15,000 mile service and new tires done. Under $1K.

[JoeRau]

I picked up my 2012 last night after the 15000 mile service and new tires.  It was at 14104 miles, but was due for the tires, so it all got done.  Dropped it off last Saturday, picked up Friday evening.  I put it in the other post, but work done at http://riverszzr.webs.com/

Tires- I got just under 9000 miles on the previous PR4 GTs.  The rear was worn to the wear bars in the middle, and had a bit more tread on the sides.  I blame that on my commute through farm country.  This time around I went with the Bridgestone T30 GTs.  190/55 rear.  I was a bit hesitant to go with Bridgestone again after my time on the OEM tires.  My ride home (65 miles) they feel really good.  New tires always do, but much lighter feel.  Maybe that is because they are new, or maybe it is the 55 series rear.  They are very quiet on the road, and hold nice in the corners.  Biggest advantage I found in my short ride was on a concrete road that was milled a few years ago.  The PR4's seemed to follow the groves left in the surface.  The T30's do not follow them at all. 



Now for the service.... 9 valves below minimum spec, the rest where at minimum.  All valves got adjusted.  Exhaust .0085-.009"  Intake .0055".  The air filter was not really bad, but replaced anyway.  Plugs had some carbon deposits on them, and where replaced.  I had the cam position sensor o-ring replaced.  Coolant was changed.  Throttle body sync- #4 was just a bit low, but adjusted up to match.  Loose clamps found (and tightened) on the boots from the air box to the intake, and the intake to the throttle bodies.  Break fluid had some condensation in it, clutch fluid was much worse with some gunk in it.  Both where flushed and filled.  My clutch lever pin was rusty- cleaned and lubed.  Brake pin was dry, but no corrosion.  Throttle cables where lubed. 






Two observations made by the guy working on it-  There is a hint of front brake pulse, so the rotors may be a bit warped.  I didn't feel it, but maybe I am used to it.  The other was a fair amount of carbon deposit on the plugs & valves.  He suggested some Techron run through every few tanks to prevent this. 

Out the door for under $1000.  This was taking advantage of some spring promo specials offered by the guy doing the work. 

[wcgreen]

Is this kind of extended service average for every 15k on this bike?  I was planning to purchase one the end of summer or September.  I had asked on here about dependability, but I should have also asked about service costs.  I have never owned a bike like the Concours 15... only cruisers, and maintenance on my bikes was literally fluids and tires.  I had to replace a clutch, once driving from New Orleans to Seattle and back, but other than tires and fluids, that's it.  If I need to spend 1K every 15 months, then I may need to rethink my plan.

[JoeRau]

The tires where about $300 of that.  The 15,000 mile service includes the valve clearance check/adjustment.  Not terribly expensive for the parts, but very labor intensive. 

[maxtog]

Is this kind of extended service average for every 15k on this bike?

It is what is recommended, but not necessarily what people all follow.

  I was planning to purchase one the end of summer or September.  I had asked on here about dependability, but I should have also asked about service costs.  I have never owned a bike like the Concours 14... only cruisers, and maintenance on my bikes was literally fluids and tires.

A modern, powerful, 16 valve, VVT, inline 4 is a much more complex beast than a typical cruiser.  Wrap it in metal and plastics and there is a lot to disassemble and test and put back together.  Many believe the service internals and recommendations are overly aggressive, although the fact that his valves were out is an indication it was not a waste (but for every story of them being out of spec, we can probably produce several where things were in spec).

If I need to spend 1K every 15 months, then I may need to rethink my plan.

Will you be putting an average of 1K miles on it a month?  But yes, you do have to plan for maintenance costs with any vehicle.  And if you think this is expensive, don't even THINK about a typical BMW bike...  Anyway, perhaps a third of his cost were tires and that is typical for any bike (if you want tires that stick and are safe)

Anyway, you might want to look at the owner's manual section on maintenance 
http://www.kawasaki-techinfo.net/show_pdf.php?manual=OM&pdf_name=99987-1748_EN_2_09.pdf

[wcgreen]

It is what is recommended, but not necessarily what people all follow.

A modern, powerful, 16 valve, VVT, inline 4 is a much more complex beast than a typical cruiser.  Wrap it in metal and plastics and there is a lot to disassemble and test and put back together.  Many believe the service internals and recommendations are overly aggressive, although the fact that his valves were out is an indication it was not a waste (but for every story of them being out of spec, we can probably produce several where things were in spec).

