Passive vs Active Fob Features?

[Dirtiegirtie]

I just bought a 2011 Concours which came with only the Active fob (which I understand also has the passive fob in it). I've read many, MANY threads on the KIPASS system, but 99% of those seem to be, "I lost all my fobs, now what?"

My question: If I were to use the Passive fob, would the system (dash computer) lose some functionality? Would there be a constant flashing warning of some kind saying, "No fob present" or something?

I don't want to shell out the $600+ to get a new active fob and get it programmed if I can spring for a passive for for under $100... IF there is no loss to functionality after the bike is started.

[timdow]

I just went through this as my '12 which came with only the active FOB.  The different between the active and passive FOB is that the active one has a radio transmitter.  If the battery dies in your active FOB, you can hold it up to the ignition and start the bike.  This is the way you have to use the passive FOB.  So there will be no warning light as both the active and passive are FOBs.  I purchased and got a passive FOB programmed, because your are f#%@ed if you lose all of the programmed FOBs.

RTFM applies big time here.  This, and a lot of other good information about the kipass system is in the owners manual.

I just bought a 2011 Concours which came with only the Active fob (which I understand also has the passive fob in it). I've read many, MANY threads on the KIPASS system, but 99% of those seem to be, "I lost all my fobs, now what?"

My question: If I were to use the Passive fob, would the system (dash computer) lose some functionality? Would there be a constant flashing warning of some kind saying, "No fob present" or something?

I don't want to shell out the $600+ to get a new active fob and get it programmed if I can spring for a passive for for under $100... IF there is no loss to functionality after the bike is started.

[Dirtiegirtie]

Thanks, Tim. I understand how the KIPASS system works... I've read countless threads and watched many a youtube video on it. I just wasn't sure if the computer treated the passive fob differently.

Example: My wife's car is keyless. If I start the car and then bring the fob into the house, the car continues to run without issue. BUT the dash continually notifies you that the fob is not present. I wasn't sure if the KIPASS system would do something different... sounds like the answer is, "No difference. Once the bike is started you would have no way of knowing if it was started with an active or passive fob."

Did you get a kawasaki fob of did you get a chip-key programmed? I'm going to get the chip-key "clone" of the passive portion of my active fob. I'm just not sure if I need to go to the locksmith with exactly which chip or key to use or if they'll figure it out... assuming you got a chip-key, do you know what key you started with?

[timdow]

I got a Kawasaki passive FOB.  It was $50, then another $50 to have it programmed/added at the Kawi dealer.

Thanks, Tim. I understand how the KIPASS system works... I've read countless threads and watched many a youtube video on it. I just wasn't sure if the computer treated the passive fob differently.

Example: My wife's car is keyless. If I start the car and then bring the fob into the house, the car continues to run without issue. BUT the dash continually notifies you that the fob is not present. I wasn't sure if the KIPASS system would do something different... sounds like the answer is, "No difference. Once the bike is started you would have no way of knowing if it was started with an active or passive fob."

Did you get a kawasaki fob of did you get a chip-key programmed? I'm going to get the chip-key "clone" of the passive portion of my active fob. I'm just not sure if I need to go to the locksmith with exactly which chip or key to use or if they'll figure it out... assuming you got a chip-key, do you know what key you started with?

[B.D.F.]

An excellent question and yes, KiPass does act differently depending on which fob type (RF or RFID) is used to start the bike. Otherwise, there is no difference in use.

If the bike is started using the RF portion of an active fob, there are three times KiPass will poll the fob to be sure it is w/in range (about 4-5 feet). Once is when passing 20 KPH, another is when the bike is shifted into sixth gear, and the third time..... I cannot remember. 

If the bike is started using the RFID portion of an active fob or a 'credit card' fob, KiPass will not poll looking for a fob at any time after the engine is running. This is because it is expected we will put the RFID fob back into a pocket or such and it will not be present during operation of the bike.

