Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => The Bike - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: Coomers on September 29, 2013, 04:24:48 PM
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With 28,000 mi on my 08 I fell victim to keypass. It had never happened to me before but luckily I had learned from this site what to do in the event of a failure. The bad part is I was traveling with two other guys on Harley’s and they couldn’t help themselves.
I’m not sure if this is normal or not but since my first Keypass failure two days ago, it hasn’t worked since without either disconnecting the wire harness or banging on the ignition. Not even once?
Has anyone put together detailed instructions on removing and dismantling the ignition and cleaning the tumbler thingy?
Thanks,
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It's not for the faint of heart... http://www.pbase.com/fredharmon/kipass (http://www.pbase.com/fredharmon/kipass) and it ain't easy. Take the key out and give it a good flushing with contact cleaner around the 9 o'clock position. It helps to use the key from the key fob to push the switch in a downward motion as you're doing it. Supposedly Kwak Central has a stronger spring that they can install. It's happened to me a few times but I've beaten the :censored: out of it and it reluctantly worked. I carry a hammer for just such an occasion. Others carry a K-rock. Brian (B.D.F.) has a connector that can be used to make it work temporarily but I haven't had to use it. I prefer beating the :censored: out of it and cursing it back to the stone age. Unfortunately it puts nicks in my sword as well.
And it's KIPASS, please make a note of it... ;)
Which reminds me, I haven't flushed it out lately so that's on my list of to do's.
As far as HD guys having some fun at our expense, I feel for you. Happened to me but on a 1981 Honda Silver Wing GL500... HD guy wanted to tow me :_shudder_Emoticon :yikes:
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I carry a hammer for just such an occasion. Others carry a K-rock. . Unfortunately it puts nicks in my sword as well.
http://youtu.be/J6_1Pw1xm9U (http://youtu.be/J6_1Pw1xm9U)
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haters! :(
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:)
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KIPASS didn't fail. A piece of stamped steel and weak spring did. Same components a keyed system use.
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On 08 and 09 bikes, if you look at the space around the outside of keyholder at the 9:00 position, you can see a little square tab sticking out from the keyswitch over a little square plastic plunger in a plastic square hole. When the key is pushed in, that tab pushes on the plunger. in a plastic square hole. The plunger has a spring inside of it that looks like it came out of a ball point pen and the switch is under the plunger. The switch never goes out, it is the plunger sticking. The plunger and hole is pretty long and pretty tight clearance, so over time dirt builds up and the plunger sticks in the bottom position holding the switch down and the bike will not start (that is why some people bang on it, to make the plunger pop back up). Squirting a cleaner around the plunger that is plastic save is a good way to clean it out and let the plunger come back up. Cleaning it every once in a while and you would prabably never have a problem with it.
Kawasaki will install the newer stronger spring for free through the dealers, but it is not simple to do, make sure you get them to order the new security bolts before they start, as the bolts are one time use only to prevent theft. The newer bikes also have a splash shield in that space where you can see the tab and plunger/hole to try to keep it cleaner.
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With 28,000 mi on my 08 I fell victim to keypass. It had never happened to me before but luckily I had learned from this site what to do in the event of a failure. The bad part is I was traveling with two other guys on Harley’s and they couldn’t help themselves.
I’m not sure if this is normal or not but since my first Keypass failure two days ago, it hasn’t worked since without either disconnecting the wire harness or banging on the ignition. Not even once?
Has anyone put together detailed instructions on removing and dismantling the ignition and cleaning the tumbler thingy?
Thanks,
Instead of beating on the poor thing press the stove knob down with your finger tip and while holding it down let your finger slip off to the side and allow the key to snap back up. Do this till it works, or not.
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Not as fun, not prudent.
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Not as fun, not prudent.
True, but if one doesn't carry a hammer or a rock...
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Or a sword...
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So other than spraying some plastic safe contact cleaner down the key slot, how does one clean the plunger regularly with out taking it apart?
Will Kawasaki install the new spring if the bike is long out of Warrantee?
Thanks,
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You clean it as best you can without taking it apart. Don't know if Kwak is replacing the springs gratis on out of warranty bikes as it's a fairly invasive job. I would tend to doubt it though. Most times the issue has been very intermittent. Very rarely does it stay on the fritz... You do have good battery power, right?
As Conrad said, keep pushing down on the switch whilst spraying the :censored: out of it with cleaner.
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So other than spraying some plastic safe contact cleaner down the key slot, how does one clean the plunger regularly with out taking it apart?