Will you be putting an average of 1K miles on it a month?  But yes, you do have to plan for maintenance costs with any vehicle.  And if you think this is expensive, don't even THINK about a typical BMW bike...  Anyway, perhaps a third of his cost were tires and that is typical for any bike (if you want tires that stick and are safe)

Hey Maxtog! Thanks for that thought out response!  I was curious if this was a normal 15k service or if this was the average.  All your points are well understood.  As I said, I have only owned cruisers... far simpler bikes.  I will be averaging 750-1000 miles a month on the bike in grad school, traveling to see my dad in nursing care and my wife once a month.  I was really interested in something built more for travel with good luggage.  If I were to go with something closer to what I normally rode in the past, it would be a Yamaha Warrior, V-Rod, or another Suzuki M109R.  I do want something that can rack up the miles dependably, but also would prefer something that is considered to have low maintenance costs since loan/paid assistantship bucks will have to pay for such expenses.

Anyway, you might want to look at the owner's manual section on maintenance 
http://www.kawasaki-techinfo.net/show_pdf.php?manual=OM&pdf_name=99987-1748_EN_2_09.pdf

[wcgreen]

It is what is recommended, but not necessarily what people all follow.

A modern, powerful, 16 valve, VVT, inline 4 is a much more complex beast than a typical cruiser.  Wrap it in metal and plastics and there is a lot to disassemble and test and put back together.  Many believe the service internals and recommendations are overly aggressive, although the fact that his valves were out is an indication it was not a waste (but for every story of them being out of spec, we can probably produce several where things were in spec).

Will you be putting an average of 1K miles on it a month?  But yes, you do have to plan for maintenance costs with any vehicle.  And if you think this is expensive, don't even THINK about a typical BMW bike...  Anyway, perhaps a third of his cost were tires and that is typical for any bike (if you want tires that stick and are safe)

Anyway, you might want to look at the owner's manual section on maintenance 
http://www.kawasaki-techinfo.net/show_pdf.php?manual=OM&pdf_name=99987-1748_EN_2_09.pdf

Hey Maxtog! Thanks for that thought out response.  I was just wondering if this was a more aggressive 15k service or closer to the normal average.  As I said, I have only owned cruisers (and dirt bikes), but cruisers only on the road.  I was hoping to go with something that needs far less polishing and chrome maintenance, being that I will be in classes most of the time- and something with good luggage and made for short trips.  Yes, I will be averaging 800-1000 miles a month, commuting and then going to visit my dad in nursing care, and my wife once a month.  My goal was to find something I could rack up the miles on, and it have little effect on the bike.  I should have also stated that I need something that is considered more on the minimal side as far as maintenance... I will likely put 30K while I am in grad school, so anything on top of tires and fluids will have to come out of loans/work assistantship, and need to be kept to a minimum.  If I were to go with the kind of bike I've owned in the past, it would be more in line with a Yamaha Warrior, V-Rod, Suzuki M109R.  Not sure they would run me any less.

[Deziner]

Not really. Tires aren't cheap. I paid $450 for a pair of PR4 GT's, mounted and balanced. That leaves less than $550 for a major service.  At 15k, it's probably good to get the valves adjusted, after that, every 30k or even longer. Plugs, I'd say at least 45k between changes. Air filter, I'd buy a servicable one. Other fluids, search the site for more info. The dealer here gets $395 to do a service to a "cruiser". Not really much difference when it comes down to it. Were you getting full, regularly scheduled services done at the dealer on your other bikes?

[martin_14]

don't know about fuel and maintenance costs in the US, but here in Germany I'm spending quite consistently about the same amount on both, including fluids, tires, valves, etc.
If it's of any help, bike has 60 000 miles and I spent 17 USD on fuel and 19 USD on everything else, every 100 miles. Only thing on top is insurance and road tax. Rear tires every 5000 miles, front every 7000. First valve check at 30 000 miles, 7 were tight, 4 loose, 5 ok. Second valve check is being done next week.

@wcgreen: I remember your thread asking about reliability and such. And I remember your story. I have to say: your idea of getting a C14 seems a bit extreme to me, to say the least. Much cheaper bikes (to buy, insure and run) will do the same. Yes, the Kawa might be the best value among the STs, but I don't think you need an ST to start with. But as you mention, there are a ton of details you're not explaining that might justify your decision. So sorry if I'm jumping to conclusions.

