Hey folks, I have a 2011 C14. Back story. Bled my brakes (front & rear) when I got the bike about 2k miles ago. I pressure bleed without any fancy vacuum tools because it has worked for me in the past and still works. However, I have been upset with a dead spot at the beginning of the rear brake. I just thought it was how it is on this bike with the linked brakes.

Last week, while reading up on the bike, noticed that there's two bleeder valves on the rear brake. I just went and bled the inner (facing the wheel) nipple and sure enough, some dark fluid came out. Brake feel however, hasn't changed. There's still about an inch of empty travel on the brake pedal. Is this how this bike's brakes are? or am I doing something wrong.

Is one of the valves connected to the front brake?

Please don't tell me to buy a brake vacuum thing, I've had horrible luck with those and almost always ended up letting air into the system somehow. Just trying to learn how the braking system works.

Just confirmed that the rear brake caliper is not attached to the front brakes in any way. Clear fluid coming out of the rear caliper now but there's still a dead zone at the beginning of the pedal. Going to try to leave the pedal pressed overnight, see if any air makes its way out.

No "dead" spot on either of the C14's I've owned.  Neither my non-ABS 2008 nor my ABS 2012 had this.  The usual symptom of air in the lines is "sponginess" that is especially noticed as you build pressure and not when you first apply vs. what you're describing.

I think the first thing I'd check is the linkage on the rear master cylinder as well as the brake line itself.

 

I can't comment much about the rear brakes, since I never [manually] use them.  But my understanding is air would normally be sponginess, not usually an engagement gap.

I will examine the rear brakes tomorrow. What I noticed is that "dead spot" disappears if I'm applying the front brakes. It is only noticeable when I want to rear brake only. I'm going to be doing rear brake only all day tomorrow to try to understand how it works. I'll also take a closer look at the pedal and master to see if there's a gap or something in the pedal before it engages. I'll post my findings. Thanks for the replies.

I'm going to be doing rear brake only all day tomorrow to try to understand how it works.

Well, you may be activating only the rear, but as you know, you won't actually be using only the rear   If experimenting, make sure to try both the high-linked and low-linked settings.

Just confirmed that the rear brake caliper is not attached to the front brakes in any way. Snip> 

It is via the ABS unit in both 'directions' like Max says - that's why you notice this: What I noticed is that "dead spot" disappears if I'm applying the front brakes. It is only noticeable when I want to rear brake only.     

https://www.kawasaki.ca/media/mig/2012/concours-14-abs/English/files/assets/downloads/page0007.pdf

It is via the ABS unit in both 'directions' like Max says - that's why you notice this: What I noticed is that "dead spot" disappears if I'm applying the front brakes. It is only noticeable when I want to rear brake only.     

https://www.kawasaki.ca/media/mig/2012/concours-14-abs/English/files/assets/downloads/page0007.pdf

I meant as far as bleeding it goes. I tried pulling the lever in while bleeding the rear, the lever didn't budge. I know that air sometimes gets trapped behind the pistons in the caliper and doesn't come out, especially since this is a hanging caliper. I'm going to push the rear brake pistons in today, forcing any air out. If that doesn't work, I'll adjust the pedal lower so the dead spot is gone, making sure I"m not constantly braking.

There's a good chance what I'm experiencing is spongy brakes until the front kicks in as well. I just went outside and checked it out and I'm pretty sure it's spongy. Going to get all that air out today. Tell me if I'm doing the bleeding wrong.

* Check to see fluid level is above "Low". Refill if necessary.
* Pump the rear brake pedal a couple times and keep it pushed down
* Open the bleeder valve for a second and close it
* Observe fluid moving out
* Repeat

I think you will find that using a vacuum bleeder is a preferred method. These things can be tough to bleed. I bought one from Harbor Freight for very little money and it really made the job of changing the fluid a lot easier.
Wayne

Just tried pushing pistons in, followed by bleeding the rear brake again. No difference. There is still dead spot where there is no braking force at the beginning of the pedal travel. The fluid coming out is clear with no bubbles. Not sure what else to do right now. Also tried adjusting the pedal on the master cylinder. This had no effect either.

Hey folks, I have a 2011 C14. Back story. Bled my brakes (front & rear) when I got the bike about 2k miles ago. I pressure bleed without any fancy vacuum tools because it has worked for me in the past and still works. However, I have been upset with a dead spot at the beginning of the rear brake. I just thought it was how it is on this bike with the linked brakes.

Last week, while reading up on the bike, noticed that there's two bleeder valves on the rear brake. I just went and bled the inner (facing the wheel) nipple and sure enough, some dark fluid came out. Brake feel however, hasn't changed. There's still about an inch of empty travel on the brake pedal. Is this how this bike's brakes are? or am I doing something wrong.

Is one of the valves connected to the front brake?

Please don't tell me to buy a brake vacuum thing, I've had horrible luck with those and almost always ended up letting air into the system somehow. Just trying to learn how the braking system works.

You nailed it in the first post.

You nailed it in the first post.

So that's just how it is? I just came home and ziptied the front brake lever pulled in, put a rod on the rear pedal and propped it open. Going to leave it like this overnight, see if there's any changes. If not I'm caving and buying a pressure vac.

Just bit the bullet and bought a brake bleeder. I do hate the hand pump style so went with the pump with the container. It definitely costs way more but I've used one before and love them.

Look at Speed Bleeders.  They replace the stock bleed screw with one that has a check valve (ball bearing).  Super easy to install and use.  It makes bleeding brakes a breeze on the bike.  They make them for cars & trucks too - check it out.

2 for the front brakes (1 each caliper)
2 for the rear brakes
1 for the clutch
1 for the front master cylinder
1 for the clutch master cylinder

http://www.speedbleeder.com/

You can use the vacuum pump if you want to but you might find that you don't need it if you install Speed Bleeders.

 I had never used the vacuum pump before. Picked a cheap one up at HF. Brakes didn't need bleeding but I changed fluid with it. Barely cracked the bleeder .th He had had a lever that holds it on so I just watched and added fluid. Quick and easy. Cheaper than the speed bleeder too if you use it on more than one vehicle.
Wayne

I don't like the hand pump because the fluid container is dangling and it's just awkward. The pump I got (called a fluid evacuator) sits on the ground and is basically a reservoir to hold the fluid in. Can easily be used to empty out oil pans and other fluid containers. I do intend to only use it for brakes though. And I have 3 bikes = 6 speed bleeders I don't want to pay for. If it works out well, I'll probably start bleeding brakes for friends for $$.

The vacuum pump is nice if not a bit clunky to handle.  The fact that Speed Bleeders turn any brake bleed into a one person job is what I like.  Especially good for automobiles but I love them for my Connie too.  They are a one time purchase that pays off at least twice a year for me.

I tried the speed bleeders once on another bike DL-650, and I could not get them to stop leaking around the threads when trying to bleed the brakes.  Seems like I would barely crack them open to allow fluid to go past the check valve and they would start weeping out or leaking around the base.  I ended up putting the regular bleeders back on and no problems.

I finally have proper brake feel. Having the big mityvac pump (not the hand pump) was the way to go as it drew fluid much faster, getting more air out. Bled that thing maybe 5 times, I'm finally satisfied.

Just curious OK which mity vac did you buy ?
   
MV6830 Vacuum Brake Bleeder?