Will Kawasaki install the new spring if the bike is long out of Warrantee?
Thanks,
Clean a C14!? (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/lol8.gif) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/avatars/lol8.gif.html)
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Brought my 08 in last year out of warranty and the dealer called and got authorization from Kawasaki. The dealer got the parts in (spring and security bolts) but did not want to do the job because it is pretty involved and they don't get reimbursed from Kawasaki enough. I just kept up my routine of WD-40 under that square tab at 9 oclock every few months and told them to forget about it. Sold the bike and got a new 2012 and after several months the new owner forgot about the WD-40 routine, got stuck out on the road and had another dealer do the job for free.
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hopefully you bought the 12 from a different dealer, the first dealer who said they did not get paid enough to do warranty work would not get another penny from me. I understand they get "less" for warranty work but if they live by that creed I wonder if they only charge the customer for the "actual time to complete a job" or the "BOOK TIME". I am sure you know the answer to that as well as I do, works both ways.
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^^^I see your point and i'm not about stealerships at all. But its common here when a stealership has a great rep and are slammed with service work with no mechanics available, they simply turn away the warranty business. It doesn't pay as well, nor serve their "regulars".
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Then they should not be authorized Kawasaki dealers.
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I would think their contract with Kawa would obligate them to do the work.
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I would think the same thing. They want to sell bikes but they don't want to do any warranty work then they don't need to be dealers for the product. A few calls to Kawasaki might solve that problem one way or the other.
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I would think the same thing. They want to sell bikes but they don't want to do any warranty work then they don't need to be dealers for the product. A few calls to Kawasaki might solve that problem one way or the other.
Mark? :o
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I've never had warranty work done on a bike. But have had plenty of warranty work done on cars and trucks. If a dealer ever refused to do warranty work on one of my vehicles. I would take it up with the manufacturer and I would never, ever buy another vehicle from them.
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My local shop has been selling Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki, Triumph ... and Kawasaki for a loooong time.
And they just quit selling Kawasaki.
I couldn't get the sales guy to tell me why. All he would say is, "They wanted us to do something we didn't want to do."
He did say they will still work on Kawasakis, just not selling them.
And a few days later when I was there again a brand new bright red ZX14R they had on the floor had been taken away.
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I agree with you all on how it "should be" and what they are "obligated to do". However, I know stealerships don;t do that, and its not uncommon is all I was saying.
Just sayin', its like the gentleman stated........ "call mark" :D
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One does not really clean the KiPass activation switch; one simply squirts something down there and hopes for the best.
Kawasaki seems to be pretty good about replacing the spring on bikes out of warrantee but they can be picky about actually seeing the switch stick. If it sticks on an owner but then frees up, sometimes they do not seem to want to deal with the issue.
Besides all of that, the stiffer spring only reduces the chances of the switch sticking, it does not eliminate the problem. Fortunately it is pretty rare on most C-14's and even more rare on the ones with the heavier spring. That said, it does not do much good for the person who is stuck to know that they are in a small group :-)
I make and sell a KiPass activation switch bypass that is guaranteed to work around the stuck switch problem. It basically interrupts and resets the system so you can start the bike. The original switch should still be repaired but at least the bike will not be stranded. There is more info. about it here: http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=6976.msg82841#msg82841 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=6976.msg82841#msg82841) They can be purchased here: http://incontrolne.com/incontrol_005.htm (http://incontrolne.com/incontrol_005.htm)
Brian
So other than spraying some plastic safe contact cleaner down the key slot, how does one clean the plunger regularly with out taking it apart?
Will Kawasaki install the new spring if the bike is long out of Warrantee?
Thanks,
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Absolutely: that is one of the things that goes along with being a dealer for a product; servicing that product under warranty. If a Kawasaki dealership refuses to service a reasonably current Kawasaki that they sell, then Kawasaki should step in and insist that they do so. Should the dealer still refuse, Kawasaki should pull the dealership away from them.
It does seem like the manufacturers of motorcycles are far weaker regarding overseeing their dealer networks than auto manufacturers are. Motorcycle dealers seem to get away with a lot of things that the factory just should not allow IMO. At least Japanese motorcycle dealers; BMW dealers seem much better regulated but that brand comes with other.... considerations when purchasing.
Brian
I would think the same thing. They want to sell bikes but they don't want to do any warranty work then they don't need to be dealers for the product. A few calls to Kawasaki might solve that problem one way or the other.