[edit after about 5 comments] I get about 40 mpg in average. 50 when travelling through places that dig deep in your pocket if you over do it (Austria, Finland, Netherlands) and 30 when hitting the Alps and trying to keep up with some old fart on an almost older Diversion 900 (you know who you are)

[maxtog]

don't know about fuel and maintenance costs in the US, but here in Germany I'm spending quite consistently about the same amount on both, including fluids, tires, valves, etc.
If it's of any help, bike has 60 000 miles and I spent 17 USD on fuel and 19 USD on everything else, every 100 miles. Only thing on top is insurance and road tax. Rear tires every 5000 miles, front every 7000. First valve check at 30 000 miles, 7 were tight, 4 loose, 5 ok. Second valve check is being done next week.

It does illustrate something I tell people all the time- performance biking is often not cheaper per mile than using a small car.  Some people seem to think all bikes get like 75 MPG or something crazy.

@wcgreen: I remember your thread asking about reliability and such. And I remember your story. I have to say: your idea of getting a C14 seems a bit extreme to me, to say the least. Much cheaper bikes (to buy, insure and run) will do the same. Yes, the Kawa might be the best value among the STs, but I don't think you need an ST to start with. But as you mention, there are a ton of details you're not explaining that might justify your decision. So sorry if I'm jumping to conclusions.

If one's goal is fuel economy for operational expense, the C14 is rather poor.  At around 42MPG, many small cars now approach that.  It is the nature of being large and powerful (and not very aerodynamic).  Now, my neighbor's 250cc bike gets 78MPG, the insurance is 75% less, the taxes are 80% less, the purchase price was 66% less, and the tires last at least 33% longer.  With 1 cylinder and oil cooled, other maintenance is about 75% less expensive, too.

[VirginiaJim]

Now, my neighbor's 250cc bike gets 78MPG, the insurance is 75% less, the taxes are 80% less, the purchase price was 66% less, and the tires last at least 33% longer.  With 1 cylinder and oil cooled, other maintenance is about 75% less expensive, too.

This is not an option. 

[gPink]

.....says the man with the Prius.....

[JoeRau]

It does illustrate something I tell people all the time- performance biking is often not cheaper per mile than using a small car.  Some people seem to think all bikes get like 75 MPG or something crazy.

If one's goal is fuel economy for operational expense, the C14 is rather poor.  At around 42MPG, many small cars now approach that.  It is the nature of being large and powerful (and not very aerodynamic).  Now, my neighbor's 250cc bike gets 78MPG, the insurance is 75% less, the taxes are 80% less, the purchase price was 66% less, and the tires last at least 33% longer.  With 1 cylinder and oil cooled, other maintenance is about 75% less expensive, too.

Lots of truth here.  We'd all like to deny it, but motorcycles are not all that economical.  Maybe it would be better if I could do without other transportation, but here in MN I do good to ride half the year.  The other half requires a much different vehicle.  My choice is a 4wd truck.  That makes the bike more of a toy. 

Fuel economy is fairly good on the C14.  I average mid 40's, and can break into low 50's if I really ride conservative (under 65 MPH, with non-ethanol fuel, and no wind).   There are much better out there.  My dad has a Honda NT 700V.  He will be consistently in the 50's MPG and break into the 60's occasionally.   Also it likes the cheap gas- 87 octane.  Half the motor, less weight, less fairing, but still a good bike.  Also much cheaper maintenance with screw adjust valves.  Down side- valve service interval is every oil change! 

wcgreen
My advice- Keep the maintenance cost in mind when choosing a bike.  All of them cost money!  The C14 seems to be high in service cost, but more reasonable to purchase.   Other bikes out there may be cheaper to do routine service, but how long before some type of major overhaul is needed?    Good luck in your search. 

[VirginiaJim]

.....says the man with the Prius.....

 

[maxtog]

.....says the man with the Prius.....

LOL!!!

[Riverszzr]

 So I got done working sometime in the wee hours of the morning Friday morning and decided to check my website and I see about two dozen hits linked to the ZGGTR forum, so I knew either Joe or Joel or someone posted up a link. So I decided today to investigate, I even had a nice write up and some pictures ready to throw up.

 Here I find Joe already has some nice pictures up and a nice write up---so I will chop mine apart to just some basic findings of the 5 of these I have worked on this spring.

