Author Topic: So after her winter nap I go to start and have nothing. (Read 14007 times)

dl1911 · « **Reply #80 on:** October 03, 2023, 06:35:22 PM »

I wish I could find someone that is very well versed on the systems in these bikes.
I would love to talk to such person to verify the way I think they work.

Michelle · « **Reply #81 on:** October 03, 2023, 10:56:06 PM »

If you're thinking that it works in such a way that it can be bypassed, you are going down the wrong road.
The kipass ecu uses 128 bit encryption and requires the correct code from the fob or the ignition key module. If it doesn't receive that it won't allow the fi ecu to function or the key to turn. The modules have two way communication and if any one part doesn't know the secret handshake none of it will work. That's why you would need a matching set to swap anything. Unless you have access to a KDS.

It's easy for me to say (given that I have all the parts and a KDS), but I'd still change the harness first. Or at least drape it over the bike in such a way that it can all be plugged in. Then you'd know if you have a big job, or a huge one.
The harness goes between the engine and frame in a way that requires partly dropping the motor to pull it through.

dl1911 · « **Reply #82 on:** October 04, 2023, 03:42:18 AM »

Michelle,

I guess saying Im going to try to bypass the imobilizer was the wrong termonology.
What I have currently is battery voltage (red wire) going into the imobilizer. When the key is in the ON position I should have battery voltage (red/white wire) coming out of the imobilizer.
I do not have that voltage to commicate back to the ecu. What I want to do is apply a power source via battery voltage only on that wire to bypass that part of the imobilizer.
All other wires will still be attached so the communication aspect shoukd remain in tact.

At least this is my train of thought. Am I wrong?

Michelle · « **Reply #83 on:** October 04, 2023, 04:40:39 AM »

I'm still struggling with the terminology. Not your fault, even Kawasaki themselves can't get it straight.
Which is the part you are calling the immobiliser?

Tomorrow I will pull the parts out of a box and lay it out so we're both looking at the same thing.

dl1911 · « **Reply #84 on:** October 04, 2023, 07:53:10 AM »

The immobilizer to my understanding is the part attached to the ignition that reads the FOB.

It is attached to the main ignition switch housing with 2 phillips screws. It has a bundle of wires that go into the bottom of it.

dl1911 · « **Reply #85 on:** October 04, 2023, 08:02:24 AM »

Michelle,

This is the part Im calling the immobilizer.

VirginiaJim · « **Reply #86 on:** October 04, 2023, 11:23:04 AM »

5 pages...epic Haroldo...

I feel for you.

Freddy · « **Reply #87 on:** October 04, 2023, 02:29:40 PM »

Quote from: VirginiaJim on October 04, 2023, 11:23:04 AM

5 pages...epic Haroldo...

That could be understood as very hurtful. ha ha

Michelle · « **Reply #88 on:** October 04, 2023, 08:02:32 PM »

Ok. I've laid the wiring harness on the ground and only connected the key switch, the kipass and the speedo cluster.

The red/white wire that comes out of the steering lock (which you called the immobiliser) goes to the instrument cluster and to the kipass ecu. It does indeed contain 12 volts when the key is in the on position.

Freddy · « **Reply #89 on:** October 05, 2023, 12:07:26 AM »

Good job Daisy.

dl1911 · « **Reply #90 on:** October 05, 2023, 04:21:46 AM »

Michelle,

Thank you for that! So would it be safe to assume since I do not have voltage out (red/white) wire that I have an issue with the ignition/immobilizor?

I am going to work on it again tomorrow after work and try getting power to that red/white wire to see if I get any life out of it.

Michelle · « **Reply #91 on:** October 05, 2023, 06:26:53 AM »

At this stage I think powering the red/white wire is a logical step.

Getting back to Freddy's theory that the FI ecu is the problem: I don't have an 08 ecu as I sold it some time back, but the dash will come on with the ecu completely missing. It just says FI error.
The dash also gets some power from somewhere else, as when I plugged it in the needles did their usual sweep. The keyswitch wasn't even connected at the time.

dl1911 · « **Reply #92 on:** October 05, 2023, 08:05:21 AM »

Michelle,

At this point Im not ruling out anything. The FI ECU may in fact be bad. The odd thing is thru this whole thing I have gotten no codes on the display of any kind other than the security light flashing while the motor is cranking.

I dont want to spend money replacing things that may or may not be bad. If I could get the damn bike to communicate something to me as far as what is going on.

I absolutely love this motorcycle but damn it is starting to get very aggravating!

I will report back after tomorrows session of this continuing saga!

Thank you for all the help guys, it is much appreciated!

VirginiaJim · « **Reply #93 on:** October 06, 2023, 06:01:30 AM »

Quote from: Freddy on October 04, 2023, 02:29:40 PM

That could be understood as very hurtful. ha ha

That's why I said the other sentence. Troubleshooting this kind of issue can be stressful for the OP. Of course I wish the best of luck in getting this resolved. Much thanks to you, Michelle and others for helping. You all get a get out of jail free card.

dl1911 · « **Reply #94 on:** October 08, 2023, 02:42:14 PM »

So another update yet no result. In the process of all this testing I have found that one of the CAN wires is not sending a signal to the FI ecu.
First a question,
Can the FI ecu be replaced without KDS flashing? I read somewhere that there was a company remapping them and it was a plug and play type of thing?
I have decided to buy another wiring harness at least. But I think I would like to try Freddys advice and replace the FI ecu before I do that.

Everything is working now except I have no spark. The KiPass is working properly, the fuel pump runs, the motor cranks over, Im getting injector pulse when the motor cranks and it smells a little bit like gas after cranking.

I do not have power to the trigger wires going to the coils and I checked the CAN line that activates those trigger wires and I have nothing there.

So that tells me either I have another broken wire or the FI ecu is not sending a single to fire the coils.

Does my thought process sound right?

Thanks!

dl1911 · « **Reply #95 on:** October 08, 2023, 02:47:42 PM »

Oh and the red security light still blinks during cranking but I have had zero codes on the dash display.

Michelle · « **Reply #96 on:** October 08, 2023, 04:50:04 PM »

The reflashing of the ecu is done with the bike completely functional. KIPASS knows nothing about engine management, only that the FI ECU returns the correct id. Changing the kipass brain, the ignition switch or the FI ecu requires KDS.

Try unplugging the FI ecu and turning on the bike. If that doesn't show an error on the dash, your problem is elsewhere.

dl1911 · « **Reply #97 on:** October 08, 2023, 05:28:07 PM »

Michelle,
So just so I understand correctly. If I was to replace the FI ecu with one from a different bike it WOULD require KDS?

If I unplug the FI ecu and attempt to get a code will it harm anything else?

Many thanks

Michelle · « **Reply #98 on:** October 08, 2023, 05:48:13 PM »

To the first question. Yes. Which is why diagnosis by replacement isn't an option.
To the second. I don't think so.

dl1911 · « **Reply #99 on:** October 08, 2023, 06:29:38 PM »

Michelle,

Is there anyway to bench test these ecu's?

News:

Author Topic: So after her winter nap I go to start and have nothing. (Read 14007 times)