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Before I retired, I worked with a lot of car dealers. The unscrupulous dealers would "invent" additional warranty claims such that their warranty reimbursement made it worth their while to do the work on actual claims. Say you came in for a sticky ignition switch. As they were repairing the switch, they would also "discover" an exhaust leak, or maybe a faulty gizmo dooflotchit. Then they would submit warranty claims for this additional "work" as well.
Things went along merrily until the manufacturer did a warranty audit. You should have seen them scramble then!
Too bad there's not a similar audit program for "extra" customer-pay work that gets discovered to be necessary.
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Brought my 08 in last year out of warranty and the dealer called and got authorization from Kawasaki. The dealer got the parts in (spring and security bolts) but did not want to do the job because it is pretty involved and they don't get reimbursed from Kawasaki enough. I just kept up my routine of WD-40 under that square tab at 9 oclock every few months and told them to forget about it. Sold the bike and got a new 2012 and after several months the new owner forgot about the WD-40 routine, got stuck out on the road and had another dealer do the job for free.
Just so I'm clear, you sprayed the WD-40 under the square tab at the 9 o'clock position and not down the key whole? Or both?
Thanks,
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I would not use wd40.
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I would not use wd40.
Agreed. I'd stick with cleaning and then teflon based lube. Cuts back on the dirt attractant issues.
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I would not use wd40.
+1...
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To start the bike, you first have to push down the ignition key before you can turn the key.
When you push down on the ignition key, to get things going, a little tab on the left (9oclock of the key and ignition switch) goes down and pushes on a 1/8 th inch square rod (plunger). The plunger goes along side the outside of the ignition switch and operates a little separate momentary switch attached under the ignition switch assymbly to start the KIPASS and startup electronics. It is this rod (plunger) that sticks and holds the little switch under the ignition switch on.
If the rod is stuck holding the little switch engaged, the bike does not see the momentary switch being operated and won't start the start-up electronics.
The rod gets dirty and does not slide very well, so cleaning out the dirt and grime is what's needed. I like WD-40 because it is good with the plastic, disolves the grime, the force pushes the contaminets out the bottom and i can get the little red hose under the tab to get to the plunger. I know the WD residue can attract more grime, but it takes a long time and you do get to get rid of the build up that is in there at the time.
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This thread rocks!!!!!!!
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This thread rocks!!!!!!!
+1
'cuz KiPass so rocks (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/rocker.gif) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/avatars/rocker.gif.html)(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/rocker.gif) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/avatars/rocker.gif.html)(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/rocker.gif) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/avatars/rocker.gif.html)(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/rocker.gif) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/avatars/rocker.gif.html)(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/rocker.gif) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/avatars/rocker.gif.html)(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/rocker.gif) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/avatars/rocker.gif.html)
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Pun intended...
There's some good information in this thread so hopefully the OP will get this fixed.
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I would not use wd40.
+3 or 5 or whatever we are up to.
WD40 is a VERY poor choice for precision lubrication of such devices. It attracts dirt and can gum up mechanisms. Far better to use a dry teflon or graphic type lubricant.
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Name, brand, label of product recommended?
I got NOT WD 40 so .... What?
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I've used electronic contact cleaner..
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I've used electronic contact cleaner..
If you use contact cleaner be SURE that it says safe for ALL plastics on the label. Not all are.
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i have used a spray can straw to push in on the switch when cleaning and checking. works great. Most of the time, my key is in the unlocked position, just in case. ;)
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http://www.aerospacelubricants.com/ (http://www.aerospacelubricants.com/)
Good chit...
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haters! :(
Steve, I've been working a theory for a while. Do you agree that the mad pow-ah is mad enough that disparaging remarks might affect karma at a level disproportionate to disparaging remarks about other parts of our beloved bike?
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Steve, I've been working a theory for a while. Do you agree that the mad pow-ah is mad enough that disparaging remarks might affect karma at a level disproportionate to disparaging remarks about other parts of our beloved bike?
^^^because of the awesomeness of the question, can I not agree nor disagree this time (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/iconhammer.gif) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/avatars/iconhammer.gif.html)
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When the wind bends the reed, is it the wind or the reed that is stronger? If a motorcycle falls in the woods, and no one is there trying to start it, can KiPass really be stuck? Can we really know the will of KiPass?
These are the ponderous questions with which we struggle daily. I do not think we can ever know the answers and have no choice other than to put our faith in KiPass and forge ahead.
A KiPass fob in your pocket is like a song in your heart.... an inner light that cannot be extinguished..... a special tranquility that touches all within its range..... and stuff like dat dare.
