come out then I am totally perplexed. It would have to be blockage in the drain holes. :popcorn:
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You probably tried this but did any oil come out when you opened the filler cap? That would have alleviated any vacuum issues. If you tried that and oil didn't come out then I am totally perplexed. It would have to be blockage in the drain holes. :popcorn:
You know i did not try that, i only took off the filler cap after i put the drain plugs back in. ::)
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You probably tried this but did any oil come out when you opened the filler cap? That would have alleviated any vacuum issues. If you tried that and oil didn't come out then I am totally perplexed. It would have to be blockage in the drain holes. :popcorn:
Great suggestion. But there is also the crankcase vent hose that goes up to the bottom of the airbox on the left side, which should provide adequate ventilation for air to get into the crankcase. You might check and see of that tube it blocked.
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That tube has been caked with oil since day one and thats something i been wanting to check for a long time, i cleaned the outside of it once but it caked up again about 4 months later, i need to take the air box off but that may be more work then i can do where i live, apartments suck.
if its caked on the outside then i could be on the inside to
:(
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That's gotta be it. The vent tube must be clogged.
Keep us updated when you check that out.
Good luck.
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You may already know this, but in case you don't, you can't get the airbox out without pulling the carbs first, there just isn't any room. :'(
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You may already know this, but in case you don't, you can't get the airbox out without pulling the carbs first, there just isn't any room. :'(
That's exactly why i said that may be more work then i can do where i live, i cant do that kind of work in my parking spot, i thought about working on it at a friends house who has a big front yard but i can see problems there to, what ever work i do i need to get it done in one day and i have never taken the carbs off before and if i do they are going to Steve for the proper treatment.
from what i can see witch isn't much there is no way to take off that tube and clean it without removing the air box, is that right? has any one removed and replaced that tube without taking out the air box??
after watching steve's carb video's i am sure i can do this but i really need to be prepared first, i dont have a heat gun and my boots are like cement so they gotta be replaced to and while im there i should replace the throttle cable as well, you can see where this is going right $$$$$ and i really don't have that kind of money, heck i barely get by month to month. sorry for the dribble.
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Thanks to all of you Now that we have Possibly found the problem could that plugged up tube cause me to blow the engine if i keep riding it? IMO it wont hurt it because its probably been like that for awhile now, it had to have plugged up withing the last 3,000 miles witch was my last oil change.
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Glad to hear you got the problem sorta out, and the good news is you didn't damage the engine. ;)
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Definitely inspect that hose
FYI, over filling the oil, even a small amount, tends to generate the oil blowby into the airbox, and hence the oily caking on the hose. Might be building up on the inside of the hose too.
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Actually this is a good time for a lesson for those DIY-ers. Filling the oil means IMO.
1. Drain
2. Remove filter
3. Slowly fill to middle of site glass, allowing time for oil to settle in bottom of drain pan
4. Start engine and let idle for a minute or so
5. Let engine settle at least five minutes
6. Fill to middle of site glass again, allowing time for oil to settle in bottom of drain pan
The key here is to not overfill because you didn't allow the oil to settle before checking the site glass.
What did I miss?
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Actually this is a good time for a lesson for those DIY-ers. Filling the oil means IMO.
1. Drain
2. Remove filter
3. Slowly fill to middle of site glass, allowing time for oil to settle in bottom of drain pan
4. Start engine and let idle for a minute or so
5. Let engine settle at least five minutes
6. Fill to middle of site glass again, allowing time for oil to settle in bottom of drain pan
The key here is to not overfill because you didn't allow the oil to settle before checking the site glass.
What did I miss?
Have had my '94 for 19 yrs and have found that 3 quarts is perfect.
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Have had my '94 for 19 yrs and have found that 3 quarts is perfect.
+1 3qts is all I add to my bikes
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I use a reusable oil filter. I put in exactly 4.5 qts with this filter and I am good to go!
http://www.kandpengineering.com/ (http://www.kandpengineering.com/)
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I use a reusable oil filter. I put in exactly 4.5 qts with this filter and I am good to go!
http://www.kandpengineering.com/ (http://www.kandpengineering.com/)
4.5 qts? I find it hard to believe that you'd get an extra 1.5 qts of capacity.
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+1 3qts is all I add to my bikes
Make that a +2 on the 3 quarts and good to go.
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4.5 qts? I find it hard to believe that you'd get an extra 1.5 qts of capacity.
C-14s have different capacities than C-10s.
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C-14s have different capacities than C-10s.
Aha! Didn't notice the C14 in the signature. And didn't expect it since this is a C10 forum section...
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Aha! Didn't notice the C14 in the signature. And didn't expect it since this is a C10 forum section...
Most who own a C-14, own or have owned a C-10.
I swing both ways.
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That's another interesting thing about my conk, in the 5 years of changing oil it has Never been able to hold a full 3 quarts without over filling, even with a new oil filter, i get pretty close to three quarts but if i put the last bit in it will go over the sight glass and i never liked that, i like to see a little gap at the top of the glass, and yes i always pull both plugs, now when i first bought the bike i didn't know about the second plug so on my first oil change i can see why 3 quarts would be a little over fill because there still a little bit in the engine. and yes i like many other have over filled slightly to where the glass would be solid black witch not a good thing as Vic Salisbury said it blows oil into the airbox and it becomes a mess.
what i do is put in just over 2 1/2 quarts then rid it a mile or two and let it sit overnight on the center stand and check it the next morning and finish filling it up to where i want it.
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Most who own a C-14, own or have owned a C-10.
I swing both ways.
Adverse information ;)
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I am glad that you have got to the bottom of the problem with the lack of oil flowing. I thought it was a vac problem.
If you can take the tube from the crankcase vent and try blowing compressed air through it, it may push any blockage up into the airbox, where you can clean the crud out.