Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => Accessories and modifications - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: rocknrod on August 18, 2014, 09:21:07 AM
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Installed and tested the Rostra cruise control alright and this weekend rode to the summit between Tonopah, NV and Bishop, CA. Everything worked out great until the return trip about 8 miles out of Tonopah the unit quit working. When I returned to the house I changed the oil in the bike (500 mile). Then I checked all wires for tightness and such then conducted a diagnostic as the manual dictates. It worked so I rode it again and everything worked.
Strange. :-\
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Anywhere near Area 51?
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The Rostra loves new oil as well as new blinker fluid. ;)
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Actually after 3+ years and 40,000+ miles my Rostra stopped working last month. Haven't had a chance to check it out yet but maybe I should change the oil. ;D
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All the way back to basics: it is important to remember the Rostra only needs three things to 'work': 1) the actuator's brake light wire must be connected to ground. 2) it must have 12 volt power. and 3) it must see a stream of pulses w/in an acceptable range from somewhere (on the C-14, we use the VSS but it could be ignition pulses or any other electrical pulses really).
Everything else, such as the brake light signal, the clutch signal, the control switch wiring and similar is NOT NEEDED to make the unit function. Those items can prevent it from working but they are not needed to allow it to function. This can be a helpful way to think about it when diagnosing a problem.
Brian
Actually after 3+ years and 40,000+ miles my Rostra stopped working last month. Haven't had a chance to check it out yet but maybe I should change the oil. ;D
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All the way back to basics: it is important to remember the Rostra only needs three things to 'work': 1) the actuator's brake light wire must be connected to ground. 2) it must have 12 volt power. and 3) it must see a stream of pulses w/in an acceptable range from somewhere (on the C-14, we use the VSS but it could be ignition pulses or any other electrical pulses really).
Everything else, such as the brake light signal, the clutch signal, the control switch wiring and similar is NOT NEEDED to make the unit function. Those items can prevent it from working but they are not needed to allow it to function. This can be a helpful way to think about it when diagnosing a problem.
Brian
Thanks Brian! I have no doubt I can find the cause once I get into it. But I don't need it right now and its HOT here in Austin. On a cooler weekend in Sept or Oct I plan to get into the bike for a bunch of maintenance issues. Valve clearance, cam sensor O ring, Rostra and going to replace that @#$% hydraulic CCT with an APE.
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What is "hydraulic CCT with an APE". I am not familiar with these abbreviations and why is it such a pain?
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Everything worked out great until the return trip about 8 miles out of Tonopah the unit quit working.
I haven't had it happen to me lately, but there was a time when if I accelerated to pass someone (manual override of CC with throttle) and then applied brake before it settled back to the set speed that it would go "tilt" and just quit and refuse all attempts at resuscitation. I would have to turn it off and count to 10 (sometimes 30) and then turn it back on to get it to resume working again. Most likely an unrelated coincidence but it seems more stable since I retrofitted a "engaged" LED. There were others that said they had to power off the whole bike to get it to reset. Did you try anything besides the "set resume" button when it quit working on you?
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What is "hydraulic CCT with an APE". I am not familiar with these abbreviations and why is it such a pain?
CCT = Cam Chain Tensioner. Its the reason some C14's sound like a John Deer at start up. It uses oil pressure to properly tension the cam chain and until the pressure is up, the chain slaps against the case. Mine is worse than most and takes at least 10 seconds of nasty rattling before it quiets down. APE makes a manually adjusted CCT for the ZX14 that fits the ZG1400.
http://ape-store.com/shopsite/page6.html (http://ape-store.com/shopsite/page6.html)
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I haven't had it happen to me lately, but there was a time when if I accelerated to pass someone (manual override of CC with throttle) and then applied brake before it settled back to the set speed that it would go "tilt" and just quit and refuse all attempts at resuscitation. I would have to turn it off and count to 10 (sometimes 30) and then turn it back on to get it to resume working again. Most likely an unrelated coincidence but it seems more stable since I retrofitted a "engaged" LED. There were others that said they had to power off the whole bike to get it to reset. Did you try anything besides the "set resume" button when it quit working on you?
I used the power side of the brake light switch, maybe I should change that like (I think) Brian did. He even mentioned that in his write up. I'd have to go back and re-read it.
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I used a relay on the brake light I think. It's been awhile and I can't exactly remember.
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I used a relay on the brake light I think. It's been awhile and I can't exactly remember.
Yes, I have the relay from the brake light working. That's the only way I could get it to go into diagnostic mode. But I think it's the power red (mine is red/brn) from the switch that I have going to the power side of the brake light also. I think, I'd have to look at it again. Where Brian used the Power wire from the auxiliary power pwr/grn on the left side of the fairing for that?
Not hard to change out.
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There has been some confusion between the power wire and the powered wire on the Rostra control pad. The control pad contains a latching switch so that when you turn the unit on, it continues to power the actuator (technical term meaning the black thingy with the cable hanging out of it- that is the actual actuator). If the switch and the brown and brown / red (easy here, I am going by memory) are not wired correctly, you end up with an electrical "one shot" system by mistake. It will work but not quite correctly and not as intended. It is important to get the four wires between the switch and the actuator mated correctly.