Brian
Steve, I've been working a theory for a while. Do you agree that the mad pow-ah is mad enough that disparaging remarks might affect karma at a level disproportionate to disparaging remarks about other parts of our beloved bike?
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When I'm home my FOB is ALWAYS in the right pocket of my jeans. When I travel on business I leave the FOB home lest I loose it. But when I reach into my right pocket and the FOB is not there, I feel incomplete. A sort of sadness knowing that I am thousands of miles from my FOB. :'(
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KIPASS didn't fail. A piece of stamped steel and weak spring did. Same components a keyed system use.
Yes... no. KIPASS electronics didn't fail, but its mechanics did. With a regular key it would still work.
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Clean a C14!? (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/lol8.gif) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/avatars/lol8.gif.html)
I'm afraid of this washing the bike thing people speak of. I'm concerned it may cause the saddlebags to fall off. I will never do something so drastic as to remove the protective dirt from my bike.
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When I'm home my FOB is ALWAYS in the right pocket of my jeans. When I travel on business I leave the FOB home lest I loose it.
I have one and only one riding jacket (it is a 3-way convertible). The fob lives in the inner zipped pocket of the jacket and I don't have to think about the fob, ever. It is never misplaced, it is never lost, and I don't have to remember to bring it or have it.
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When the wind bends the reed, is it the wind or the reed that is stronger? If a motorcycle falls in the woods, and no one is there trying to start it, can KiPass really be stuck? Can we really know the will of KiPass?
These are the ponderous questions with which we struggle daily. I do not think we can ever know the answers and have no choice other than to put our faith in KiPass and forge ahead.
A KiPass fob in your pocket is like a song in your heart.... an inner light that cannot be extinguished..... a special tranquility that touches all within its range..... and stuff like dat dare.
Brian
Sigh....
If you use contact cleaner be SURE that it says safe for ALL plastics on the label. Not all are.
Good point. I never checked the label on mine but I could have sprayed it with silicone instead of contact cleaner...either way it still works (he says knocking on wood)..
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I'd be wary of silicone spray too- all the stuff I've seen has some kind of a wax or wax- like base that leaves some terrible pond scum looking stuff behind. It works great.... for about two days and then starts the gumming process.
And sigh back at ya' 'cause this is a KiPass thread and as we all know, a KiPass thread 1) can't be ruined because it is pre- ruined and 2) at least someone, and hopefully many, has to keep up the mysticism that is KiPass in all its glory. ;)
Brian
Sigh....
Good point. I never checked the label on mine but I could have sprayed it with silicone instead of contact cleaner...either way it still works (he says knocking on wood)..
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I doubted KiPass one night, and it about VAPORIZED my arse :o
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/LR/20110421-DSC_0017.jpg) (http://s80.photobucket.com/user/stevewfl/media/LR/20110421-DSC_0017.jpg.html)
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I'd be wary of silicone spray too- all the stuff I've seen has some kind of a wax or wax- like base that leaves some terrible pond scum looking stuff behind. It works great.... for about two days and then starts the gumming process.
And sigh back at ya' 'cause this is a KiPass thread and as we all know, a KiPass thread 1) can't be ruined because it is pre- ruined and 2) at least someone, and hopefully many, has to keep up the mysticism that is KiPass in all its glory. ;)
Brian
Brian is right about those silicone sprays. Please keep the silicone where it belongs.
(http://static.thehollywoodgossip.com/images/gallery/huge-fake-boobs_552x829.jpg)
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^^^^she's looking for a guy with a FOB ;)
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Yep, you simply CANNOT ruin a KiPass thread. No matter how hard one may try....
:rotflmao:
Brian
^^^^she's looking for a guy with a FOB ;)
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I found this on YouTube. Kipass failure Kawasaki Concours 14 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otvC_AlqxUI#ws)
The guy has everything off the front so you can see what's going on.
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Yes I have seen this he does add some interesting twists to the problem.
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Interesting video but it he uses the word "switch" interchangeably with "solenoid". He is attempting to "fix" the solenoid that isn't broken. It is the actual switch on the left side at the 9 o'clock position from the stove knob that is sticking and needs to be fixed with a cleaning and stronger spring.
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Give that man a cheroot!
Yep, the switch that sticks is on the other side of the ignition switch housing and does not look anything like that solenoid. The solenoid he was tinkering with is the one that controls the shot- pin that stops the ignition switch from being turned unless KiPass gives the 'okey dokey' to the bike that it has a valid fob signal. Put another way, the man was addressing a symptom, not the underlying problem.