~ While I know some/many of you are believers in close enough and good enough, and that they don't need this or that for eons.
  I am not, So Joe’s C14 is the 5th one I have seen this spring, 2 of them for the 2nd or third time, but three of them for their initial service with miles ranging from 14k to 19k
 The two that I had previously worked on, all 8 of the intake valves are still exactly where I set them at previously. One of the bikes hasn’t needed those intakes adjusted in nearly 50,000 miles and the other it has been 17,000. They are just sitting right at the .0055” I set them at. However those same two bikes did need the exhausts all adjusted with clearances ranging from .00675” to .008” on the one and .0075”-.00975” on the other C14 with them all being tight - on the edge tight or, loose - on the edge loose-with none in that middle ground.-
 The first time adjustment bikes, well all 16 on all 3 of them, with the latest having 9 of them completely out of spec, but the other 7 were near or at the edge both loose and tight. The others were pretty much the same deal, one had 11 out of spec but the others right on the limit of tight etc….
 I will have to add, Kawasaki definitely listened to the heat complaints, this is the first of the updated newer revised C14’s and all the rubber seals adds some time but is definitely easier to work with that the disintegrating foam blocks.
 This was a 3 year old, but only 1 year since purchased bike- I was a bit surprised at the amount of “yuk” in the clutch master cylinder and even the brake fluids were rather dark… But these are items I tell everyone they should be flushing atleast annually, often times it should be more often. ~ (picture in first post)

 As far as cost of ownership... While the C14 is the most expensive tune labor pricing on my list of bikes serviced, it isn't entirely different than any of the rest of them (the link was attached you can view for yourself) The other remaining services all cost the same or less than any other bike out there and parts is parts. Needing about $200 in parts is a little more than average, but it needs what it needs and the bike will love you back for loving it and taking proper care of it.
 Bikes are not cheap transportation, well perhaps the right bike and only used for transportation- but I think most motorcyclists own their bike for fun and enjoyment and as such they are much cheaper than a boat or snowmobile. So it is about perspective.

[Riverszzr]

 And it could have been worse, one of the earlier entries of the C14 tune ups this year had~

[Riverszzr]

 The fuel pump strainer was replaced
the O-rings for the regulating valve for the VVT on the intake was leaking so replaced
the valve cover gasket was replaced
the steering head bearings were "just" dimpling
not so much yuk like the OP posted, but yuk none the less in the master cylinder
of course valves were adjusted
new plugs-and the stick coils had some rust in the end- so they were cleaned
fork seals were leaking
air filter was plugged
etc
etc
etc

[Riverszzr]

 I will conclude with a thank you to all three; Joel and Joe and (sorry I can't remember the guy from Arcadia's name now)for their patience,  their bikes took longer than normal simply due to my time budgeting and the fact it is spring in MN and everyone wants it all right now, and some of the services are "while you wait" which always eats into these more significant services time....

[JoeRau]

Thanks again Lloyd.  The bike is better than before.  Feels like a bit more power, and smoother than when I dropped it off.  I'm liking the T30's so far.  Just a few hundred miles on them, but they feel really good so far.

[B.D.F.]

I look forward to hearing what you think of those tires, especially coming from PR4's.

It is always difficult to get a decent feel for new tires when changing brands or types; new tires are always great but how much of that is just because they are new and how much is due to the tire brand and type is tough to guesstimate.

Brian

I picked up my 2012 last night after the 15000 mile service and new tires.  It was at 14104 miles, but was due for the tires, so it all got done.  Dropped it off last Saturday, picked up Friday evening.  I put it in the other post, but work done at http://riverszzr.webs.com/

Tires- I got just under 9000 miles on the previous PR4 GTs.  The rear was worn to the wear bars in the middle, and had a bit more tread on the sides.  I blame that on my commute through farm country.  This time around I went with the Bridgestone T30 GTs.  190/55 rear.  I was a bit hesitant to go with Bridgestone again after my time on the OEM tires.  My ride home (65 miles) they feel really good.  New tires always do, but much lighter feel.  Maybe that is because they are new, or maybe it is the 55 series rear.  They are very quiet on the road, and hold nice in the corners.  Biggest advantage I found in my short ride was on a concrete road that was milled a few years ago.  The PR4's seemed to follow the groves left in the surface.  The T30's do not follow them at all. 



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