Brian
I haven't had it happen to me lately, but there was a time when if I accelerated to pass someone (manual override of CC with throttle) and then applied brake before it settled back to the set speed that it would go "tilt" and just quit and refuse all attempts at resuscitation. I would have to turn it off and count to 10 (sometimes 30) and then turn it back on to get it to resume working again. Most likely an unrelated coincidence but it seems more stable since I retrofitted a "engaged" LED. There were others that said they had to power off the whole bike to get it to reset. Did you try anything besides the "set resume" button when it quit working on you?
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Your choice, it makes no difference where 12 volts is tapped into to power the Rostra as well as to let it 'know' the brake light circuit is powered up. This is a safety feature that I overrode; I just powered both fused wires into 12 volts in the same place on the bike. Rostra recommends powering the 10 amp fused wire into main power but the 4 amp powered wire into the brake light power side of the system; that way, if you, say, open a fuse on the brake system and the brake light relay will no longer work to disengage the Rostra, the Rostra will not engage in the first place- again, it is a safety thing. And not a bad idea to do it the way Rostra suggests (10 amp wire to incoming 12 volt power, 4 amp wire to the brake light power circuit).
But neither way will have any effect on the operation of the system; from the Rostra's point of view, it is all merely 12 volts no matter where it comes from.
Brian
I used the power side of the brake light switch, maybe I should change that like (I think) Brian did. He even mentioned that in his write up. I'd have to go back and re-read it.
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It all works right now. May just be a connection not as secure as I previously imagined.
I don't do soldering very well, so I'm using posi-taps elsewhere and bullet connectors for the ground and power. So that could be the issue right there.
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Posi- Taps are generally quite good if used on the right size wire, etc. Soldering is excellent but only if the soldering quality is high. Remember, a good solder joint is like good sex: hot, wet and shiny. :-) And a bad solder joint is like bad sex: cold, dry and dull. Bullet connectors are the most suspect of all; the general bullet connectors available in the US from places like auto supply stores are TERRIBLE. Decent bullet connectors are fine but should be greased to make sure they do not corrode.
Best of luck with this Rod.
Brian
It all works right now. May just be a connection not as secure as I previously imagined.
I don't do soldering very well, so I'm using posi-taps elsewhere and bullet connectors for the ground and power. So that could be the issue right there.
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I opened the box for the Rostra today and about had a coronary. That thing is huge! Never noticed the scale in the pictures before. No wonder you guys are saying it barely fits. Lol
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I opened the box for the Rostra today and about had a coronary. That thing is huge! Never noticed the scale in the pictures before. No wonder you guys are saying it barely fits. Lol
And I always thought the Rostra was small/compact because it was a nice servo system without a huge vacuum accumulator and actuator.
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And I always thought the Rostra was small/compact because it was a nice servo system without a huge vacuum accumulator and actuator.
+1 It's why I never put an AudioVox on my Valkyrie. The Rostra is a much cleaner install being all electronic.
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http://www.mccruise.com/collections/kawasaki?page=2 (http://www.mccruise.com/collections/kawasaki?page=2)
McCruise just came out with a new compact design.
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http://www.mccruise.com/collections/kawasaki?page=2 (http://www.mccruise.com/collections/kawasaki?page=2)
McCruise just came out with a new compact design.
Sweet! Too bad its so expensive.
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Sweet! Too bad its so expensive.
That is, indeed, sweet. But $1000+ for a cruise control still seems very excessive :(
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The one I bought is now $900.00 plus shipping, If you saw how much STUFF comes in the box...
Well lets say it is well thought out and in talking to them to get the group buy the guy said their was not a great big markup .
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The one I bought is now $900.00 plus shipping, If you saw how much STUFF comes in the box...
Well lets say it is well thought out and in talking to them to get the group buy the guy said their was not a great big markup .
I don't doubt that at $900 they are not getting rich and is probably a good deal. The compact design looks nice. The reason I went with $240 for the Rostra kit is because I knew I could. Brian had already blazed the trail and did an outstanding write up. Gave me the confidence to go for it. Otherwise I would have gone with McCruise or more likely just lived with a throttle lock.
Thank you Brian!
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Brian had already blazed the trail and did an outstanding write up. Gave me the confidence to go for it. Otherwise I would have gone with McCruise or more likely just lived with a throttle lock.
Thank you Brian!
Ditto. :goodpost:
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Aw shucks, thanks fellas.... :-[
The Rostra on the C-14 has become a community project though- lots of people have contributed various ideas and different methods so anyone doing it now has easier access to better information. But back when I installed mine, it did take a bit of time to work out the initial location, wiring and especially, the VSS tie- in 'cause that took a little bit of effort to work out the correct pulse rate as well as whether or not it would work with the stock VSS (which of course, it does).
Brian
I don't doubt that at $900 they are not getting rich and is probably a good deal. The compact design looks nice. The reason I went with $240 for the Rostra kit is because I knew I could. Brian had already blazed the trail and did an outstanding write up. Gave me the confidence to go for it. Otherwise I would have gone with McCruise or more likely just lived with a throttle lock.
Thank you Brian!
Ditto. :goodpost:
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The one I bought is now $900.00 plus shipping, If you saw how much STUFF comes in the box...
Well lets say it is well thought out and in talking to them to get the group buy the guy said their was not a great big markup .
Take pics and post em on a thread since I don't think it's been done yet on here.
Yep Brian has help out a lot of us on here ;)