Brian
Interesting video but it he uses the word "switch" interchangeably with "solenoid". He is attempting to "fix" the solenoid that isn't broken. It is the actual switch on the left side at the 9 o'clock position from the stove knob that is sticking and needs to be fixed with a cleaning and stronger spring.
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So I sprayed the hell out the key area and 9 o'clock switch with an alcohol based contact cleaner. The switch worked for the first time since having the trouble. I went for a short ride and tried the switch about 10 times, so far so good. I hope this will just be a maintenance thing but I have a feeling I haven't seen the last of the kiPass issue.
Thanks for all the help,
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Just promise to not go backwards and buy an FJR ;) ;D
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:yikes: :yikes:
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No surprise kipass failed me again, does anyone have the part number to the new and improved spring.
I either have to fix it or sell it, I refuse to deal with something so unreliable.
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I don't know if there is a replacement part number as it's part of the switch assembly. Might be a new part number for the assembly, though. Why don't you just take it in to a dealer?
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No surprise kipass failed me again, does anyone have the part number to the new and improved spring.
As Brian would say (I think)- technically Kipass did not fail, just a mechanical spring/switch combo. Mostly semantics, though.
I either have to fix it or sell it, I refuse to deal with something so unreliable.
Sell it? It should not be that dramatic; well known issue with the older Gen 1 C14. Any good dealer should be able to fix it for you "permanently" by cleaning it and replacing the spring with the newer version. If you bought the extended warranty, it should even be covered.
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Yeah, kinda' that is what I would say.... The activation switch is not part of KiPass but as others have often pointed out, it is the only path to get to KiPass, and either way the bike is just as stuck. I will say that it is a shame that the system has proven so reliable and the only real fault is the $0.07 worth of switch that is needed to 'wake up the system'. I have not heard of a singular failure of the KiPass system itself, just the activation switch.
Kawasaki seems to be acting pretty reasonably on this issue, even for bikes out of warranty. I have no direct knowledge of this, just going by what others have reported. IMO they should be generous about this issue as it was them who 'stepped in it' in the first place.
And of course there are various work- arounds for the immediate problem of a stuck bike that work to varying degrees. Plenty of info. elsewhere on this and the other forum for the interested person.
Brian
As Brian would say (I think)- technically Kipass did not fail, just a mechanical spring/switch combo. Mostly semantics, though.
Sell it? It should not be that dramatic; well known issue with the older Gen 1 C14. Any good dealer should be able to fix it for you "permanently" by cleaning it and replacing the spring with the newer version. If you bought the extended warranty, it should even be covered.
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Well I continue to struggle with this keypass switch thing. does anyone know of a step by step procedure to replacing the spring?
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Well I continue to struggle with this keypass switch thing. does anyone know of a step by step procedure to replacing the spring?
I only know of the pictorial procedure linked to in post #2 of this thread. It doesn't have every step, but it appears to have the important ones. It seems that you will need to know how to remove the upper triple clamp. It's also been suggested here that you order the security bolts before you start.
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Just flush out the plunger once a year with WD and you will be fine!
I covered this in post # 7. Kawasaki will do this for free for all older bikes through a TSB, although the dealers may be reluctant as it is pretty involved and the reimbursement from Kawasaki is small to the dealers.
The main issue is grime building up in the couple of inches long square plastic plunger to the switch that is located under the ignition switch (making it sticky). On the older bikes, you can barely see the metal tab that pushes against the square plastic plunger at the 10 o'clock position next to the key hole. If your bike will turn on, you will see the plunger up against that tab, if not, you will see the plunger stuck in the square hole held by the grim buildup. This stuck plunger keeps the switch activated and the ecu sees the activated switch as an error when turned on again.
The newer bikes not only have the stronger spring but more importantly have a couple of shields around the square plunger to help keep the grime out.
Am sure if you just clean it out once a year with some WD, you would not have any problems. The stronger spring just helps push against the grime.
As for the security bolts, they will break off when trying to remove them but can just be replaced by regular bolts.
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Yes, replacing the security bolts with new security screws is certainly one option and absolutely the one any reputable dealer would do. But just for consideration, replacing the screws with stock, removable versions is also worth considering just in the odd event someone might have to get in there again somewhere down the road (pun intended). After all, is there really much point to the security screws in the first place? Again, just a different thought for consideration.
Brian
I only know of the pictorial procedure linked to in post #2 of this thread. It doesn't have every step, but it appears to have the important ones. It seems that you will need to know how to remove the upper triple clamp. It's also been suggested here that you order the security bolts before you start.