As to the Youtube videos, they can be a great resource but anyone / everyone watching them does have to keep his / her B.S filter in place in the frontal lobes. For example, there is a really excellent video showing why KiPass sometimes gets stuck, duo to a faulty solenoid that pulls a shot- pin out of the way of rotating the ign. switch. Very nicely videoed along with a very precise and clear explanation. The only problem is that the info. is incorrect; the reason his bike not allowing the ign. switch to rotate is a sticking activation switch, the solenoid is merely a symptom. Most of us [do not know] lots and lots of stuff but we often mistake incorrect 'knowing' for real 'knowing'.

Best of luck, it really is a great bike!

BDF

Thanks, Tim. I understand how the KIPASS system works... I've read countless threads and watched many a youtube video on it. I just wasn't sure if the computer treated the passive fob differently.

Example: My wife's car is keyless. If I start the car and then bring the fob into the house, the car continues to run without issue. BUT the dash continually notifies you that the fob is not present. I wasn't sure if the KIPASS system would do something different... sounds like the answer is, "No difference. Once the bike is started you would have no way of knowing if it was started with an active or passive fob."

Did you get a kawasaki fob of did you get a chip-key programmed? I'm going to get the chip-key "clone" of the passive portion of my active fob. I'm just not sure if I need to go to the locksmith with exactly which chip or key to use or if they'll figure it out... assuming you got a chip-key, do you know what key you started with?

[maxtog]

Like BDF pointed out, other than the monitoring of the active fob, there is no difference between running the bike with an active fob vs passive fob (or the passive portion of the active fob).  I just it takes a few more seconds to start the bike using the passive portion.

The Gen 2 only came with 1 active and 1 passive fob.  So I would recommend just buying/programming the much cheaper passive one as a backup (and keep it at home or somewhere safe, separated from the active fob).  Then you would be no worse than most other gen 2 owners   If you are really prone to losing things, you could just buy/program two of the passive ones, since you will likely pay the same (or nearly so) to program 2 additional instead of 1 additional.  So the 3rd would be super cheap.

There are a lot of used C14's being sold now without the 2 fobs, which is unfortunate for the buyers (who usually have no idea how dangerous that is).

[jwh20]

Until you sort this out and get yourself another FOB, I strongly recommend that you remove the Immobilizer chip from the KiPass FOB and store it safely.  It's located in the "thin" end of the FOB just above the indentation where the head of the key fits.  If you open up the FOB you will see a small (and it's pretty small) plastic bit tucked into a slot there.  You can pry it out and that has the RFID chip that will start your bike. 

Be sure to test that it's properly programmed by attempting to start the bike by holding it against the top of the stove knob while pressing the knob.  The bike should unlock and allow you to start it.

Now it may be inconvenient if you lose or damage your KiPass FOB but it will not be catastrophic!

I strongly recommend that you get a "credit card" FOB as a backup which should set you back $100 or so.  IMPORTANT TIP: When a new Immobilizer RFID chip is programmed to the bike ALL of the rest of them must be programmed as well or they will no longer work.  So take it with you when you are getting the new FOB programmed to the bike.  It should not take more than about 15-20 minutes for the dealer to do the programming.  You should NOT have to pay for them to fiddle with their PC or software.  That's on them!

BTW - you might want to contact the previous owner and ask about the 2nd FOB.  All C14s come from Kawi with 2.  But for some reason private sellers and dealers selling used bikes can't keep track of them.

[B.D.F.]

Sideways ON- TOPIC:  A bunch of years ago, my wife bought a Mercury that only had one fob. I made the sale contingent on having two fobs for the car... the salesman called the previous owner and they said yes, they had the other fob and the Mrs. just threw it away as they no longer had the car (matter of days since they sold it to a dealer). Hmmmmm. So the dealer got us a courtesy fob, meaning no key and no distance- it had to be held up to the ignition to start the car. Not desirable but close enough. After buying the car, I found a Chinese source of programmable keys for Fords and ordered one. Got it coded and that worked but then I had a locksmith cut the new key and he missed by just over 0.020" on each step and it would not unlock the ignition. Ended up buying the correct key blank and had someone (Home Depot I think) cut the key to fit the car. So I ended up with a key and fob combo that worked to open / lock the car, open the trunk and so forth and a separate key only to start the car. Worked OK and I did not drive that car very often but every time my wife used my keys to start and move her car she would report "the car is completely dead"......  But of course every light on the dash and three different audible warnings went off when trying to start the car with the 'wrong' key. I fell for it once but only once.