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The spring Kawasaki uses is not available to us consumers and has no part number. I think the best thing you can do is to replace the stock spring with something of a similar size but higher compression rating.
As an aside, it is too bad they just increased the pressure of the spring that returns the switch anyway. The true 'cure' would be a positive mechanical connection between the key cylinder assembly, including the stove knob key, and the activation switch. That way there would be a visual verification that the system did in fact return- you could see the key bounce back up to full height, as well as a way to exert mechanical force to lift up from the depressed position at any time. Not the best design IMO and not the best way to address the problem once it was exposed.
Not to belabor the point but in the event anyone is interested, I do sell a work- around for a stuck activation switch. It will prevent that problem from stranding the bike and the rider. http://incontrolne.com/incontrol_9_mar_2014_005.htm (http://incontrolne.com/incontrol_9_mar_2014_005.htm)
Brian
Well I continue to struggle with this keypass switch thing. does anyone know of a step by step procedure to replacing the spring?
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Update,
6 weeks ago using the key from the fob I sprayed with WD40 the area where the tab is while activating the switch. I don't want to get into what is the best solution to use, WD40 simply was what was on the shelf. I'm happy to say after countless start ups I haven't had a problem since.
I'm planning another trip in Sept and will spray it again for good measure but feel as long as I consider this a by-monthly maintenance thing, I shouldn't have the problem going forward.
There, I jinxed it.
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The spring Kawasaki uses is not available to us consumers and has no part number. I think the best thing you can do is to replace the stock spring with something of a similar size but higher compression rating.
As an aside, it is too bad they just increased the pressure of the spring that returns the switch anyway. The true 'cure' would be a positive mechanical connection between the key cylinder assembly, including the stove knob key, and the activation switch. That way there would be a visual verification that the system did in fact return- you could see the key bounce back up to full height, as well as a way to exert mechanical force to lift up from the depressed position at any time. Not the best design IMO and not the best way to address the problem once it was exposed.
Not to belabor the point but in the event anyone is interested, I do sell a work- around for a stuck activation switch. It will prevent that problem from stranding the bike and the rider. http://incontrolne.com/incontrol_9_mar_2014_005.htm (http://incontrolne.com/incontrol_9_mar_2014_005.htm)
Brian
A definite must for those distant out of town trips.....love having the security and peace of mind of the work-around
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Thanks. And that is the very reason the bypass exists: it absolutely will work and uses absolutely no chance or 'hope'. The stuff I sell for the C-14 is only there because I was 'fixing' the bike in the first place IMO and am really just passing along the ability to others. So it is really great to hear that it is "working" for you exactly as I intended it to work for me: it simply removes the possibility of the problem for all time and we can simply forget about that whole issue forever.
Brian
A definite must for those distant out of town trips.....love having the security and peace of mind of the work-around
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KIPASS didn't fail. A piece of stamped steel and weak spring did. Same components a keyed system use.
No, not really, a key would still turn and allow the bike to start.
(http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a468/RCRide/Misc%20Images/keytohappiness.jpg)
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Update,
6 weeks ago using the key from the fob I sprayed with WD40 the area where the tab is while activating the switch. I don't want to get into what is the best solution to use, WD40 simply was what was on the shelf. I'm happy to say after countless start ups I haven't had a problem since.
I'm planning another trip in Sept and will spray it again for good measure but feel as long as I consider this a by-monthly maintenance thing, I shouldn't have the problem going forward.
There, I jinxed it.
That isn't the best idea. The WD40 will "fix" it temporarily, but will then allow dirt to stick to it making the problem worse. You are better off cleaning it with something that has no lube.
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P on it?
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P on it?
That might work, just be sure to set it on the hot exhaust to get the full benefit.
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:rotflmao:
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Sure, that may be true but in reality, who would WANT to ride a bike without KiPass?
Remember when the ad said 'A day without orange juice is like a day without sunshine'.? What they really meant is that a day without KiPass isn't worth living....
Brian
No, not really, a key would still turn and allow the bike to start.
(http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a468/RCRide/Misc%20Images/keytohappiness.jpg)
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That isn't the best idea. The WD40 will "fix" it temporarily, but will then allow dirt to stick to it making the problem worse. You are better off cleaning it with something that has no lube.
+1
WD40 is a bad thing to use on locks and such. You don't want wet/sticky lube hanging around in there and building up and gathering gunk. Blech
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WOW! Now I have a mental image I cannot shake. :yikes:
Brian
<snip>
....You don't want wet/sticky lube hanging around in there and building up and gathering gunk. Blech
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WOW! Now I have a mental image I cannot shake. :yikes:
Brian
....but shaking may be the only way to get the gunk off.
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Careful now, someone may start discussing quantum mechanics...
Curious, I always heard that WD40 was designed to be a water displacer for electronic circuits and contacts, not a lube, and wasn't suppose to attract or hold gunk. (Suppose to be good for arthritis, too.)
Here's what The MSDS sheet states as ingredients... does have up to 25% petroleum base oil, though....
Composition/Information on Ingredients for WD40
Ingredient CAS # Weight Percent
Aliphatic Hydrocarbon 64742-47-8 45-50%
Petroleum Base Oil
64742-58-1
64742-53-6
64742-56-9
64742-65-0 total <25%
LVP Aliphatic Hydrocarbon 64742-47-8 12-18%
Carbon Dioxide 124-38-9 2-3%
Non-Hazardous Ingredients Mixture <10%
Found that it can be sprayed on oil stains on concrete, and will remove the oil, and leave no residue behind. Use it for this after O/F changes, cause I'm rather sloppy... tp
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Careful now, someone may start discussing quantum mechanics...
Curious, I always heard that WD40 was designed to be a water displacer for electronic circuits and contacts, not a lube, and wasn't suppose to attract or hold gunk. (Suppose to be good for arthritis, too.)
Here's what The MSDS sheet states as ingredients... does have up to 25% petroleum base oil, though....
Composition/Information on Ingredients for WD40
Ingredient CAS # Weight Percent
Aliphatic Hydrocarbon 64742-47-8 45-50%
Petroleum Base Oil
64742-58-1
64742-53-6
64742-56-9
64742-65-0 total <25%
LVP Aliphatic Hydrocarbon 64742-47-8 12-18%
Carbon Dioxide 124-38-9 2-3%
Non-Hazardous Ingredients Mixture <10%
Found that it can be sprayed on oil stains on concrete, and will remove the oil, and leave no residue behind. Use it for this after O/F changes, cause I'm rather sloppy... tp
But, but, but...
Where does the oil residue go? ;)
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Well, according to QM, things appear and disappear all the time..... in a very random fashion. So I assume the oil disappears.... while you are looking for it.
:rotflmao: :rotflmao:
Brian
But, but, but...
Where does the oil residue go? ;)
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Well, according to QM, things appear and disappear all the time..... in a very random fashion. So I assume the oil disappears.... while you are looking for it.
:rotflmao: :rotflmao:
Brian
Does it actually lose mass or does it phase change into an alternate universe?
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But, but, but...
Where does the oil residue go? ;)
I have wondered that myself, but have been using it for years for oil clean up and there is no "left behind evidence" on the garage floor. I guess it's a bloody miracle. Thanks Brian, I knew that I could count on your QM expertise. tomp ;D ;D
BTW, When I got my 08, the key knob(?) was difficult to remove, so I sprayed the key way with WD40, and it became easy to remove. Have I erred in a major way? Will the system self destruct in the next five seconds, or am I hopefully ok for the next decade??? tp
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Remember when the ad said 'A day without orange juice is like a day without sunshine'.? What they really meant is that a day without KiPass isn't worth living....
Brian
:cannon: :rotflmao:
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I have wondered that myself, but have been using it for years for oil clean up and there is no "left behind evidence" on the garage floor. I guess it's a bloody miracle. Thanks Brian, I knew that I could count on your QM expertise. tomp ;D ;D
BTW, When I got my 08, the key knob(?) was difficult to remove, so I sprayed the key way with WD40, and it became easy to remove. Have I erred in a major way? Will the system self destruct in the next five seconds, or am I hopefully ok for the next decade??? tp
I think it will take more than 5 seconds and you'll be fine until you're not.
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I have wondered that myself, but have been using it for years for oil clean up and there is no "left behind evidence" on the garage floor. I guess it's a bloody miracle. Thanks Brian, I knew that I could count on your QM expertise. tomp ;D ;D
BTW, When I got my 08, the key knob(?) was difficult to remove, so I sprayed the key way with WD40, and it became easy to remove. Have I erred in a major way? Will the system self destruct in the next five seconds, or am I hopefully ok for the next decade??? tp
I have always just used graphite on mine and all the locks work well. Graphite is what is recommended for locks.