Got stuck one time with a Ford Expedition that only had one key and that was painful enough to make me forever wary.

Brian

Until you sort this out and get yourself another FOB, I strongly recommend that you remove the Immobilizer chip from the KiPass FOB and store it safely.  It's located in the "thin" end of the FOB just above the indentation where the head of the key fits.  If you open up the FOB you will see a small (and it's pretty small) plastic bit tucked into a slot there.  You can pry it out and that has the RFID chip that will start your bike. 

Be sure to test that it's properly programmed by attempting to start the bike by holding it against the top of the stove knob while pressing the knob.  The bike should unlock and allow you to start it.

Now it may be inconvenient if you lose or damage your KiPass FOB but it will not be catastrophic!

I strongly recommend that you get a "credit card" FOB as a backup which should set you back $100 or so.  IMPORTANT TIP: When a new Immobilizer RFID chip is programmed to the bike ALL of the rest of them must be programmed as well or they will no longer work.  So take it with you when you are getting the new FOB programmed to the bike.  It should not take more than about 15-20 minutes for the dealer to do the programming.  You should NOT have to pay for them to fiddle with their PC or software.  That's on them!

BTW - you might want to contact the previous owner and ask about the 2nd FOB.  All C14s come from Kawi with 2.  But for some reason private sellers and dealers selling used bikes can't keep track of them.

[maxtog]

Until you sort this out and get yourself another FOB, I strongly recommend that you remove the Immobilizer chip from the KiPass FOB and store it safely.

Wow- that is an option I never really even considered.  Brilliant!

Of course, it really should only be temporary.  Since if you are on a long ride and your battery dies or the active portion dies for any reason, you are totally screwed when you try to start the bike again away from home   So one should still get another fob ASAP, of course.  And when that happens, make sure to put the passive portion back into the active fob!

[Dirtiegirtie]

UPDATE: There is a local keysmith called "Jerry's Keys" in Worcester, MA. It's about 10 minutes from my house. They were able to read the passive chip in my fob and within 5 minutes I had two fully functioning passive fobs (they put them in the black plastic key ends so I can put them on a keychain) as well as another copy of my physical key for....

...<drum roll>....

... $60 out the door!

I ran out to the bike and tried each one separately with my active fob sitting inside the building... both fobs worked without issue, as long as I placed it UNDER the rectangular protrusion on the North side of the ignition switch.

I am one VERY happy camper.

[maxtog]

UPDATE: There is a local keysmith called "Jerry's Keys" in Worcester, MA. It's about 10 minutes from my house. They were able to read the passive chip in my fob and within 5 minutes I had two fully functioning passive fobs (they put them in the black plastic key ends so I can put them on a keychain) as well as another copy of my physical key for....... $60 out the door!

Wow, that is a good deal!  And now you are safe!

[turbojoe78]

Dirtie,  Was the $60 for 2 additional passive chip keys or 1?

Are they able to cut a key with the passive chip installed in it?

I'm in Norwell and would be interested in getting another passive fob clone for safety.

[Dirtiegirtie]

Joe - the $60 was for two passive fobs and cutting one physical key. They didn't have a blank chip-key that matched up with our keys, unfortunately.

[Rexter]

You can clone the passive chip as many times as you want and have as many passive fobs as you think you need.

[turbojoe78]

Dirtie,  Thanks for the info.  I'll take a ride by sometime and get a couple extra myself sometime.  Joe

[Dirtiegirtie]

I'm mostly posting this as my first attempt to post a picture. But it shows my new set-up, one of the new passive fobs and the physical key. Hopefully this picture shows up.