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Curious, I always heard that WD40 was designed to be a water displacer for electronic circuits and contacts, not a lube, and wasn't suppose to attract or hold gunk.
WD40 contains oil and anything that is oily in an open environment *will* leave a residue and *will* allow dirt, dust, etc to accumulate. This is not good for very small mechanical pieces like locks. Ask any locksmith what to spray into locks. I would be very surprised if any recommend WD40. They will likely all point you to graphic power or spray, or teflon power or spray.
BTW, When I got my 08, the key knob(?) was difficult to remove, so I sprayed the key way with WD40, and it became easy to remove.
Had you sprayed water, hairspray, alcohol, urine, or motor oil in it, it likely also would have been easy to remove (for a while, anyway). :)
Have I erred in a major way? Will the system self destruct in the next five seconds, or am I hopefully ok for the next decade??? tp
Major error? No. OK for a decade? Like most things, it "depends". How often is the lube used? How much was used during each application? In what exact environment is the lock all the time? How often is the lock used? It is not a case of "your lock will explode or seize in 1 year" but more of a "dry lubricants such as graphite and teflon are designed for delicate mechanical components such as locks and in the long term will perform better, prevent wear better, and have a much lower risk of component failure due to gunk/buildup or wear". There are worse things for locks than WD40... but there are better things too.
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WD-40 is a farce anyway...lol. I keep a small can around for removing the sticky residue left behind when decals and stickers are removed from something...anything. I've never really seen much other use for the stuff.
Actually...I don't really believe in "Penetrating Oils" anyway...at least not how they're advertised. I've been working on some of the worst worn out and rusty junk in the industrial, automotive and motorcycle world for over 20 years now, and I've never seen any brand of penetrating oil actually "penetrate" anything...lol.
If I'm going to lubricate a lock, I use a rust protectant spray....the stuff this fizzes and bubbles. It works. Does it leave a residue? Yup, but the lubrication stays put. I wouldn't worry about dirt so much, unless you're a very dusty environment. I just had to do the key holes for the trunks on both of our cars...both locks were seized.
That's cars though...exposed to heavy salt and road grime for months on end. I can't remember the last time I lubricated a motorcycle lock/tumbler. If I have, it's been a long time. If a C14 ignition key is difficult to remove, I'd check and make sure that it wasn't bent....even bent just a hair, and they'll be tough to move. Lubrication makes them easy to remove again...but it doesn't fix the root cause.
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'I don't really believe in "Penetrating Oils" anyway'
This is one I like...
http://www.kanolabs.com/ (http://www.kanolabs.com/)
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'I don't really believe in "Penetrating Oils" anyway'
This is one I like...
http://www.kanolabs.com/ (http://www.kanolabs.com/)
Well there ya go...I likely don't have access to it up here in Canuckistan...lol.
I really have to rely on what's available at the local shops. Every time I hear about or read online about a product that actually "works", it's not available here...lol. Heck...even Seafoam only arrived a couple years ago, and everybody thinks it's "new"...lol.
Hey, but we have good pills Gary...lol.
I have a few American work associates that travel up here occasionally, and they always stock up on our over the counter Codeine...lol. They say they can't get that stuff so easy back home. Soon as the pick up the rental at the airport, it's off to the pharmacy...lol.
Rem 8)
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:rotflmao: :thumbs:
Here you go... http://www.4gt.ca/kano-laboratories/ (http://www.4gt.ca/kano-laboratories/)
Here's one closer to home.... https://www.motionindustries.com/motion3/jsp/mii/productCatalogSearch.jsp?q=kano (https://www.motionindustries.com/motion3/jsp/mii/productCatalogSearch.jsp?q=kano)
•NS01 - MOTION CANADA
50 AKERLEY BLVD. UNIT 4
DARTMOUTH, NS B3B 1R8
Phone: (902) 468-3231
Fax: (902) 468-2195
dale.mitton@motioncanada.com
•NS02 - MOTION CANADA
77 PARK STREET
NEW GLASGOW, NS B2H 5B7
Phone: (902) 755-3540
Fax: (902) 755-3520
robert.fredericks@motioncanada.com
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Well, according to QM, things appear and disappear all the time..... in a very random fashion. So I assume the oil disappears.... while you are looking for it.
:rotflmao: :rotflmao:
Brian
Does it actually lose mass or does it phase change into an alternate universe?
This reminds me of something...
(http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee46/muddydog_photos/Blog%20Photos/envy_review.jpg)
Careful now, you remember what happened to Jack Black and all the dog doo?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpads8s5mik (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpads8s5mik)